Ash Beams

[redoak]

Mark L,

Why every 4 feet? If you are building post and beam all the load is transfered to the posts, no need to support an 8x8 between the piers. For my project I centered an anchor bolt in each concrete pier and drilled a hole in the sills to locate them on the pier. I am not worried about the frame going up, just want to keep it on the piers for when I inevitably drive my truck into it. The old timers never secured their sills to the foundation, weight and the internal rigidity of the frame took care of that problem (besides, it wasn't really an option in the late 18th century).

-redoak

 

[Marklambert61]

Beams

Ya I see what you mean my worry is strenth of the wall. If I'm stacking firewood or moving stacks of lumber with forks I'm worry about pushing the walls out.

I planned to butt two 16ft sills to make my 32ft wall so maybe I will just anchor it on the ends and in the middle where the two meet. If I sink a 1/2 threaded rod in the peers I can bolt it down pretty strong.


Mark

 

[slabmaster]

Mark,

I'm building a similar project I want to buils a 24 X 32 shed for milling, Drying and firewood storage...

Just wonder how you plan to anchor the sill beam I haven't figured that out yet. I considered pouring a concrete peer every 4 ft along the sill.

Whats you plan?

Mark

It all depends on the dia. of your sill.Of course you want to support the corner posts.and depending on the sill size you don't want to span too far or you will get deflection of the sill in between.The ideal way is to support the sill all the way down end to end as i'm doing with block foundation and anchors. Mark

 

[slabmaster]

More pictures of more beams

Got out today and milled up 3 more beams. 1 8x8x12 and 2 6x6x9.I was suprised that they had no knots in them much.

 

[slabmaster]

more pics.

I'm starting to get a small pile of beams!I put them all inside.The two large ones were done in the woods.None of these beams have any cracks and are real dry as they have been standind dead for at least 6 YEARS.

 

[slabmaster]

As i did this one,i thought too pretty for a beam.:jawdrop:

 

[redoak]

Great looking beams!

Regarding support of an 8x8 sill, I doubt you'll see any defelction on that ash under 12 feet unless you are planning to park something real heavy on the floor. If you are not hanging joists off the sill then there's no live load at all.

-redoak

 

[slabmaster]

Great looking beams!

Regarding support of an 8x8 sill, I doubt you'll see any defelction on that ash under 12 feet unless you are planning to park something real heavy on the floor. If you are not hanging joists off the sill then there's no live load at all.

-redoak

That's very true.I will be storing some very heavy hardwood in this building which will have a joisted floor on the sills which will be supported well with the block foundation.Ash is easy to bend and i just don't want to take chances with it.I wish i had locust on my properties because of it's stiffness it would be perfect,but i don't have it.What are you setting your timber frame on? And what span?

 

[Brmorgan]

BRmorgan Point taken when I was younger I didn't think about alot of what I do now seems its either wisdom with age or you just really start to pay attention to cause and effect!! Your right though! irishcountry

Yeah, I only say so because when the pine beetle was first noticed 20-25 years ago, it was only in a small patch of pine out west of here. But it happened to be in a Provincial Park, and the government of the day refused to do anything about it because they didn't want to disturb park forests. We don't get the cold winters we used to, and that was the only thing that kept them in check for years. They say it takes a good cold snap below -30C for a couple weeks straight to kill them off. Now, the beetle could quite literally destroy pine forests across the entire continent over the next couple decades. It would've only taken a few million dollars at most to nip it in the bud years ago, and now it's costing everyone hundreds of millions in lost productivity and fire control.

 

[slabmaster]

Yeah, I only say so because when the pine beetle was first noticed 20-25 years ago, it was only in a small patch of pine out west of here. But it happened to be in a Provincial Park, and the government of the day refused to do anything about it because they didn't want to disturb park forests. We don't get the cold winters we used to, and that was the only thing that kept them in check for years. They say it takes a good cold snap below -30C for a couple weeks straight to kill them off. Now, the beetle could quite literally destroy pine forests across the entire continent over the next couple decades. It would've only taken a few million dollars at most to nip it in the bud years ago, and now it's costing everyone hundreds of millions in lost productivity and fire control.

