Had to quit first logging job after fitting in perfectly. How should I proceed?

[treeslayer2003]

wbf, do u use round or square? i am undecided on witch i think is faster.......

 

[Westboastfaller]

wbf, do u use round or square? i am undecided on witch i think is faster.......

I personally use .063 round chisel, square has definitely got its advantages in CLEAN wood, said to be about 5 - 7% quicker
A box of tri files or double bevel files here are over a hundreds bucks a box and have been for a long time, its time consuming to file, So many learn to grind, I doubt they would want to learn to hand file square in BC, I'm definitely no expert
either but have put some time and money in.
Round works good in the softwoods but its a little rough for the light bars in longer lengths. I'm a really good consistent round filer as for many younger guys its easier to learn to grind, use a Stihl light bar and" bobs your uncle".
Its a lot easier cleaning out your undercuts as it will bite in anywhere but if I come up short with round I have to pivot back on the dogs and
take another half moon.
I wouldn't mind grinding and running a light soon
Its going to be all about how clean your wood is for you, I know you guys cut low to the ground.

 

[rwoods]

boys, i bet no one in Matt's area knows any thing about directional falling.

Not to derail this thread, but the above is worth noting. I have kept quite about this issue for some time now since I am not a logger and haven't been close to logging in many many years.

Growing up in the rural south, almost any person who lived off the land logged at some point or another. To my knowledge in those times there was no formal training offered, and for most there was almost no use of safety equipment (no eye, ear, head or cut protection) and no workers compensation. Men just worked hard and put trees on the ground. Trees fell where they fell. Skidders - what's a skidder? An old farm tractor or crawler, a truck and a jig to load the truck. Got these three and a saw = logger. Face cuts? Many just used a single cut on tall slender pines. TS called that stump jumping. I didn't know the name but I know the practice. I believe this is where the "farmer cut" came in to play here as it was thought to be safer. Bow saws were common. Who knows how many trees were felled using a bow instead of swapping on a bar. Many were maimed or killed. Product liability suits in the 80s due to dismemberment and decapitation drove the switch to chain brakes and the demise of the bow. So what as that was years ago - many present loggers are carrying on just like dad, grandpa and great grandpa did except they have a more modern saw, a skidder or some other piece of true logging equipment and some safety gear - they do not have the same skill set or mind set as a trained faller. Nor do some have workers compensation. Out West it seems to be different - in a better way.

Matt, this is why you are being directed to listen to the West coast folks when it comes to falling techniques. And sadly, West coast folks, this is why sometimes that Non-West coast poster you think has never cut a tree claims that he or his daddy is a "logger" may actually be telling the truth.

And before any of my neighbors get their feathers ruffled let me state that there are knowledgeable and skilled loggers around here. They all know the type I described.

Ron

 

[066blaster]

The owner shouldn't allow drinking on the job. It's a dangerous profession to begin with. When I was young I dealt with that stuff quite a bit. Worked part time for a farmer who would drink a case a day and run the big tractors. His biggest problem is he would get grouchy as heck. And start throwing hammers and stuff. Seen him stick a pitch fork in the side of a cow for stepping on his foot. I always felt bad for his wife. Nobody would dare say a word about his behavior though.

 

[rwoods]

The owner shouldn't allow drinking on the job. It's a dangerous profession to begin with. When I was young I dealt with that stuff quite a bit. Worked part time for a farmer who would drink a case a day and run the big tractors. His biggest problem is he would get grouchy as heck. And start throwing hammers and stuff. Seen him stick a pitch fork in the side of a cow for stepping on his foot. I always felt bad for his wife. Nobody would dare say a word about his behavior though.

Are you talking about my dad? He didn't drink while raising his family but he did throw things at the livestock. Our tractors and our truck all had heavy metal tool boxes on the side with hammers, crescents, nuts, bolts, etc. I still vividly recall when an old bull head butted the pickup as we were trying to herd it to the pen. Pop got out, reached into the box, grabbed a two pound ball peen hammer and a carpenter hammer, one in each hand, clobber the old bull from 15 feet, hit him with the other hammer as soon as he was in position to retrieve the first, and repeated this sequence for a good 50 yards until the old bull got the point and moved with the herd. An 18" crescent works too. The old metal barreled Hotshots worked pretty well in the chute but more than one was bent too badly to remove the batteries after smacking an obstinate critter in the head.

Ron

 

[066blaster]

The cows always got him back. They would lean over and pin him between them and the stantions. Or step on his foot good enough it would crush his steel toes down and he couldn't get his boots off. He would throw the hammers then 10 seconds later say go get me a hammer. He just threw them blindly.

