New guy

[wavefreak]

Found this place after a Google search. Looks like I scored. I'm a computer geek that needs to do stuff with my hands on the weekend.

What brought me here is the old black walnut tree in my front yard. It's about 40 inch diameter at the base. The local saw mills don't like these trees because of nails and stuff but I can't live with an old tree like that turning into firewood. So I've been looking into chain saw milling.

I'm still early in the research cycle and I'm likely to drive you all crazy with questions.

I'll probably never be more than a hobbiest at this. I want to make rough cut picture frames and maybe some other stuff. The walnut tree may turn into flooring or cabinets. Is a cheap jig like that Haddon Lumber Maker going to going to work well enough for occasional use? I don't expect to do more than one or two trees a year once I've taken care of the trees in my yard that need to come down.

Thanks all.

Looking forward to reading all the posts here.

 

[outdoorlivin247]

Welcome...

 

[dallasm1]

CAUTION! Slippery slope ahead. If you can hold yourself to one or two a year you will have done better than any of us here. Welcome to the jungle!

 

[wavefreak]

CAUTION! Slippery slope ahead. If you can hold yourself to one or two a year you will have done better than any of us here. Welcome to the jungle!

LOL.

How many picture frames do you think I can make? But I suppose it's better than being addicted to oxycontin.

 

[dallasm1]

LOL.

How many picture frames do you think I can make? But I suppose it's better than being addicted to oxycontin.

It's quite extraordinary. Logs just start showing up. People drop them off, they are offered to you FREE (how can you say no tio that?). Yah, at first it's picture frames, then coffee tables, chairs, outdoor furniture.... hey, why buy lumber when you can mill it yourself? It won't be long before you are trying to rationalize a bigger saw, a faster chain combo, more space to store lumber.... LOL now, but mark my words..... :chainsawguy:

 

[wavefreak]

It won't be long before you are trying to rationalize a bigger saw, a faster chain combo, more space to store lumber.... LOL now, but mark my words..... :chainsawguy:

Hmmmm. Sounds seductive. I can see me running around town with a 32inch saw in the back of my Honda Fit. It'll keep the hijackers at bay if I'm ever on the wrong side of the railroad tracks.


Here's a question. What happens when you hit a nail? What little I know is at a mill, the blade throws a tooth, it flies across the shop and impales the operator, making him him really mad. What's the worst that can happen with a chain saw (other than death and dismemberment)?

 

[BobL]

Hmmmm. Sounds seductive. I can see me running around town with a 32inch saw in the back of my Honda Fit. It'll keep the hijackers at bay if I'm ever on the wrong side of the railroad tracks.

Here's a question. What happens when you hit a nail? What little I know is at a mill, the blade throws a tooth, it flies across the shop and impales the operator, making him him really mad. What's the worst that can happen with a chain saw (other than death and dismemberment)?

Welcome WF!. All of the nails I have hit so far have been soft iron so the the chain just cuts straight thru them without even noticing it, except maybe the saw slows down a bit. It dulled the teeth a little but a good sharpen got me back on track within 20 minutes. I have also hit a coach bolt which I did notice but I lost no teeth, two teeth were damaged (small chips of metal taken off them), I didn't try to sharpen the damage out of them right away, I just kept them the same length as the other teeth so after about 4-5 sharpenings they were back to OK. If you hit one of those hardened steel nails you could loose a cutter or two but it would be be unusual to break a chain and when the chain does break it is USUALLY a non-event in that the chain just flops off the bar. However, there is still a very small possibility that if the chain does break at the start of a cut the chain can fly around and hit the operator, so I still wear and recommend people wear chaps when milling. CS milling usually uses more bar and chain than a lot of other CS cutting so the chain is usually buried in the wood and is fairly safe. My risk analysis is that if you use proper PPE you are more likely to be hurt moving the logs and lumber than using a CS mill. My most significantly dangerous event was a 1/2" nut vibrating off the mill and falling onto the moving chain which threw the nut up into my face - lucky I had a full face polycarbonate shield on - it felt I was like hit with a baseball bat!

Another warning the slope is deadly slippery
I started milling in Feb of 2007 with this single 35 year old mac and this home made 24" steel mill

In Nov of 2008 I'm cutting with this.

And recently I've graduated to this .

Plus I have a mild bout of CAD (ie I now have 8 chain saws)
Tragic - isn't it!

 

[LAndrews]

Welcome fellow newcomer. I got into this for the same reasons...it just kills me to see good wood going up in smoke and oddly enough the first tree that I went out of my way to save the planks from is an English Walnut that finally gave into the bugs.

Can't help with the Haddon. There's a few guys here that seem happy with equivalent hardware. I just slab everything, then clamp unistrut to the faces as a fence for a skilsaw to clean up the sides.

If it helps any, I held out for a big saw and am very happy with it. It's overkill for anything but milling but does a great job. My 350 couldn't possibly pull an 18" chain very hard for very long...the 395 just keeps eating like a skinny teenager.

hth, la

 

[smithie55]

Welcome to Chainsaw milling, it's safe to say that it is my most favorite thing to do, once you start opening up logs to reveal what is inside, you will get addicted.

