Here we go again.....Outdoor wood burners raise a stink!

[Tesen]

From the local fishwrap in Canton, Ohio (I live in Massillon).

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?ID=441643&categoryID=9

While there are some OWB owners that burn rubbish, junk wood and cause issues, the city of Canton is effectively going to ban new OWB installations. Since I use an indoor wood furnace this does not effect me or the city I live in (not far from Canton) but what is next? Ban on all wood burning devices?

Tes

 

[beerman6]

Looks a bit congested for an OWB.

It is exactly this kind of irresponsible wood burning that is leading to the OWB restrictions we are seeing across the country.

:agree2:

 

[habanero]

I'd have to disagree with Mr. Engel's statement about OWB smoke being no worse than an indoor stove. My stove smokes for about 5 minutes when I first light it and that's about it. Maybe a minute or two when loading if it's burnt down, but no more. Also, that smoke is coming out 20+ feet in the air. The neighbor's OWB, on the other hand, smokes about 25% (or more) of the time in the spring and fall and the smoke comes out ~7 ft off the ground. If I lived 20 feet from his boiler, I'd be complaining too.

 

[Tesen]

Most of the issues are the bad OWB owners, which is a shame. I think the City is overreacting by their limits. This individual's stack height I believe needs to be higher; the issue with this is the cooler stack effects the performance of the burner if it is to high.

Also, you can get dispersal devices for the top of your stack; I have an exhaust fan on my wood furnace and sure it smokes a little (very minor and the flue is 39' high ), but as soon as I turn that fan on, you can't tell there is a fire burning.

Banning I think is extreme (which is what this ordinance will do for wannabe OWB owners), but the city assisting with education and usage for the owners as well as some tighter regulations concerning stack exhaust might help. I want the owner to fight the ordinance, some of the rules I disagree with. But you know what? If you are going to burn in the city, you need to take extra precautions.

I don't want to see this turn into a shoot from the hip against wood burning devices ordinance.

Tes

 

[ktm rider]

It sounds to me like this guy is inconsiderate of his neighbors and, in my opinion, full of crap. I have owned OWB's in the past and they do smoke more than fireplaces, atleast during start up. Also, what does this statement mean?

"It's so much more comfortable," Engel said of the heat produced. "The difference in the heat is remarkable, really. It's a comfortable heat."

I guess the water gets up to a different type of 180 deg temp using an OWB compared to heating the water with oil????? 180 is 180 no matter how you heat it...

 

[ropensaddle]

I am glad they ain't complaining around here yet sheesh my odwf goes
from now til feb march and sometimes smokes pretty bad but really
it dissipates before reaching neighbors I hope. I live in the middle of forty
acres and I sometimes burn my paper in it to clean the office so am I a
bad guy? I use paper and pine knot to get her going if it goes out in
warm periods.

 

[Zodiac45]

It sounds to me like this guy is inconsiderate of his neighbors and, in my opinion, full of crap. I have owned OWB's in the past and they do smoke more than fireplaces, atleast during start up. Also, what does this statement mean?

"It's so much more comfortable," Engel said of the heat produced. "The difference in the heat is remarkable, really. It's a comfortable heat."

I guess the water gets up to a different type of 180 deg temp using an OWB compared to heating the water with oil????? 180 is 180 no matter how you heat it...

Yep agree, I can understand difference between an indoor stove (comfy heat) as in winter time everyone hangs right in the kitchen around the old cookstove.

 

[DonB]

I wouldn't want to live in a close neighborhood with a high concentration of woodburners, especially in times of temperature inversion. But then again, I wouldn't want to live in any type of a neighborhood anyway.

 

[CowboyAndy]

I wouldn't want to live in a close neighborhood with a high concentration of woodburners, especially in times of temperature inversion. But then again, I wouldn't want to live in any type of a neighborhood anyway.

The one rule I thought was pretty stupid was WHAT they can burn... only seasoned HARDwood...

 

[blackdogon57]

I am surprised that the guy will get to keep running his OWB at all. Way too close to other houses - including his own.

 

[monkeyboi]

Smoke inhalation

Some neighbors, however, have complained the smoke creates a nuisance. James Cleavenger, who lives on Fourth Street NW near Raymont Court, said heavy smoke affected the breathing of his infant niece last year.

"I had to take her to the hospital," he said. "We had to give her breathing treatments and everything. My whole house was filled with smoke.

WTF-Look at the map. Dude's house is a long way away for hie niece to have to go to the hospital for smoke inhalation. How thick would the smoke have to be for that? Besides, what parent would have their child out in that thick of smoke. "Here little Sarah, have a menthol!"

 

[WVwoodsman]

"Indoor fireplaces typically operate intermittently, said James Adams, the city's health commissioner, while outdoor wood-burning furnaces operate more continuously during the winter."

I fail to see how most people that use an indoor woodstove for heat operate it intermittently. The whole reason for having or using it is for heat. In the second part of this statement the health commisioner is stating the obvious that "while outdoor wood-burning furnaces operate more continuously during the winter." Well how else are you going to get heat? These two statements are contradictory if you ask me.

 

[AOD]

I burn in town, in an indoor furnace, and I take every precaution I can to minimize the smoke I create. I don't like burning on "nice" days when a lot of people are out and about, especially starting it cold on a nice day, I usually wait until after dark. Most of the time it burns with no smoke, or occasionally a little puff or trace of smoke comes out of it and then dissipates before anybody can really notice. I do not make billowing clouds of smoke like a house on fire, and all I burn is dry hardwoods and occasionally junk mail. So far I have gotten no negative complaints from my neighbors, most of them enjoy smelling the cherry and maple burning. If I got smoke complaints I would either stop burning or upgrade to an EPA stove.

