Husqvarna 460 rancher (2012) questions about tune

[Jameson]

OK I have my buddies 460 rancher, 60cc saw. 18" 3/8 chain

Nice piece, he used it for maybe 10 hours or so during the hurricane and put it away dirty. He recently tried to use it with some fresh mix and it bogged when full throttle was applied. So I cleaned up the saw from all the dirt, supercleaned the bar and tip and chain and sharpened her up nice. Checked the exhaust and it is clear on the screen.

Emptied out the gas tank. (I did not check the fuel filter)

Filled halfway with trufuel 40-1.

Now the screws have flat head slots, but they have a wierd metal thing it seems that will only let me turn them MAYBE 3/4 of a full screw turn total. More on this later - as I believe this is my problem. So I turned both screws in to stop - then I turned them halfway as much out as possible. I turned the idle screw in about 1/2 turn.

Pulled out choke thingy and popped on second pull. Started on third. Idled nice, and was bogging on applied throttle.

Then I let her idle a minute and ran her at half throttle for a few seconds and it would bog when I went to full. Saw sounds great at this point. Almost like it wanted to go to full throttle. Let it sit off for 5 minutes or so.

Started up right away - first pull - let idle for a minute and she hesitated when going to full from half throttle but died if I left the throttle pinned. Would come back to life if going back to half or off throttle.

Left it overnight. Tonight It popped on first pull and started on second pull. Many of my echos don't do that.

It idled perfectly and bogged again going to full from half throttle. Let sit for five minutes idling.

Opened up the saw to full throttle and she ran like a beast. A few Blurps like she was clearing something out and then smooth as silk - but the slightest tad on the lean side on the H - by ear - not dangerously lean. This is in a 45 degree garage.

The problem is, even after I opened up the H as far as she would go as per the "limiter" thing - it looks like a steel band - it still sounds lean as per my liking. I like some "4-stroking" as you guys have taught me and while this saw isn't screaming lean, it isn't four stroking. I didn't cut with it but am worried about how it will react.

Should I go ahead with putting new fuel lines in and a new fuel filter just for insurance? The air filter and the passages are perfectly clean and the saw - though I didn't want to run it without load for too long, did sustain a few good 5-15 second full throttle surges without a problem.

Also, The muffler looks hard to work on. Any good suggestions on a simple mod not involving welding? My echo mods have come out great.

Thanks all for the help.

JC

 

[LegDeLimber]

My money would be on a new fuel filter & lines (including the punch bubble ones)
and a thorough carb cleaning and new kit.
I would start with a new fuel filter and see what you get.
But I would really take a hard look at the lines also.
If it had E-gas left in it, the lines are probably stiff and close to gone.

You might get lucky with disassembling and cleaning the carb then putting old pieces back.
But for all the stuff involved in pulling the carb and reinstalling, I personally wouldn't gamble on it.
I have a 450, so that is what I'm basing the amount of carb removal work upon.
So your situation may be different.

 

[Jameson]

Honestly it sounds like if i could turn the h screw out another 1/2 turn it would be perfect. The gas in it smelled good but I don't think it was in there long.

 

[LegDeLimber]

I haven't run into any limiters other than some of the more simple plastic ones
and they were pretty simple to work around.
Hopefully someone with the same saw or that type of limiters will weigh in
and tell you the trick for them.

 

[Matt81]

Honestly it sounds like if i could turn the h screw out another 1/2 turn it would be perfect. The gas in it smelled good but I don't think it was in there long.

If you do want to adjust outside the range allowed by the limiter caps on these saws here is the trick: You don't need to remove these kind of limiters as they allow the jet screws to turn even while the limiters are still on the saw.
It has a spring behind the limiter and when the limiter is pushed out by the spring it won't allow the jet screw to turn. You need to push in the limiter cap in with a small tool like a really small jewelers screwdriver and hold it and while this is pushed in then turn the jet screw at the same time.

I have worked on and owned and sold many 455/460 saws. Never come across one that needed to go very far outside the factory set limiter ranges to be tuned right. If it is running so rotten at the limit of adjustment I would be looking at the carb myself.

