How to increase "flow" on a splitter???

[blades]

splitter rebuild,(10 year old hf 30t) as my beam is shot-making new beam from 2, 4"x6"x6'- 1/4 wall tubes. I was thinking of capping the ends which could give me an additional 8-10gallons of hydro. available to the system, original tank is below beam (5gal) suction is about level with pump at bottom of tank but the return is only 2" down from top of tank, which I believe is leading to air becoming entrained in the hydro. ( I highly doubt that a turned down nipple was installed internally on the return port.) The thought was that using the beams as tanks would leave the lower tank completely full. Venting and fill ports would be located on beams. Possible advantages are greater capacity of fluid, much larger cooling area. ( heat build up on this unit has been a problem) I am, at present re-plumbing to eliminate right angle turns where possible by using 45 deg fittings. Which are also slightly larger internally than the oem 90's.
Sound feasible?

 

[leon]

log splitter etc.

splitter rebuild,(10 year old hf 30t) as my beam is shot-making new beam from 2, 4"x6"x6'- 1/4 wall tubes. I was thinking of capping the ends which could give me an additional 8-10gallons of hydro. available to the system, original tank is below beam (5gal) suction is about level with pump at bottom of tank but the return is only 2" down from top of tank, which I believe is leading to air becoming entrained in the hydro. ( I highly doubt that a turned down nipple was installed internally on the return port.) The thought was that using the beams as tanks would leave the lower tank completely full. Venting and fill ports would be located on beams. Possible advantages are greater capacity of fluid, much larger cooling area. ( heat build up on this unit has been a problem) I am, at present re-plumbing to eliminate right angle turns where possible by using 45 deg fittings. Which are also slightly larger internally than the oem 90's.
Sound feasible?

your oil has to be hot to deliver the energy available from the pump.
a. you do not want it to cool down as it will be less efficient
b. you most likely do not have enough oil and it is heating up and
evaporating on you.
c. you have to worry more about turbulence and air bubbles as it will kill a
gear pump.


Your pump should have a flooded suction from the tank to deliver full flow to the pump-thats why you are having problems.


fittings

On the suction side of the pump from the tank it needs to be free and clear and a 45 degree fitting is ok as long as the hose is facing down to the ground-

BUUUUT

If the suction line is reduced to begin with and the pump inlet is reduced-not good at all- turbulence, and air bubbles etc.

the return to tank line from the valve should be the same size as the return port and no smaller and a 45 degree fitting is fine to avoid turbulance and sucking air.


leon

 

[Haywire Haywood]

How about this:

Assuming that you have enough restriction to make a 2 stage pump kick down to high pressure/low volume:

The pressure builds because of the restriction, pump kicks down to low volume mode, pressure drops because of the lower volume being pushed, pump kicks back into high volume mode, pressure builds to the point that the pump kicks back into low volume mode.... etc etc..

In this situation, it seems like the pump constantly switching back and forth would make for a short pump life.

Ian

 

[Steve NW WI]

your oil has to be hot to deliver the energy available from the pump.
a. you do not want it to cool down as it will be less efficient
b. you most likely do not have enough oil and it is heating up and
evaporating on you.

leon

Leon,

Most of your points are good, but oil only needs to be in a liquid state to transfer energy. If you have a restriction problem, cold fluid will take more power to overcome it, but it will still exert the same force on the cylinder. I don't worry about warming hydraulics on any of my machinery until it's about 20°F or below, farm machinery, wood splitter, or otherwise.

To "B", to evaporate hydraulic oil, it's FAR too hot already, and a symptom of a major problem in the system. A fairly common oil spec is AW 46, and from Mobil's site, their version has a flash point of 212°C (423°F), and the boiling point is near or above that. NO common hydraulic system should be operating at those temps.

 

[turnkey4099]

Leon,

Most of your points are good, but oil only needs to be in a liquid state to transfer energy. If you have a restriction problem, cold fluid will take more power to overcome it, but it will still exert the same force on the cylinder. I don't worry about warming hydraulics on any of my machinery until it's about 20°F or below, farm machinery, wood splitter, or otherwise.

To "B", to evaporate hydraulic oil, it's FAR too hot already, and a symptom of a major problem in the system. A fairly common oil spec is AW 46, and from Mobil's site, their version has a flash point of 212°C (423°F), and the boiling point is near or above that. NO common hydraulic system should be operating at those temps.

Yep. Any heat beyond that needed to keep the oil fluid is waste energy. Hot oil does not increase efficiency.

Harry K

 

[AKKAMAAN]

Leon,

Most of your points are good, but oil only needs to be in a liquid state to transfer energy. If you have a restriction problem, cold fluid will take more power to overcome it, but it will still exert the same force on the cylinder. I don't worry about warming hydraulics on any of my machinery until it's about 20°F or below, farm machinery, wood splitter, or otherwise.

To "B", to evaporate hydraulic oil, it's FAR too hot already, and a symptom of a major problem in the system. A fairly common oil spec is AW 46, and from Mobil's site, their version has a flash point of 212°C (423°F), and the boiling point is near or above that. NO common hydraulic system should be operating at those temps.

Agree 100%, with you Steve NW WI! :agree2:

Oil density actually decreases with raised temperature, and will then be more compressible.....higher temp actually decrease oil efficiency....

Your 20F temp limit for warming up is also spot on for me....actually ISO 32 oil, have allowed me operation colder than 20F....

 

[blades]

When I have enough time I will try to post some pics. The supply to the pump is ok. the return to the tank is high on the tank, less than 10" away from the suction port, and if you fill the tank to just the point of see fluid backing up in the fill nipple ( this does leave breathing room in tank), when it heats up it starts foaming out the vent/fill port.About 5 gallons in the whole system. Cycling has been normal, no pump shift till required. Hence the reason for adding additional tank area. The 90 deg. fittings were on the high pressure work side, ram extend function connected between the valve and the cylinder port by a steel line which had another couple bends in it also. The return line (to tank) has 2, 90deg fittings, they are 3/4" id. I wanted to feed the return tank line to the beam tanks and then have that drain to the original tank below. Fill and vent would be relocated to the beam tanks. The current HF 30,20 ton units in the catalog are still using the same original configuration.The size of the tank is the main shortcoming for extended operation time. The unit is 10 years old and has given very good service.

 

[triptester]

How many people actually check the temperature of the hydraulic fluid rather than just guessing?

If you can keep a bare hand on the reservoir or cylinder for more than a few seconds the fluid is NOT hot.

The recommended max. high temp for most hydraulic fluid is 180 degrees.

Average home hot water heater setting is 130 degrees.

Average fresh brewed coffee 180 degrees.

Hydronic heating system in a home 180 degrees.

 

[ray benson]

Found a 0-300° tank temp gauge at flea market. Installed into side of tank, and marked it at 150°.

 

[blades]

Cylinder hot enough to create blisters. By my way of thinking a tad too warm. Hot ok, Blistering hot not good, granted I am running 4-6 hours or more continuous. current work pic attached