 

[NDtreehugger]

If the smoke is going into your neighbors house or yard you need to fix the issue and quick!! why would anybody want to force feed there pollution on there neighbor.

Seasoned untreated hardwood is a bit lean softwood should be in that list minimum stack height is a must.

My stack is low but there are trees all around and the wind blows south 99% of the time nothing over there but 20 miles of field and wild life.

If you keep you burn clean no one would care if you burn or not.

for the city to go through what there going through the guy must not of cared about the neighbors and been burning green wood........

During the holidays I burn apple wood for the neighborhood.

Take care of your neighbors and they will take care of you.

 

[Tesen]

Canton City council met last night, below is the result

---

Canton Council approves list of restrictions on wood furnaces
Tuesday, November 18, 2008
By ED BALINT
[email protected]elated Stories


CANTON City Council approved restrictions on outdoor wood-burning furnaces Monday night, essentially banning the appliances.

Council passed the measure by a 9-3 vote. Council members Mary Cirelli, D-at large, Joe Carbenia, D-9, and Greg Hawk, D-1, voted against the legislation, which limits outdoor wood-burning appliances to residential properties of one acre and greater. Units also must be at least 200 feet from other structures.

Other restrictions include a minimum smokestack height on the outdoor furnace — 5 feet above the peak of any structure within a 200-foot radius of the appliance — and a list of what can and cannot be burned.

The city law will not preclude residents who already own and operate an outdoor furnace from continued use, said Law Director Joseph Martuccio. However, those residents must follow the restrictions, including operating the equipment only from Nov. 1 through April 15, he said.

Councilman Jim Griffin, D-3, introduced the ordinance after receiving complaints about a house at 336 Arlington Avenue NW regarding smoke and odor generated by an outdoor furnace.

"We just don't have the lots big enough in this city," Griffin said of the appliances.

Restrictions on outdoor furnaces already exist in Jackson Township and Perry Township and other parts of the county.

STACK HEIGHT

Ken Engel, who owns the outdoor wood-burning appliance on Arlington Avenue, said the smoke and smell are no greater than that of an indoor fireplace or bonfires in the neighborhood.

Engel says he gets wood for free and saves money on heating his home. Although Engel still will be allowed to use the wood-fired boiler, he said the smokestack restriction will make the appliance inoperable and create more smoke.

After Monday night's meeting, John Labriola, the city's chief building official, said he talked with Engel and plans to work with him to ensure he's in compliance with the new law. Labriola said he's aware of only a few outdoor furnaces in the city. He said he's received one or two complaints about Engel's appliance.

The longer the smokestack, the less efficient the outdoor furnace, Labriola said. Equipment can be purchased that is designed to increase the efficiency and reduce the amount of smoke, Labriola said.

Higher stacks are being required so smoke does not blow directly toward neighboring houses, Labriola said.

Engel said his outdoor wood-burner is efficient; he also said he follows the owner's manual. Labriola said Engel is already knowledgeable on what types of wood and fuels are permissible to burn.

'TOO RESTRICTIVE'

Tim Singo, of Perry Township, spoke in support of the restrictions. Singo said he lives next to a home with an outdoor furnace, which "can smoke out" neighbors, and he believes it's to blame for a chronically sore throat he's suffered. Singo also said the wood-fired boilers can be problematic for people with asthma.

"When you get one in your backyard, you'll care," Singo said.

Councilman Bill Smuckler, D-at large, said he supported the restrictions because city neighborhoods are so densely populated. Inner-city Canton neighborhoods average five to seven homes per acre, Labriola said. Few one-acre residential properties exist in the city, he said.

Hawk opposed the legislation. "I believe these regulations are too restrictive and needed more work," he said after Monday's meeting.

 

[Butch(OH)]

"The city law will not preclude residents who already own and operate an outdoor furnace from continued use, said Law Director Joseph Martuccio."

This is common sense in regulation! Not that I am for further regulation but I applaud them for grandfathering units already in place. This same issue was a major stumbling block in the proposed state wide regulation by the Ohio EPA.

A few dimwits with no consideration for others own and operate OWBs so lets throw em all out?? I dont understand that line of thought.

I drove to work this morning among a WHOLE bunch of dimwits driving cars (first snow of the season) so lets get rid of cars to fix the problem???

 

[Butch(OH)]

Looky there! a thousand posts now. Whats the prize??? LOL

 

[Sawmill]

Same thing happened here last year. A small town that I live by passed an ordinance to stop OWB from being put in. There were 2 of them in the city already and there were people that wanted to put them on city lots right in the city. They said each case would be handled case by case and they set up a core area of town where no one could put any in. The ones already in were grandfathered in. From what I have read on here this ordinance was fairly well thought out.

 

[beerman6]

Sawmill,where are you in Mich?

 

[jdboy9]

I don't have an OWB yet but I know plenty that do and they really don't smoke that much in my opinion. Yes there are units that do smoke more then others and yes there are things you shouldn't burn in them. You buy a cheap indoor woodfurnace,stove,boiler and it will smoke and stink just as bad as a cheap OWB. I agree with putting regulations on construction of the OWB because it is possible to manufacture one that is efficient to the point you couldn't tell the difference in smoke output as a woodburner. In the fall and spring my woodburner smokes a lot since I burn it so low but once winter rolls around its nothing but wasted heat out the stack

A friend of mine had an older central boiler with no blower on it and it was a bit big for the square footage so it spent most of its time drafted down which in turn cause a lot of smoke when it was on demand. It eventually rotted out and he went with a woodmaster (i think) with a draft fan and there is a night and day difference between the two. This new unit is actually about 150 gallons smaller than the old central boiler also. Granted he has to fill it twice a day instead of once every 2 days but it sure does smoke a lot less now. Wood consumption hasn't changed either even with filling it more, its just smaller unit that holds less.