Milling for a TimberFrame - advice for a rookie

[BushWhack]

Hey folks,

Here's my situation:

Thinkin of building a roughly 20' x 30' timberframe and using some of the timbers off our property. Theres about a dozen or so nice straight tamaracks and another 30-40 nice black spruce, all about 20-26" in diameter.

Was thinkin of using the Tamaracks for posts and beams as I've heard lots about their strenght, and the spruce for joists/supports and the like.

I've never milled before. No experience, though lotsa experience with tree cutting, chainsaws, etc. I only have weekends on which I can work, as this is a cottage property 2 hrs from my home. Not a lotta $$ right now, young children, mortgage in town yada yada yada. So, rather than buy lumber was thinkin I'd drop $1000 on a saw/mill setup and do it myself. And yes, it would be myself, my 1-yr old has a ways to go b4 he gets recruited.

The question is how much time would it take to get the amount of lumber I need via milling?? Could I get proficient at it fairly quickly?? I was originally thinkin of cutting the trees and then get a sawyer with a portable bandsaw mill to come in and mill but the trees are all over the property and they'd need to be milled where they fell.

I love the idea of using my own trees, but if its gonna take forever I'm wondering if I might not just be further ahead buying them from the local lumberyard. I still have to build the house after all!

Any ideas on this? Anyone done something similar?? Or am I getting in over my head

BTW, this site rocks. Extremely informative...

thx,
Steve

 

[Sawyer Rob]

I was originally thinkin of cutting the trees and then get a sawyer with a portable bandsaw mill to come in and mill but the trees are all over the property and they'd need to be milled where they fell.

The house isn't going to be "all over the property", you will have to move them anyway... Just saw out the logs, move them to the site, and have a guy come in and mill them.

You won't get much done yourself with 1K to spend, and it does take a learning curve and a lot of time to do it with a CSM!

Save your strength and stress for the rest of the house.

Rob

 

[testlight]

Yeah I did the Alaska saw mill thing. Never again. Its expensive, slow and with a 3/8 chain you loose too much in the cut. Try to find someone with a Lucas mill or simular to do the job for you. Sell some wood as lumber, timbers or firewood if you want to try to offset costs.

 

[excess650]

If you already have a BIG chainsaw(at least 70cc), the cost of an Alaskan mill isn't too bad. Click on the Bailey's link above and check them out. You'll lose 6" of bar length because of the mill and how it clamps, but it is portable, and capable of milling the trees where they fall. You will still need a way to move the beams or boards, and beams are lighter than logs, but still heavy.

Once you get the knack of setting up, subsequent cuts are quicker, but still relatively slow for long, wide boards or beams. A log will yield a square beam 70% of its diameter.

I used aluminum angle for supporting straight 2x4s as my guide. Box tubing will also work, and Granberg makes and sells their own rails, but adds expense. Some guys use sections of aluminum ladder.

There are other, less expensive options like the Haddon Lumber Maker, Beam Machine, and clones that simply clamp or bolt onto the bar, but I can't confirm how well they work. These will work with a smaller saw, and should cut quicker with the bar angled cutting "noodles" versus perpendicular with the grain as in milling. These use a 2x4 or 2x6 as a guide.

My first attempt with an Alaskan mill resulted in a 10.5"x10.5"x9'9" hemlock beam that is straight and square. It was for a friend who also wants to build a timber frame, and is drying in his garage.

 

[Rookie1]

Just had to say Hi cause your thread has my handle in it.

 

[Mad Professor]

Use straight knot frees tree and avoid leaners with stress in the wood. Box the heart of the log to make beams (on BOTH ends). Use the best logs for the horizontal beams/plates, the posts can be lower grade.

I saw out the outer portion of the log for grade or framing lumber depending on what type of wood I'm cutting.

Besides a mill you'll need a way to move the logs, unless you go from tree to tree, but that gets old real soon.

 

[BushWhack]

I'm feelin like I should get someone in to do it again. The problem is that I dont really have a good way to get all these trees to a central spot. Was originally thinkin if I milled where the tree fell (CSM), I could then move the milled lumber easily to my site (which is way up on a hill). I dont have a quad so not sure how I'm going to get 10-16' foot wet logs out of the bush.

Maybe I could cut the trees, then rent a quad and pull em out to the site and get someone in? How have others done this?? Want minimal impact on the land as well. Dont wanna build roads etc. The site is remote so I need to do everything by hand by myself mostly with the help of friends ...

 

[testlight]

Well, I have no practical advice on this one, but just to get the creative juices flowing, you can use: Horses (don't laugh too hard), wenches (powered by hand, electric, or gas), or something with 4X4. How far do you have to move your timbers? If it isn't very far you could use poles and such to pull the timbers on.

 

[Mad Professor]

I move all my logs with a 1940 Ford 9N tractor, but I don't have steep hills to deal with or wet/swampy land. Paid $1000 for it 20 years ago, best $1000 I ever spent. I also have HD chains, some peavys/cant hooks to help move things.

 

[Mike Van]

My 2 cents is for you to go in a different direction - With no equipment & no experience, only weekends, 2 hours from home - Your're looking at years to do this project.

 

[BushWhack]

Alright, points well taken ...

Think I'll get the trees that are close, maybe 12 of them, cut em and get buddy with truck/chains to move them the short distance to our cottage driveway. Then get sawyer into mill.

Which brings up the next question - how many posts/beams might I get out of a dozen 20" diameter, 60' high straight trees? And how long for a pro sawyer to mill this and at what cost? Would it be worth it ??! I'll simply buy the rest.

Then I just need to worry about getting it all up to the cabin site - through the woods, uphill 200 meters ... but at least she'll be chopped up...

