Baileys LP chain broke on first day!

[madrone]

Today I put the lp chain on the 361 and cut one board. The chain loosened often and I had to pause alot to keep it from snapping again. The board was loaded with grooves.
I took it to the shop and took off the chain cover and moved the chain by hand. There is some resistance of the chain in the 3/8 7t sprocket. It fits but doesn't fit perfectly. This is the used sprocket on my 361 not the new one on the 660 (non-compatible). It's the new one that caused the wear in your photo Bob but i'm sure its similar to this one. All I can come up with is the chain doesn't like my 3/8 7t sprockets, new or used.

The bar ideas mentioned above are good but its a stihl 3003 000 8921 20" with a fixed tip and decent rails. On the side it says 3/8 .50. All my other chains run fine with this combo.

Am I the only one that has resistance with the LP chain on this size sprocket?
I can't come up with anything else and baileys has the regular rip chain on backorder so my project is relying on my backup 20" rip chain and the 3 .404 36" that I have (which are a bit large for 2x8's)

I know this is a long post and if you are still reading this I thank you for all your help. I'm running out of options with this chain.
-Mark

 

[glennschumann]

I had a craftsman 14" 36cc that I found on the curb some time ago. It had a new bar on it when I found it, but the clutch drum was worn where the chain ran on the sprocket teeth. Turns out that the new bar and chain was a LP set up, and the previous chain / bar was not. The new bar was a tiny bit thinner, and that put the chain just a tiny bit closer to the engine, and it didn't want to run in the same groove in the sprocket that had been worn in from the previous set up. No matter what I did with the tension, it was either loose, or too tight... when loose it was running on an unworn part of the teeth, and when tight, it fell in the worn groove. Long story short, the misalignment of the chain due to the wear from the old set up caused the chain to catch on the bar where the chain entered the grooves. Slight as it was you could feel it running the chain around by hand, and I could never set a properly tightened chain. If something like this is causing a misalignment in your set up, that may be the issue for you. One other thought... did your bar get dropped at any point, maybe bending the heel of the bar where the chain enters? Not that I ever did such a thing and never told my father when I was young...

 

[madrone]

Ha, you're still feeling some guilt there it seems. Well helpin me out will be almost be like fessing up to your dad. Thanks for the input.

My thoughts since i've slept on it is that the chain is now stretched so much that it no longer fits the 3/8 sprocket on the 361 which is used anyway.
I'm gonna go pick up another sprocket and see if that helps.
As far as the original damage on the chain from the 660. From what you guys have suggested, most likely the chain fit well on the new sprocket to begin with but the over power on the saw torqued it and stretched it so much that it damaged the Drivelinks and snapped the chain.
If the chain still turns roughly on the new sprocket, I'll have to scrap the chain.
-Mark

 

[TedChristiansen]

Oh, in addition, it turns out the Granberg mini mill I bought is defective. The guide on the mill that runs on the V rail is not perfectly parallel with the guide rail that slides on the board. Seems to be some warpage on the rail that leaves about 1/4 inch rocking and makes it hard to make a perfectly straight cut. I talked with baileys and they are going to replace it. I doubt this affected the chain breaking.

This misalignment could have been the cause. I had this problem on with my Logosol Woodworkers Mill and Husky 385XP. It turns out that the mill was not the problem, rather it was the as-cast clutch cover. The outer as-cast surface of the clutch cover was not parallel to the inner machined surface. When the extender nuts were installed that drove the bar out of parallel with the guide rail, putting it in an angle of attack, i.e. the leading edge of the bar was lower than the trailing edge. This caused the unsupported end of the bar to dip as the cut progressed down the log, basically curving the bar. I broke a couple of chains this way until I figured out the problem and shimmed the sled to compensate for the clutch cover. The mill works great now and I have not broken any chains since.

Regards,

Ted

 

[BlueRider]

My thoughts since i've slept on it is that the chain is now stretched so much that it no longer fits the 3/8 sprocket on the 361 which is used anyway.
I'm gonna go pick up another sprocket and see if that helps.
As far as the original damage on the chain from the 660. From what you guys have suggested, most likely the chain fit well on the new sprocket to begin with but the over power on the saw torqued it and stretched it so much that it damaged the Drivelinks and snapped the chain.
If the chain still turns roughly on the new sprocket, I'll have to scrap the chain.
-Mark

This was my thouth for what likely caused the wear that Bob pointed out. The pic of your chain shows an exremely elongated rivit hole on the frivelink that broke. from your description it sounds like all the drive links are likely elongated and thus you no longer have a .375 pitch chain. it is likely closer to .390 and that is just enough to cause a bit of wear going throung the sprocket.

If the chain is streatched to the point that all the drive links look similar I would seriusly consider scrappng the chain. Particularly since your 361 is still streatching the chain.

If Bailey's dosent have 3/8 rip in stock yiou could always get regular chain and regrind the angles over time as you use it. or even all at once if you really need a better surface. Iv'e done this and its not as hard or time consuming as it sounds.

 

[Brmorgan]

I just have a hard idea BELIEVING (see below) it's because of too much torque from the 660. As I've said I've cut hundreds of BF of Douglas Fir on my Oregon LP with a regular sprocket and an old, half-worn-out 25" bar, and 8-pin sprocket. Nor have I had a problem with it stretching and having to re-tighten often. Maybe the 8-pin's slight torque disadvantage and/or larger diameter is saving me? Or is the Oregon a bit stronger?

 

[BobL]

I just have a hard idea it's because of too much torque from the 660.

I think you mean. . . "I just have a hard idea believing it's because of too much torque from the 660."

 

[Brmorgan]

I think you mean. . . "I just have a hard idea believing it's because of too much torque from the 660."

Hahahaha... Got me there. (puts down the pipe...:monkey That's what late-night posting gets me after a long day.

 

[madrone]

Here are some photos of the doug fir 2x8's I milled after breaking the baileys lp chain (which I've abandoned all hope on).
I took an old and free RSM3 chain, ground off the safety humps, and sharpened by hand to 10º tops and about 70º side. The rakers are about .030 or so. There wasn't much left on the chain so the kerf is fairly narrow.
I put this on the 660 and never had a problem with stretching or bogging down the saw.
Each 20' cut took about 3-5 min. and about 1/3 tank of mix. I riched up the H jet to about 12,000 rpms.

Asides from the rain and snow falling on me, I had a good old time milling up this log and got a start on the barn rebuild. You can see from the photo's that I have alot of work left ahead of me.

I think that rather than getting another carlton chain from baileys, I'll buy a new RSC square loop and have my dealer grind it to 10º.
Any suggestions on side plate angle and cutting angle? I'd rather cut fairly fast rather than having super smooth boards.
Thanks for all the input folks. After todays boards, I have regained some hope that I can actually pull this off.
-Mark

 

[Brmorgan]

Will Malloff uses a 40° hook angle, but he also uses a 0° top plate angle so I don't know how that would affect things compared to yours.