298XP questions

[dynodave]

I finally talked my buddy out of his 298XP husky, which he is no longer capable of starting.
I have a few question for the chain saw educated. I am sooo new to this CAD stuff even though I'd bought a new poulan micro XXV in the early 80's. My numerous additions have been very recent.

The areas of interest and research today are:

1. ID of the version of this 298XP. SN is 7020283. Does this # represent 1987?... week or month 02?... manufacture SN 283? very small number??? I'm guessing my saw is from the middle parts book. Any educated guesses or confirmations.

2. Why is it so hard to pull over when I have seen net videos of guys drop starting their 2100's. If I hold it down really hard, I can get it to fire up... but man is it tough to spin over without jerking it clean off the ground. I dont think it is timing...since even with the mag off the compression is obviously the main factor. Ive wondered if the original owner had it hot rodded? I have heard that it is a pulley issue. The starting rope ratio/diameter is 3.3" and goes down to 1.7" min.. what is the pulley size on the 21xx models?

3. Are any saws variable timing i.e. automatic advance? What are the identified differences of the ignitions of this series of saws. Any flywheel with different keyway offsets(timing)?
parts ignition flywheel
4-86 501 83 19-01 501 83 20-01
1-87 501 83 19-01 501 83 20-01
6-87 501 83 19-01 501 83 22-01 all 8500RPM

2100cd 501 67 57-01 1979-12
2101XP 501 83 19-01 501 83 22-01 1987-4 10,000RPM

4. How does the Tillotson HS 136 carb with limiter function? Is the limiter a vacuum activated device that opens like a holley carb power valve but instead it spoils(rich) the fuel metering of the main circuit.

4-86 HS136C
1-87 HS136C
6-87 HS136E 8,500
2101XP HS136E 10,000rpm

5. Is the starter housing of the 2100/2101 metal unlike the plastic one of the 298? Another whole story for later along with pix.....

6. When it does run this 298xp sounds like a funny car compared to my other saws sounding like toyotas.

Sure would be nice to hear from someone who knows these things. :chainsawguy:
Thanks
Dave

 

[mdavlee]

Silver tag or black tag for the id?

The plastic starter gave problems and the 2101 went back to a metal housing. They are just that hard to pull over with good compression.

 

[jockeydeuce]

They are just that hard to pull over with good compression.

There's a bit more to it with the 298....The 298 had a different flywheel and starter arrangement than the 2100 and 2101. It has a two pawl flywheel and the pawls are closer to the center of the flywheel, causing a mechanical disadvantage compared to the 2100 and 2101.....The 298 is an absolute bear to pull over!!!

You can retrofit a 2100 recoil and flywheel though. :msp_thumbup:

 

[mdavlee]

I forgot about the 2 pawl and 3 pawl difference.

 

[ft. churchill]

Sounds like your starter rope might be worn. My 480 was very hard to pull over, the rope was worn and had been shortened. Found out that the rope was not filling the starter pulley groove to capacity. (I was only getting two or three cycles of compression instead of three or four cycles.) Cleaned and lubed everything and replaced a worn plastic bushing (I do not know if the 298 has one but the 2100 does) and now it is much easier to start.
The people you see drop starting the saws are usually doing that with a warmed up saw.

 

[dynodave]

Silver tag or black tag for the id?

The plastic starter gave problems and the 2101 went back to a metal housing. They are just that hard to pull over with good compression.

The tag is rather silver but it turns into a more like a brass like color though probably from the exhaust. I'd guess silver-black lettering.

Yes the starter cover is plastic and unfortunately the saw fell and it got all smashed up. I think I have it fixed with araldite 2015 epoxy, but looks ugly.

Worn rope? no.... good firm rope yes, it fills the pulley very nice single row all the way out to the 3.3" diameter. exactically 4.5 turns.

I don't get it....The dogs closer to the flywheel center causes higher specific loading at the dog but does not affect the hand pulling resistance at the 3.3" diameter/pull start mechanical ratio.

2/3 pawl or diameter should affect durability of the machinery, not ease/difficulty of pulling the engine over.
Is the 21xx series a bigger diameter pulley?

