Ceramic Bearings?????

[sILlogger]

bearing on each side, shaft in between the two with a pulley in the middle turning the shaft, putting a load on the bearing and allowing for both of them to be spun.. just a quick idea. critique as necessary

 

[HELSEL]

Thats all you got?
I admitted my miscalculation btw?
BTW whats Dean having for dinner? Your nose is so far up........that you should know.

Thats a good one Benny We all know where your nose has been and still is!!! We have some of the fastest chainsaws in the world. Not to pop your bubble Benny but they are all running ceramic bearings.

Rick

Sorry Benny I forgot you don't like racing saws

 

[chowdozer]

Wouldn't you have to put the bearing under load? An unloaded bearing doesn't have a lot of friction..

Loading the both bearings identically would be a bit more complicated.

 

[ShoerFast]

Loading the both bearings identically would be a bit more complicated.

No, it wouldent, just drive them from a 3rd pully and load them the same.

 

[ShoerFast]

Thats a good one Benny We all know where your nose has been and still is!!! We have some of the fastest chainsaws in the world. Not to pop your bubble Benny but they are all running ceramic bearings.

Rick

Sorry Benny I forgot you don't like racing saws

Now this would be the winner decider, thanks Rick!

 

[Gologit]

Thats a good one Benny We all know where your nose has been and still is!!! We have some of the fastest chainsaws in the world. Not to pop your bubble Benny but they are all running ceramic bearings.

Rick

Sorry Benny I forgot you don't like racing saws

I think that just about says it all.

 

[RiverRat2]

So, you're saying it's noisier? What other relevance can this statement possibly have? After all, you can't hear how fast a saw is cutting without seeing the wood, can you?

Several of you have said you don't care about numbers. So, what relevance does your testimony have to a performance discussion if numbers mean nothing to you? I can imagine I'm cutting wood with my bare hands faster than a saw can run, but without numbers my fancy is just that, a fancy.

Yes its loud and yes its faster,,,than my stock 066's as in plural,,,, we have a total of 9 if them between me my dad and my two brothers on three some times four diffent crews depending on whats going on,,,,, we dont time our cuts with a watch if we get some sawmill timber there may be two or three bucking at the same time,,,,dont need a stop watch or numbers to see whos bustin tha spars up tha fastest,,, the hired hands argue over whos turn it is to run my WHS saw.....

I Dont own a set of ceramics but I do appreciate deans work,,,,I am interested in seeing the out come of this thread because there is a good bit info and BS flying around opcorn: opcorn:

That's about it for me tonight,,,

C'Ya

 

[NWCS]

and tell you to to to take your #'s and p*ss on an electric fence and tell me how much power (in #'s of course) that you gained from it.

sIL: gained about 10K volts, cant walk right and my hair looks all freaky now.. damn you!

 

[aggiewoodbutchr]

Oh, I guess I must reveal that I am a fool* too.

ben, you are a piece of work.




*= Happy Dean customer with one hell of a saw.

 

[bwalker]

So far we got results form the thumb dyno and the ear drum dyno.....
If these bearings are so great why isnt there anything more than unsubstaniated claims proving their worth.
The only dyno data we have suggests the gains where very slight, yet people are claiming a 5-7% increase in cut speed.

 

[bcorradi]

I always thought the main advantage to using them in race saws was because they were rated for a higher rpm. I've had builders tell me how much smoother they were, but that wasn't their main reason for using them. According to them once you reach a certain threshold, stock bearings will start to skate. If this is indeed the case, I can see using them in ????????, but not in woodsaws.

 

[bwalker]

Brad, I know steel ball type bearings will take at least 18,000 RPM as I have seen a engine do it.
I have always heard the main claim in regards to ceramic bearings in a two stroke was the fact that they ran cooler, leading to increased charge density. It seems to me that any slight increase in charge desnity would amount to pole vaulting over a mouse turd in the scheme of things.

 

[klickitatsacket]

just a little tid bit of some of the testing that gets done around here. I do not have to explain it, nor am I willing to tell some about every thing that goes on here. I have access to flow benches and even water brake Dyno's. I also have access to some of the best builders in the nation. Any one is welcome to stop by and visit my shop. You can even hang out and learn. I am more than willing to teach any one.

http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y186/klickitat/?action=view&current=mufflermoddedrun1.flv

BTW, there are those that buy the best they can because they can; then there are those that are just jealous.