It's quite extraordinary. Logs just start showing up. People drop them off, they are offered to you FREE (how can you say no tio that?). Yah, at first it's picture frames, then coffee tables, chairs, outdoor furniture.... hey, why buy lumber when you can mill it yourself? It won't be long before you are trying to rationalize a bigger saw, a faster chain combo, more space to store lumber....

Man you hit it dead on!!!!

 

[AndyR]

Welcome to the site,
I did a similar thing just about this time last year. At least that's when the trees came down. You can read about it in my post.

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=77583

It's been a good learning experience and I have a pretty big stack of cherry and walnut now drying nicely. The only cupping and splitting I've noticed are in the couple pieces that I tried to bring into the house for further drying a little too soon. Make sure you read up on stacking and air-drying. Milling the wood is only a small part of the process of getting good useable lumber. It's not rocket science, but if you don't do it right it can be painful to watch your hard work get moldy or turn into firewood.

If you aren't in a huge rush, I would watch the online auctions. I bought my Alaskan for about half the price of new. It was missing a couple of bolts-but that wasn't a problem. The mini-mill is reportedly well worth the investment (one I intend to make eventually). The reviews I've heard of the Haddon Lumbermaker aren't nearly as good. For a log that size, I think the mini-mill and Alaskan would be a great combo.

Andy

 

[excess650]

Its good to see some other folks not wanting to cut walnut into firewood. I dropped a nice sized trunk yesterday (32"x42") for a guy who just had to have the tree out of his yard. The color was fantastic! I'm looking forward to milling it with my Alaskan, Mini Mill, and Norwood LM2000.

The Haddon is passable for small, rough lumber. Much better results can be had with the Granberg Alaskan and Mini Mill http://www.granberg.com/

The Alaskan will cut slabs rather nicely, but requires a powerful saw. The Mini Mill has worked great for making vertical cuts(squaring sides) and should do fine making slabs. The advantage of the Alaskan is that both ends of the bar are held captive, so more difficult to make bad cuts, and should yield a smoother finish.

If you can get the log cut into a cant(squared or rectangular with bark removed) you may have an easier time getting a local mill to make boards from the wood. Check to see if there is a bandmill local to you.

 

[Brownpot Deaton]

I myself have also been considering it as something to do on the side for fun. but I dont want to spend so much money on something i cant justify just yet. so i have about 2 questions(which i hope haven't been answered)

i have a husky 2100(muffler modded) with a 50" cannon, 36" gb...
and a 365 special with a 372 big bore kit (just bought from bailey's and did some mild porting) with a muffler mod and 28" gb.

since almost everything down here is oak (basically the kinda stuff aggiewoodbutcher has encountered since we arent that far apart; been thinking i may hit him up this summer for a hands on lesson one weekend if he can manage....) will I encounter any problems with milling with these, such as is 50" too long for what i've got???

secondly, can a mill for something as long as 50" be safely used on something as small as 28" or 36" or would i need 2 seperate ones???? and for that matter, is it easy/cheap building one( i have been saveing pictures and info on all the builds lately...been thinking about designing one like Bill's 880 mill).....never heard anyone say how much they've put into it(or just happened to read right over it)

lasstly, if you had to redo it, what all features would you include on your mills???


don't want to take away from wavefreak's questons, but figured i'm not far ahead of him, and answering these questions will give both of us a good idea of what to expect.

 

[excess650]

The Husky 2100 should be quite capable of milling, and I think the Alasakn is the quickest, and easiest way to start. Your smaller saw will also work, but be much slower, and limited to a much narrower cut.

My first cuts were on an 18" dead hemlock, and it was slower than I would have liked with a 272xp. Stepping up to a big bore equipped 066 was a huge improvement. I've since milled dead oak up to 30" wide with the 066. It goes more quickly and easily with my 3120xp.

Things to remember are that you will have 4"-6" less cut than your bar length with an Alaskan, and that cant size will be roughly 70% of the width of the log you're working with. Semi-chisel and Bailey's milling chain are the two best that I've tried for both finish and speed. You will also need to tune your powerhead pretty rich on the H side to enhance cooling and limit rpm. Likewise, increasing the amount of 2 stroke oil in your mix will help keeping parts lubricated.

 

[wavefreak]

MORE POWER!

You're all nuts. Problem is, I am already nuts. That does not bode well.

Since I'm really just working around the edges here, I'm can't sink a lot of money into this (yet). I see lots of big monster saws here and I'm wondering how much of that is wanting to go faster and how much is a requirement of the job. In other words, will a smaller saw live through some logs as long as I'm patient, keep things sharp and lubricated, or am I going to fry it real quick?

 

[glennschumann]

Walnut

Wavefreak, Welcome!

My thought is is to start with an Alaskan (Granberg is what I use). I too shudder at the thought of a walnut being turned into firewood. For something of that size, I'd not think about picture frames, but rather, planks for table tops. Look up George Nakashima and his "Peace Table" for an exceptional example. What I've discovered with this hobby is that other folks are really interested in it... I had a work friend offer an Elm, and there were 4 people in lawn chairs, and 4 or 5 more standing around watching me mill yesterday. The help was very handy when moving the 9' long, 20+ wide, 2 1/2" thick slabs....

By the way, I've had some good luck with having a tree service drop a tree the way I wanted, but be sure to be there, or mark where you want the tree cut before they go at it... Their normal stump cut may be 2-1/2 feet off the ground leaving lots of beautiful wood disconnected from the rest of the trunk.

Here is a link to a post I made about how I started... I now have two Stihl 066's, a Husqvarna 3120xp (60" bar with 56" rails for the long bar), oh, and a Stihl 009 because I thought having a free saw that I could pick up with one finger was cool.

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?p=853389#post853389

P.S. A walnut of that size is a heck of a place to start... you might start on a smaller tree, you know, maybe 20 inches...

 

[glennschumann]

Brownpot,

Just a few thoughts... the 2100 should be a good saw for this, but the 50" bar on the 36" alaskan may be too much. I've got a 42" for my 36" alaskan, and that is just about right... about 3 or 4 inches is taken up on the tip end (don't clamp on the sprocket), and a few inches stick out the other end, enabling the chain brake to work yet on my 066. The extra 8" of a 50" bar would leave about 12" of exposed bar on the powerhead side of the mill which is remarkably close to one's face when milling. I'd shy away from that. I'd either invest in longer rails or a 42" bar. The 42" Oregon Powermatch from Baileys was about $90, and is serving me well. The other disadvantage of so much extension on the powerhead side, is that the weight of the powerhead will tip the mill, leaving it unballenced, and more difficult to operate. I would not remove the guard over the tip and extend the bar out that way... too much chance for finding the ground, a rock, another log, or bystander... I've already bent the guard on mine (bent it into the chain, actually) while milling, and I'm very glad it is there.

Go a head and use the smaller saw with the smaller bar. I find that running a 24" bar for the 16" logs is safer, faster, and easier than using that 42" monster all the time...

Hope that helps.

P.S. I've made a few very minor modifications to my Granberg mill, but the one I really want to make is to put wheels on the skids to help reduce the friction of sliding against the log...

 

[Brownpot Deaton]

DOH!.. I forgot ...it was a 36" gb titanium bar, not 36" gb mill...my fault...was just wondering if 50" is ok on a 2100 being used on a mill?

it appears the wheel idea is really worth lookin into.

 

[BobL]

Brownpot,
. . . . . .
- The extra 8" of a 50" bar would leave about 12" of exposed bar on the powerhead side of the mill which is remarkably close to one's face when milling. I'd shy away from that. I'd either invest in longer rails or a 42" bar. . . . . .
- The other disadvantage of so much extension on the powerhead side, is that the weight of the powerhead will tip the mill, leaving it unballenced, and more difficult to operate.
- I would not remove the guard over the tip and extend the bar out that way... too much chance for finding the ground, a rock, another log, or bystander...

Yep - I agree

I would just get longer Rails - it's not too bad to have chain exposed if it is within the framework of the mill.

BTW there is no need to buy the expensive granberg rails. Even here in Australia I can pick up 20' of Highway sign ally unistrut (which is almost identical to the standard granberg rails see black rails in picture) for about US$50. Or if you want to go with the slightly heavier duty stuff I paid about US$60 for the rails for my mill (see belwo. With 20' of rail you can make several combinations of rails as well as add extra cross braces, I have sets of 40, 54 and 64" rails for my BIL mill (I have bars from 24 to 60").

 

[BobL]

DOH!.. I forgot ...it was a 36" gb titanium bar, not 36" gb mill...my fault...was just wondering if 50" is ok on a 2100 being used on a mill?

The 2100 will run the bar/chain OK, the real question is what size logs will you cut with it. With a 50" bar, your max cut on a granberg mill will be ~45", in softwood the 2100 will probably be just OK at that size, in North American hardwood - long terms it will be working real hard, even in a 36" log, and I wouldn't be doing it in over 30" Aussie hardwood.

it appears the wheel idea is really worth lookin into.

Oh yeah - I have 4 wheels on my BIL mill - I can wheely recommend them!

 

[wavefreak]

Wavefreak, Welcome!

P.S. A walnut of that size is a heck of a place to start... you might start on a smaller tree, you know, maybe 20 inches...

Yeah. I figured I would work up to it. I think it might be close to 50 inches. I probably should measure it instead of guessing. There is a lateral branch that's about 20 inches and maybe 25 feet long. I'm going to take that off first. I have a couple of smaller trees that took some storm damage and four 10 to 12 inch cedars that are too close to the house. By then I'll have some idea of how to do this.

The Alaska setup looks ingenious. I'll have to fanagle one.