 

[turtle561]

dynodave- here are the pulleys. the 2100 is smaller, a little over 3" dia.

when my friend starts his 298 he puts a 1x4 through the handle and stands on it to stop it from flipping over ! yeah, it's got compression.

 

[dynodave]

298xp starter/flywheel

Awsome turtle561 thanks
data I can use. Now if the rope in the 2100 was fully filling the slot and all the way out to the diameter edge...the pull would be easier. I can understand that.
So if both the (4-87) 2101 and 3rd (last)rev (6-87) 298xp use the same 501 83 22-01 flywheel. Wonder what is the hardware looks like there?????
Thinking my saw may after all be the 2nd rev 1-87.

Is the starter cover in the pix...metal? I see a few busted out grates. I may have my friend CNC a new cover for my 298XP if I can't find a good used one. or may have to eventually do the full 3 dog conversion.

 

[SawTroll]

The saw is from 1987 week 2, and number 283 that week.

The "silver" color of the tag is interesting though, as it really should have been black by 1987. Could the black color be worn off? :confused2:

This model was only made for a few years around 1987/88, and can't be from 1997 (which also would have meant a black tag, and the addition of 1997 on the tag). The main reason the model was short lived was the troublesome starter.....

 

[dynodave]

298 IDseries & date

The saw is from 1987 week 2, and number 283 that week.

The "silver" color of the tag is interesting though, as it really should have been black by 1987. Could the black color be worn off? :confused2:

This model was only made for a few years around 1987/88, and can't be from 1997 (which also would have meant a black tag, and the addition of 1997 on the tag). The main reason the model was short lived was the troublesome starter.....

Thanks SAWTROLL
The saw is actually VERY low hours and was in almost showroom condition. My buddy Ed could not start it, so it has only the original owners time on it.
The silver tag looks new except a bit of goldish exhaust heat/smoke turing it goldish or like brass on the front half. The black letters have clean and crisp edges.

MFG # by week# sounds pretty typical.
The parts list dates I'm sure are by month since there are none of the 298, 2100 or 2101 IPL are over (year)+12 (month).

 

[SawTroll]

Thanks SAWTROLL
The saw is actually VERY low hours and was in almost showroom condition. My buddy Ed could not start it, so it has only the original owners time on it.
The silver tag looks new except a bit of goldish exhaust heat/smoke turing it goldish or like brass on the front half. The black letters have clean and crisp edges.

Something isn't "normal" with that number plate then, and I'd like to see a picture of it. I guess it either is a fluke, at least partly caused by the fact it is a very early 1987 one, made shortly after they should have changed to black - or it is a saw made in Yugoslavia, which doesn't sound likely with that model.....:confused2:

MFG # by week# sounds pretty typical.
The parts list dates I'm sure are by month since there are none of the 298, 2100 or 2101 IPL are over (year)+12 (month).

That's right, they are. :msp_smile:

 

[zogger]

dynodave- here are the pulleys. the 2100 is smaller, a little over 3" dia.


when my friend starts his 298 he puts a 1x4 through the handle and stands on it to stop it from flipping over ! yeah, it's got compression.

I use that stick through the handle technique sometimes. Doesn't hurt my ego one bit to not drop start everything, I prefer either starting on the ground or the hold it scrunched down between your legs method.

I just want a saw to run, the saw doesn't care if it has been macho man started or not.

 

[SawTroll]

I use that stick through the handle technique sometimes. Doesn't hurt my ego one bit to not drop start everything, I prefer either starting on the ground or the hold it scrunched down between your legs method.

I just want a saw to run, the saw doesn't care if it has been macho man started or not.

The most important part is to avoid that the chain hits something, like your leg or the ground....

 

[Tree Feller]

I found out that a guy i work with has a 288XP, so i talked him into letting me take it home and cut with it some over the past few weeks. He never ran the saw and thought it was stuck. But it was just that hard to start! If you got the piston on the right stroke it would start in less than a half pull, but if it wasent right it would rip your fingers off!!! I'm not that big of a guy so starting it was a bear, but when it was running holy cow was it a beast! not sure how the 288Xp stacks up against the 298Xp but i would say they would be designed very similiar?