BTW I re-read your post quickly and you mention that the air filter looks clean. Try cleaning around the air intake area really well and running the saw without the air filter and see if this has any effect. I have had air filters that looked fine but were actually badly blocked and restricting air getting to where it is needed.

Also replace the fuel filter if you can. Easy and cheap to do. If your buddy is not very mechanically minded maybe he has accidentally put the fuel and bar oil in the wrong tanks. I have had this on these homeowner saws i have worked on quite a lot actually. The bar oil will clog the fuel filter and cause the saw to run very poorly. The bar oil residue on the fuel filter will dissolve slowly in the fuel but even if tank is flushed out several times it takes a long while for the saws idle and acceleration to improve.

 

[Jameson]

I think i understand what you mean.

Push in that silver ring around the screw and turn?

It really isn't running rotten, its actually nice and smooth. Just can't turn the h screw out enough to get it to 4 stroke.

I also haven't tested it in wood yet.

I can't say for sure about the bar oil in the fuel tank. I highly doubt it as what i dumped out was mix fuel for sure.

I do think he used some motor oil for bar oil, it is thin and dark colored so maybe used. When testing it it was dripping out. Definitely not like any bar oil i have ever bought. Does bar oil turn black over time? I wouldn't think so.

I checked everything and it looks clean as a whistle.

i mixed up some 40-1 with some seafoam in it. Going to run that, try to turn the h screw a little more and see what happens.


Jc

 

[Matt81]

Yes that's it, push the ring in while turning the screw. If it is running fine then just get it to 4-stroke and fine tune in the wood. Sounds like you are on the home stretch and should have a good running saw.

Only a thought about the fuel filter, I always look at the cheap and simple to do things before thinking the worst. Just because there was mix in the tank then when you checked does not mean bar oil has not been in the tank ever! The one i fixed recently had mix in the tank too when i received it but would not run right, and it was only after asking the owner and prying out of him what he had done did i get to the bottom of it. I agree it sounds unlikely too but it does happen, and will make the saw unable to be tuned right due to the fuel filter being blocked.

The bar oil does not turn black over time. It comes out the colour it was when it went in. Do not use a used motor oil for bar oil. Very poor tack properties and it is too thin to keep it on the underside of the bar where it is needed. Plus the dirt and grit in the used oil will accelerate bar and chain wear and you run the risk of clogging the pump and lines.

 

[Jameson]

I would never. But if you ask me it was used motor oil in that bar oil reservoir.

Thanks for all of the advice.

I have had very easy experiences with tuning 2014 model echo saws, with the simple limter cap removal process. The late 90s and early 2000s poulans were also easy. just couldn't figure this one out. Im sticking with my echos for now. They don't give me problems and are all opened up and running strong.

Will update after cutting.

 

[Jameson]

Ok i used a pin and a pair of pliers to push down the metal ring, then i turned the screw out about 3/4 turn. That should give me some room to get back to leanish. Not impossible, but a pain.

Will know in a few hours.

 

[Jameson]

Ok i had her cutting for about 20 minutes, fast powerful saw.

Shut her down and she started first pull 20 minutes later. Bogging issue again when throttle applied.

Called my buddy and he told me he bad gassed it (old 87 octane mix) two years ago. Told me his neighbor and him bought the saws together, they both ran used motor oil in the bar oil reservoir and they both bad gassed them. His buddy took it to the dealer and got a carb rebuilt for around $80.

Guess im doing fuel lines, carb kit etc.

Jc

 

[Matt81]

As long as it was not straight gassed it should not be too bad. The oil will settle in old mix so the gas can should always be inverted to agitate and mix the oil properly. If this was not done perhaps there was very little oil in the old mix that was put into the saw?

I use fuel older than what is ideal quite often. (between 3-6 months old) Never had a single issue. I do use non ethanol fuel and always a minimum of 91 octane however.

A new carb kit is a given i reckon, and do the lines if they are not in good shape.