 

[rwoods]

Quick follow up on herding technique - don't try this at home but if you must you aim for the neck (or head if the neck isn't available) not the rear. The critical point is to keep the critter's head pointed in the right direction and not pointed at you. Ron

 

[treeslayer2003]

naw Ron, he was speaking as to the OPs original problem lol.
now what you just said was well said, and describes me to a T..........after generations in this b'ness, i am the first i believe to use true directional falling.
and that is largely due to the fine folks here.
oh, and if i have missed thanking any who have helped me along.....thanks! [where is owl]

 

[matthew sparks]

yeah there are three generations on the log site I was just on. None of them can hear. The grandson has been in the woods since he was 7. Hardly any of them know the meaning of the word safety. Surprisingly the youngest who is 23 is the most aware of safety issues, even though they aren't used

 

[treeslayer2003]

well, alot of safety in the woods is awareness...........while i get what your saying, don't discount good sense.

 

[matthew sparks]

I'm already past the original post and ready to move on with life. Funny you mentioned the tractor instead of a skidder. I skidded 40' logs last summer alone with a John Deere tractor and an 800lb weight on the front.

 

[HuskStihl]

My observations to this point.
1) Bitzer remains the man, even tho he's still a kid
2) Bob (real bob) is correct as always, and my statements are not based out of 50 years on the saw
3) westboast (I really hate that name, sorry),treeslayer, and silver are helping where they can.
4) the OP is not ready for a solo show. I understand (and can occasionally execute) everything that has been said so far, and I'm not ready for a solo show. If TS or the Bitz would take me under a wing for 6 months, maybe.

 

[treeslayer2003]

IDK Jon,,,,,,,,,,,,,ol Matt may be sand baggin a lil lol..........any man pulled timber with a tractor for long has been around the woods a bit. i have skidded with every thing but a horse...............

 

[matthew sparks]

I cut down a bunch of pine trees to build log cabins. I probably pinched my saw 50 times on 400 trees. That is how I had the equipment to go logging for a company. I was in a wooded area that was thin and flat. I just did a normal notch and sawed from the back. I had one land on the stump. All the other trees fell on a dime. I guess I got lucky. I had to keep a 400.00 saw from lowes with me to get all the pinches out. I did buy a wedge at harbor freight but I guess I didnt ever put it in far enough. my bar got hund a lot. This summer was my first time working for anyone else or cutting hardwoods

 

[treeslayer2003]

sounds like reading a tree is where ya need to work on it..........but the wedge will work once ya get the hang of it.

 

[matthew sparks]

well i got better before I was done with the pines. I was scared to use my tip on limbs, etc., I finally figured out what I needed to get by but would still hate to be logging alone without an extra bar or saw

 

[HuskStihl]

Ya, I'm probably putting a foot in my mouth again. I'm just used to the F&L boys pretty much knowing everything, but everybody has to start somewhere. As I've said, I'm pullin for ya. U'r dropping pines on dimes, and I'm putting them on fences/sheds/etc, so I've got no authority on this matter! Just think your way thru every situation, and if it's not adding up, don't do it.

 

[matthew sparks]

I guess my biggest thing is when things go wrong someday. It always will. I don't believe anyone is good enough to put a tree on a dime every time. The other day I was cutting a tree and after boring it and doing the angled back cut so it would break off. I was in a creek and almost shoulder deep and scared. When I cut the 28" red oak went right where it should but then the tree proceeded to back up into the creek about 3 feet after it fell. I was 10 ft back by the time it did this but I saw how fast that huge log was coming at me even though it was on the ground. I assume a limb or vine got hit or caught as it fell to the ground but it scared me. BAD! Only thing I have had happen. What I worry about is one falling so fast or kicking back the whole tree at a speed I can't get out of the way of.

All of this has probably happened to all the experienced cutters here but it hasn't to me. I am more scared of what the tree will do when I don't do something right. Working with someone else won't really teach me that around here. They just all stay away from anyone falling trees and if they don't hear your saw after a while they yell to make sure your okay so I don't really know how to prepare myself for something like that.

Additionally, we have seven pages here of discussion. Some was just conversation and most of it has been very thought out, helpful advice. I appreciate this more than you all realize

 

[MountainHigh]

Matthew ... these links might be helpful to you:

BC Faller Training
http://www2.worksafebc.com/Publications/Multimedia/Videos.asp?ReportID=36885

Some info into how professional logging companies are expected to work:
BC Faller Training Standard - Field Examination & Evaluation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5t7e0FYdmw

 

[Westboastfaller]

Ya, I'm probably putting a foot in my mouth again. I'm just used to the F&L boys pretty much knowing everything, but everybody has to start somewhere. As I've said, I'm pullin for ya. U'r dropping pines on dimes, and I'm putting them on fences/sheds/etc, so I've got no authority on this matter! Just think your way thru every situation, and if it's not adding up, don't do it.

That's it, 'as we like to say' ( do) "plan the work and work the plan"