 

[SawTroll]

I found out that a guy i work with has a 288XP, so i talked him into letting me take it home and cut with it some over the past few weeks. He never ran the saw and thought it was stuck. But it was just that hard to start! If you got the piston on the right stroke it would start in less than a half pull, but if it wasent right it would rip your fingers off!!! I'm not that big of a guy so starting it was a bear, but when it was running holy cow was it a beast! not sure how the 288Xp stacks up against the 298Xp but i would say they would be designed very similiar?

The 288 is a much newer and very different design, even though the model itself wasn't out that much earlier. The 298 is stronger (more power) and 12 cc larger (99 vs. 87). It also is much heavier.

 

[dynodave]

tough pull start

I use that stick through the handle technique sometimes. Doesn't hurt my ego one bit to not drop start everything, I prefer either starting on the ground or the hold it scrunched down between your legs method.

I just want a saw to run, the saw doesn't care if it has been macho man started or not.

I always ground start my saws when cold.....26cc-50cc. But, even though I am right handed and normally pull with the right... I found that with the 298 I absolutely could not crank it over with my right cause I could not hold the saw down with the left. So I tried switching, stand on the bar side holding down with the strong arm and pull with the left and presto I was able to get it fired up several times...until I broke the starter cover.

One of my interests is to see if this saw is just that tough to pull over or if it has been modded. The antivib mounting is very soft and allows the power head to rotate so much and then it want to lift the saw rather than crank over. Now I'm feeling sorry for the 2100 guys with only a 3" pulley

 

[Bill G]

Something isn't "normal" with that number plate then, and I'd like to see a picture of it. I guess it either is a fluke, at least partly caused by the fact it is a very early 1987 one, made shortly after they should have changed to black - or it is a saw made in Yugoslavia, which doesn't sound likely with that model.....:confused2:That's right, they are. :msp_smile:

Well I am not sure if it is abnormal, fluke, or made where the Yugo's were. All I know is I do have a silver tag 298. I am no model expert. I just know it cuts wood.

BillView attachment 234049

 

[SawTroll]

Well I am not sure if it is abnormal, fluke, or made where the Yugo's were. All I know is I do have a silver tag 298. I am no model expert. I just know it cuts wood.

BillView attachment 234049

Nothing odd with that one - it is just like a 1986 week 33 one "should" look! :smile2:

 

[dynodave]

Well I am not sure if it is abnormal, fluke, or made where the Yugo's were. All I know is I do have a silver tag 298. I am no model expert. I just know it cuts wood.

BillView attachment 234049

That is exactly how my silver 298 tag looks...with the print facing the muffler, not outward.

I had asked about the jungle muffler being of any benefit on the 298 and got no real answer...so I've been doing a bit of IPL hunting/research:

HUSKY 56x40 & Rev#

1100CD-73-03 #
1100CD-75-08 #
1100CD-76-11 #
2100CD-76-12 @
2100CD-78-01 @
2100CD-78-09 @
2100CD-79-06 @
2100CD-79-12 @
2100-82-11 %
2100-83-11 %
2100-84-04 %
2100-85-8 %
298XP-86-4 *
298XP-87-1 *
2101-87-4 &
298XP-87-6 *
2101-89-02 &
2101-90-6 &

Mufflers

501 29 47-01 #
501 48 61-01 #@%
501 57 29-01 #@%
503 17 28-01Jungle %& no screen
503 41 69-01 *
503 41 69-02 *
503 53 06-01 *&
503 53 06-02FF *&
503 59 52-01Jungle % screen

So far it looks like the first 2 series of the 298 "engine lump" only differs significantly from the whole 21xx series by the starter mechanism/flywheel and the 3rd series starter is just like the 2101. The 298 handle/tank swap would make it into a 2101 if the starter/flywheel are changed/upgraded on the first 2 series.

I'm getting a 2101 jungle muffler 503 17 28-01 to try out and see if I can wake up the neighborhood.:hmm3grin2orange:

I may be all wrong but it's fun to research.