That's sorta what happened here with the ash borer beetle.The gov. didn't stop it early.Now all the ash trees in the country will probably die.And they were responceable for letting it come over here from china because of free trade.Who knows what else is comming next.Free Trade Should never been allowed with countrys that have these harmful pests.All kids of invasive speices have entered our country from trade with others which has endangered our own natural resources.It seems that the very people we trust to run our country are doing us in with these bad policys.Sorry for venting ,but that's just the way i feel about it.

 

[irishcountry]

I second that slabmaster how else could you think of it after you see the consequesnse I know I would also rather not eat out of bowls from china ect. that have lead in the glaze we definately need to get a handle on all this stuff and quick like!! I wished I had all those ash logs those beams are gonna look great I meant to ask a couple of you guys are working on timberframes are you planning on planning those timbers or just sanding out the marks on the inside or neither nor?? Maybe save that nice peice of ash for part of a guitar , Have you ever made a neck out of ash? Great job and thanks for the pics irishcountry

 

[A. Stanton]

Looks nice. I bet you can't buy those at the Home Cheapo.

 

[slabmaster]

Irishcountry,I haven't made a neck out of ash as of yet,however i plan to this winter.It will be laminated for sure as ash bends easy and i don't need a bent neck.As for the beams, they will be left as is.I like the rustic look anyway.They are actully smoother than i like for beams as is. Mark

 

[slabmaster]

Looks nice. I bet you can't buy those at the Home Cheapo.

8x8 would be hard to get,mabey in pine on special order but ash would be almost impossible.Hardwood beams would be real pricey i would think.I can't make as many beams as i can boards per day, so they are very time comsuming to make as well.I still don't know when i'll have what it need to frame it up.I guess it depends on the weather.I only get 2 or 3 beams a day compared to 15 or 20 boards. Mark

 

[irishcountry]

I wondered about that since it is supposed to be a good steam bending wood maybe good for acoustic side though I suppose you could put a peice of Walnut down the middle! Beams look real good like they are I just wondered what would be the quickest way to dress them if you wanted them smooth I guess any planer should handle them?? Thanks again for the pics and all the info don't mean to pester you with guitar buidling stuff when this is about beams!! Thanks irishcountry

 

[slabmaster]

A planer would work to smooth them out for sure if that's what you would want.As far as the guitar,i think ash is one of the best tone woods and plan on doing an acoustic this winter with ash neck,sides,and back,with a sitka spruce top.And don't worry about talking guitars on this thread as they are the main reason i mill in the first place.

 

[woodshop]

I wondered about that since it is supposed to be a good steam bending wood maybe good for acoustic side though I suppose you could put a peice of Walnut down the middle! ...

Ash is a good bending wood, but also good static bending. Many native Indians used ash for bows as it had good qualities of being bent and returned to original shape over and over.

 

[irishcountry]

woodshop Good to know!! I have some stacked and some I still gotta get to can't wait to use it!! Thanks

 

[redoak]

Slabmaster: The barn is real simple (so I don't screw it up!). 20x20, 9 posts, 10' between the posts. All the posts and beams are 8x8, braces are 4x6, principal rafters are 8x8 tapers to 6x6. Joists will be 6-8" deep, purlins 4-6" deep.

Just for yucks I ran the deflection numbers on an 8x8 ash beam. Looks like the beam will only give about 1/2" at 20'! Course that's just the dead load of its own weight.

I've got my sills supported under the posts with a concrete pier. With a 10' span they will carry a serious load... I'll run the number on the floor system to see what it will carry. I suspect the joists would give out before the beams.


I think Irish asked about planning? I've seen that done on an oak frame, very beautiful, but a bit too refined for my tastes (and probably for my talents as a finish carpenter). The barn will definitely not be getting that treatment. When I frame the house I might mess with them a bit, at least to keep the spliter factor down. I've seen some really nice work on old mill buildings where they use dry ice grit blasting ont he old beams. Wonder how much that costs $$$?

-redoak

 

[slabmaster]

Wow! Never heard of dry ice blasting.That would hard to recycle I have heard that walnut shell works nice.Your posts are big for that size building!My building will have 8x8 corner posts,but inbetween will be 6x6.They will be 8FT. apart except the doorway area.Mine will also be 20FT> wide And 40 long if i can mill enough beams for that length.So i will have to scarf join the sills.That's the main reason for the foundation.I'm hopeing i can find some white oak for the sills as it is more rot-resistant than ash.Sounds like you are building a strong building there.