BTW, there's already a cottage to live in there while I'm doing this project so I can kinda take my time a bit I guess. Its been a dream of mine to build my own digs.

thx for advice guys,

S

 

[mpapuga]

If you have the time and the ambition, then go for it. It will be very rewarding for you. Your young family will enjoy your stories and handywork for years if it's done right. Enjoy the project, it sounds like you want to do it.

Mark

 

[peterrum]

I see that you want to have little impact on your land. Have you thought about hiring a horse logger to move your logs out for you before you mill them. Small footprint and your kids would love it. Good luck with your project.

 

[woodshop]

If you have the time and the ambition, then go for it. It will be very rewarding for you. Your young family will enjoy your stories and handywork for years if it's done right. Enjoy the project, it sounds like you want to do it.

Mark

This echoes my thoughts if I were in your position. Assuming you have the time and patience, there are ways to mill beams right where the tree fell (csm, handheld bandsaw like a Ripsaw) and also ways to move a 6x6 or 8x8 timber beam by hand (winches/pulley, ATV etc). Truly portable milling where you can carry the mill to the tree could be as cheap as a used big bore saw on a $200 chain saw mill... or couple thousand invested in a Ripsaw. For that same price or little more (but with less portability) invest in a stationary chainsaw mill like a Logosol, or if you're handy, build one like Imbeachy and some others here have. Point being, there are ways to get things done if you are motivated and are willing to think outside that conventional box. As Mark says above, think of the rewards for years (generations?) ahead assuming you build something that will last that long. I can think of many other ways to spend my time and money that would NOT be as productive or rewarding in the long run. If I were your age and situation, I'd find ways to get it done even if it took years.

 

[MJR]

Just an idea, look into vertical log cabins. I am thinking of making a little one as a shoting house next spring. Good luck to you and your family.

 

[Backwoods]

I think you are on the right track. Take the closest trees and have a portable sawmill come in and mill them. Get someone with a larger out fit that can handle the bigger jobs on a short timeframe, one weekend. Then you will have some trading material when you knock on the neighbor’s door looking for a small cat for a weekend. Surely someone near by will have a small cat or tractor. Now you can pull all the logs up onto the landing. Trim deck and sort them, make a full cut-list and have the sawyer back. Now you are ready to build. All this could be done in a couple of months, weekends only.

You sound like my typical customer: You have some land with trees that you have been planing a project for years and now it is time to start. They normally have me back on a regular basis and you never know what their next project will be. Some are rather creative in their projects as well.

Good luck and hope to see more of this project.

 

[BushWhack]

thx for the encouragement guys. gonna be a big project. Hopefully still got a wife and no alcohol problem a few years out

Figure I got the land & wood already, typically the biggest expenses/obstacles for those who want to build their own, and I'm in no hurry. If I get stuck on something, I'll contract it out...figure I'm ahead anyways ...

Thinkin as well, we might rent out our existing cottage to help offset building costs a bit (we're in the Mont Tremblant region of Quebec)...

I'm still a year or 2 away from starting, just want to take this time to work out as many of the angles/obstacles as I can b4 i begin.

I was thinkin when I started this thread, I'd mill my own lumber via CSM but I think I'm gonna leave it for a pro. My initial plan was to try and do absolutely everything on my own, no help, no footprint on the land, and as little 'machinery' as possible - alas, dont think this its realistic. Think a mix of our own lumber for the posts/beams and purchasing the rest may be the way. I still definitley wanna be able to sit back in my cabin when I'm old with a Scotch and admire my beams, knowing from which tree each one came ....

And yeah, I'll be around ... given my situation, not sure I'd be albe to do this project without these forums.

cheers guys,
S

 

[testlight]

If you still want to do the low impact no machinery thing, maybe you should look into cordwood construction. opcorn:
Its cheap and easy, you could gather up the wood by hand, or with a very small piece of equipment and a little trailer.

 

[excess650]

thx for the encouragement guys. gonna be a big project. Hopefully still got a wife and no alcohol problem a few years out

Figure I got the land & wood already, typically the biggest expenses/obstacles for those who want to build their own, and I'm in no hurry. If I get stuck on something, I'll contract it out...figure I'm ahead anyways ...

Thinkin as well, we might rent out our existing cottage to help offset building costs a bit (we're in the Mont Tremblant region of Quebec)...

I'm still a year or 2 away from starting, just want to take this time to work out as many of the angles/obstacles as I can b4 i begin.

I was thinkin when I started this thread, I'd mill my own lumber via CSM but I think I'm gonna leave it for a pro. My initial plan was to try and do absolutely everything on my own, no help, no footprint on the land, and as little 'machinery' as possible - alas, dont think this its realistic. Think a mix of our own lumber for the posts/beams and purchasing the rest may be the way. I still definitley wanna be able to sit back in my cabin when I'm old with a Scotch and admire my beams, knowing from which tree each one came ....

And yeah, I'll be around ... given my situation, not sure I'd be albe to do this project without these forums.

cheers guys,
S

If you're a year or two out, that would give you time to cut, mill, and dry the beams and lumber prior to construction. The simplest, least expensive chainsaw mills clamp to your chainsaw bar and use a 2x4 or 2x6 as a guide. The next step is the Alaskan mill which requires a larger chainsaw, but will yield a flat and square beam or board if you're careful.

It sounds like your biggest problems are in moving the lumber, and fear of failure. You CAN cut the lumber with minimal equipment. It just takes some time and thought. Moving the beams and boards will take some doing, but you'll figure that out. Do you have a snowmobile? If so, you could move the lumber after the ground is frozen and snow covered, and would leave almost no footprint.

You can't succeed if you don't try.

 

[EPA]

Well if I was looking at this project I would take a hard look at the Norwood lumber lite 24 mill even if you planned to sell it after the project is done the time and effort saved would pay for it //// EPA