 

[manual]

BTW, there are those that buy the best they can because they can; then there are those that are just jealous.

There are also those, that can't afford to, but are intersted in new innovations.

 

[aggiewoodbutchr]

just a little tid bit of some of the testing that gets done around here. I do not have to explain it, nor am I willing to tell some about every thing that goes on here. I have access to flow benches and even water brake Dyno's. I also have access to some of the best builders in the nation. Any one is welcome to stop by and visit my shop. You can even hang out and learn. I am more than willing to teach any one.

http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y186/klickitat/?action=view&current=mufflermoddedrun1.flv

BTW, there are those that buy the best they can because they can; then there are those that are just jealous.

Boy, that saw sure is slow!:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:

 

[Dennis Cahoon]

Anyone have any knowledge on how cermic bearings handle debris? A real issue when you consider how much crap a typical saw ingests.
In the past I have read that they don't handle debris all the well and when the fail the tend to totally fail in a catastrophic way.

Ben, I don't think you're a good candidate for these ceramic bearings. Your saws seem to ingest a lot of crap!.....Hahahahahaha!

 

[chowdozer]

Boy, that saw sure is slow!:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:

The purpose of that video was not to show cut speed. That camera is capable of some very fast frame rates. It was set on 60 fps when that video was shot which means when you export the digital imagery to avi you're watching it at 1/2 speed because the avi conversion makes an assumption video doesn't run faster than 30 fps, or ntsc video frame rates. Deceiving if you're thinking speed, but more importantly at 60 fps there's alot of data there. I can't think of a valid reason to throw away data so the video shows in real time. Use a visual video camera if you want to watch cut speed. An unscrupulous person could have cut the frame rate back to 12 fps and it would have zipped through that log almost 3X faster than actual, but then they would have thrown away alot of data too. Take your pick.

 

[aggiewoodbutchr]

Umm.. I was making a joke.:jester: I realize it was high speed video.

 

[ShoerFast]

So far we got results form the thumb dyno and the ear drum dyno.....
If these bearings are so great why isnt there anything more than unsubstaniated claims proving their worth.
The only dyno data we have suggests the gains where very slight, yet people are claiming a 5-7% increase in cut speed.

Now your drawing straws!

Your cowering, first off, who has a good dyno? there are very few, and wont tell you what a good ol consistent cutting log like a solid Douglas Fir could tell you.

Second off, you have been here long enough to know who has reputable saw esperance, chewing at Dean sort of suggest that your cheese has slipped off your cracker?

Try telling Rick to take them ceramic bearing back out cause you say so.

Try convincing even your self, as I'm not convinced that you are that ceramics are not better.

You waver between the cost, and lack of proof, bottom line, there like Dean said, there not for everyone.

But for a BTW, BTW, if I were to just treat myself to something very nice, something I would be very proud to own / use, it would have Dean build me one h311 of a woods ported 361,,,,,with ceramic bearings! And at the end of the day, I would never doubt that I could have done more work!

Since you so asinine about this, I will also give you another BTW, BTW, I am a very happy customer of Deans, every transaction I ever had with Dean was extremely favorable, I will vouch for his caricature, if he says 5-7%, I have no reason the think for a second that that is what he truly believes the gains to be! Put to a true accurate test, from knowing Dean, he is maybe a little conservative on what he really thinks.

 

[rxe]

I hesitate to enter such a hotly debated thread...but....here goes...

I assume that the main determinant of cut speed is chain speed. Regardless of the power of the motor, if a chain moves at 20 m/sec it will cut at a certain rate. All the motor has to do is keep it running at 20 m/sec (or whatever). The user can bear down harder on the chain, and I'd guess it would take marginally bigger bites, but if the speed drops off, then it would start going a lot slower.

So if the bearings allow the saw to spin faster, even if it doesn't develop a lot more power, then it will cut faster than the raw power gains would lead you to believe. This might explain the difference in power gain to cut speed - and partially explain the apparent dissipation of several hundred watts in the normal bearings.

I think that what we are mainly doing with modifications is shifting the usable power band higher up the rev range - trying to make the chain move faster while having enough power to drive it at the faster speed. For a given chain and log, having more power without being able to move the chain faster would not help your cut speed.

That's it, I'm off to hide now....opcorn: