Running chainsaws (and other twostrokes) on E85

[Tomos770]

So why dont they make engines with a longer stroke? Have they not figured this out yet? I know the ECHO's have longer strokes and many say they have more torque, but have a smaller diameter bore. What are the advantages of a shorter stroke but wider bore??? Should one kind of saw have a shorter stroke and one have a long stroke? I've had some short stroke 8 cyl. " back in the day" and had a long stroke 1969 Oldsmobile 98 with the 455 Rocket with a 4 barrel. The engine was huge, the car was huge . But it got as much as 17 mpg on the highway. Amazing for those times. Should a limbing saw have a short stroke for quick revs and a bucking saw have the longer stroke for more torque?

Driving 4 answers is your friend....

 

[Bill G]

Interesting thread. Years ago at a GTG a member ran a saw with zero oil to see how long it would last. I had planned on bringing some of my father in laws 180 grain but he wanted to drink it. I have often wondered about E85. I would think you have to let that fuel FLOW

 

[HansFranz]

years ago at a GTG a member ran a saw with zero oil to see how long it would last.

You mean he straight-gassed it? How long did it last? Not long, I suspect...

 

[Bill G]

You mean he straight-gassed it? How long did it last? Not long, I suspect...

Yes straight gassed. Last a long time. It has been years ago but I think he gave up as it would slow down then restart

 

[John Lyngdal]

I'd rather have a battery powered saw rather than run one on E85.
The whole ethanol story was a sham..

 

[Bill G]

I'd rather have a battery powered saw rather than run one on E85.
The whole ethanol story was a sham..

How is it a sham?

 

[John Lyngdal]

How is it a sham?

Let me guess you didn't watch the analysis in the attached video.
OK, the short form is this.
Corn is one of the most energy/fertilizer/pesticide intensive crops to grow and harvest.
It takes even more energy to ferment and distill off the ethanol.
The fermentation effluent has little secondary use, and available need requires fresh product.
https://www.e-education.psu.edu/egee439/node/649In the end, the generation of ethanol for fuel consumes more energy than is present in the end product.
If it was economically feasible, the government wouldn't have to subsidize the effort.
Worst of all you have increased the cost of a bushel of corn, adversely impacting the nutritional intake of the less fortunate.

 

[Bill G]

Worst of all you have increased the cost of a bushel of corn, adversely impacting the nutritional intake of the less fortunate.

How much yellow dent corn did you eat last year

 

[John Lyngdal]

How much yellow dent corn did you eat last year

A fair amount as I like Hispanic food and dent corn is used to make tortilla chips and tortillas. Masa is commonly exported food product to regions that prefer it over wheat flour.

 

[Bill G]

A fair amount as I like Hispanic food and dent corn is used to make tortilla chips and tortillas. Masa is commonly exported food product to regions that prefer it over wheat flour.

You did not answer my question. I very respectfully asked you a question and got what I feel with a smart-mouth reply, I asked you how much yellow dent corn did you eat last year and your reply was ...a fair amount.,,, If you would like to have a honest and factual conversation regarding the issue then it would be best to answer with honest and factual answers and leave the smart-arse sarcasm aside.

I ask again a very simple question. How much yellow dent corn did you eat last year.

 

[John Lyngdal]

You did not answer my question. I very respectfully asked you a question and got what I feel with a smart-mouth reply, I asked you how much yellow dent corn did you eat last year and your reply was ...a fair amount.,,, If you would like to have a honest and factual conversation regarding the issue then it would be best to answer with honest and factual answers and leave the smart-arse sarcasm aside.

I ask again a very simple question. How much yellow dent corn did you eat last year.

Why would I even bother to keep numerical account of my consumption of food products commonly produced from dent corn? I know I commonly consume items that contain dent corn, which is the best answer I could provide.

 

[Bill G]

Why would I even bother to keep numerical account of my consumption of food products commonly produced from dent corn? I know I commonly consume items that contain dent corn, which is the best answer I could provide.

So you chose to make claims with no ZERO evidence to support those claims. You typed the words no one else did. Prior to typing I assume like anyone else you had personal knowledge to support what you typed. If you need a reminder of what you typed it was ......Worst of all you have increased the cost of a bushel of corn, adversely impacting the nutritional intake of the less fortunate..... I assume you yourself are not among what you yourself call the less fortunate so your nutritional intake should be higher. That is exactly why I asked you a very simple question tp answer and you have simply failed to answer.


If you want to make claims then back them with REAL LIFE facts. How much yellow dent corn did you consume last year or in any 12 month period. You made the claim so you have the facts to support it

 

[HansFranz]

How much yellow dent corn did you eat last year

Probably several tons -- indirectly -- as a feedstock for the animals I ate.
According to USDA, corn accounts for >95% "of total feed grain production and use" in the U.S.

Apply that figure to beef, and for every 100# of beef I ate, the steers that produced the beef ate over a metric ton of corn.

Not to mention the corn squeezins I mighta drank or eaten as HFCS sweetener.

 

[John Lyngdal]

So you chose to make claims with no ZERO evidence to support those claims. You typed the words no one else did. Prior to typing I assume like anyone else you had personal knowledge to support what you typed. If you need a reminder of what you typed it was ......Worst of all you have increased the cost of a bushel of corn, adversely impacting the nutritional intake of the less fortunate..... I assume you yourself are not among what you yourself call the less fortunate so your nutritional intake should be higher. That is exactly why I asked you a very simple question tp answer and you have simply failed to answer.


If you want to make claims then back them with REAL LIFE facts. How much yellow dent corn did you consume last year or in any 12 month period. You made the claim so you have the facts to support it

Sometimes asking a "simple" question for a retrospective assessment is a tactic, not a quest for knowledge or insight. For instance, if I wanted to determine your carbon footprint, is asking for how many breaths you took last year and the CO2 content of them germane to the primary topic? It's not, as your energy consumption is the dominant contributor. Further, my personal consumption of dent corn isn't numerically significant in the global picture, as the macro view drives the impacts and repercussions.

For a person who is demanding facts, I see none in your posts on the topic. Then again, it is easier to request nonsense, than provide information or support a position.



http://foodorfuel.weebly.com/https://news.cornell.edu/stories/2001/08/ethanol-corn-faulted-energy-waster-scientist-sayshttps://www.forbes.com/sites/willia...ng-food-crisis-blame-ethanol/?sh=5d9829e22159https://www.wsj.com/articles/food-fight-heats-up-for-ethanol-11649702881https://www.science.org/doi/abs/10.1126/science.1177970http://faculty.washington.edu/kmstraus/100/TilmanBiofuels.pdfhttps://www.reuters.com/business/en...climate-than-gasoline-study-finds-2022-02-14/https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/...ol-fuels-food-crisis-in-developing-countries/https://pre-sustainability.com/articles/growing-biofuels-causes-food-shortages-myth-or-not/

 

[ValleyForge]

The corn/ethanol lobbyists throw some bangin parties in DC, only outdone by the Obamacare lobbyists…

 

[grizz55chev]

Let me guess you didn't watch the analysis in the attached video.
OK, the short form is this.
Corn is one of the most energy/fertilizer/pesticide intensive crops to grow and harvest.
It takes even more energy to ferment and distill off the ethanol.
The fermentation effluent has little secondary use, and available need requires fresh product.
https://www.e-education.psu.edu/egee439/node/649In the end, the generation of ethanol for fuel consumes more energy than is present in the end product.
If it was economically feasible, the government wouldn't have to subsidize the effort.
Worst of all you have increased the cost of a bushel of corn, adversely impacting the nutritional intake of the less fortunate.

Big oil is and has been heavily subsidized, so that argument is moot.

 

[ValleyForge]

Big oil is and has been heavily subsidized, so that argument is moot.

Yep…but they only get back a small fraction of what they pay….

 

[grizz55chev]

Fossil Fuels Received $5.9 Trillion In Subsidies in 2020, Report Finds

 

[John Lyngdal]

Subsidies... There's a fun discussion topic.
If they function like a kick starter program, I think they offer a solid value.
If they are long-term effort to suppress the true cost of a commodity, their value becomes a bit murky.

 

[OM617YOTA]

Hey Grizz, post a link. What is considered a subsidy?