Safe temperature range, PE Summit

[U&A]

Title says it all.

So this is my first winter with an EPA stove. Iv used it 3 times now. First two were just to get the paint smell out of the stove with the windows open in the house. last night i pushed it the furthest yet getting a stove top high temp of 720. Damper on the stove all the way on low.

All the temps im talking are stove top temps read with this.\/\/\/


https://www.amazon.com/Etekcity-Las..._SY340_QL65&keywords=infrared+temperature+gun


IN your opinion, what is a safe stove top temperature range to be in with a steel stove like my PE Summit?

assuming you have loaded it up recently and it is now burning efficiently with the damper all the way on low....something around 500-700 (700 max) is optimal. I would start to get concerned when it gets much over 700 I would think.

Is this reasonable?


Being a welder and i know by using our massive stress reliving oven that mild steel glows orange to red in there at 1150 degrees and we start to see some dull color around 900.

Don’t know if it is worth saying but i have a straight stove pipe, double wall to the bottom of the box and double wall stainless insulated from there to the cap. Pipe is about 12’ tall.

I have read during searching that 400-700 is good, with 700 being the MAX you should safely/ comfortably reach before having to worry. Honestly, I would like to see it hover around 600 MAX i think but I’m just guessing.

I have been waiting for the stove to go below 300 AND down to mostly coals before even thinking about adding any significant sized pc or pc’s of wood to avoid overfireing.

I honestly just need some basic guidelines whether they are your personal opinions from experience or something you have gotten from a manufacture. My manual does not reference temperatures at all just basically says if your stove parts are turning red you’re too hot. I’d rather not have that be my guidelines. Number are nice to go by if possible.

I’m going to call the manufacture on Monday to see what they say but I don’t blame them if they are not comfortable giving me a temperature to shoot for as that places liabilities on them..


I much appreciate your help,
Thank you



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[CaseyForrest]

I think you're on the right track. I personally wouldn't push it past 600, but that's based on our own personal use. We heat the majority of 2600 sq ft with a soapstone stove that has a max operating temp of 500. The old cast iron stove I would normally run right around 600.

Iv found that the key to running an EPA stove, efficiently and with the least amount of wood is to get the stove hot with an initial burn. Smallish splits, kindling and the like. Secondaries will kick in faster if the stove is hot. Then load the stove, full. Get the flu temp up to around 500 degrees. At this point the secondaries should be firing. Then shut the air down. Do not reload the stove until all you have is about a 1-2" bed of coals. Wash, rinse, repeat. Our stove will maintain 500 degree stove top temp with just the secondaries firing and the air on low. Sometimes, I even have to plug the air inlet with a wad of tin foil because even on low, the stove will get hot.

And most importantly... Seasoned wood. Another thing Ive found.... Wood that's to wet will require far to much air to keep burning and you end up loading the stove more then you should. ON THE OTHER HAND, wood that's to dry, and you get an out of control burn. 15-20% moisture is your target. Anything drier and you've got to have the ability to choke the air off otherwise you risk an over fired stove. Ive got some 7 year dead white ash whats been cut and split for 2 years that I have to plug the air inlet otherwise the stove gets to hot. Right now I have some 2 year cut and split hickory and oak that's still a little to wet, but fires the secondaries off just fine. The oak and hickory burns for a really long time with the air shut off. 4 splits will last right around 4-5 hours with a stove temp of 400 degrees. If the wood was a little drier, the stove temp would likely be closer to 500 with the same amount of air intake.

 

[U&A]

Great info sir^^^
I did get just a little nervous when I hit 700 and then reach 720. But I have a buddy with a pellet stove and he says his maxes out at 700 and He really can’t get it any higher than that so he runs it at that all the time. Thats why i was “OK” with 700, but i still didn’t like it.




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[U&A]

I can’t really read stove pipe temps with my double wall pipe in the house so the best I can do with that is take a reading right at that collar welded to the top of the stove that the pipe is attached to.

if I remember right, last night that never got much higher than 500. It may have reached close to 600....If it did it was not for very long at all.

Is that where I should be reading temps? At that welded on collar i speak of?

or is reading the temp at my stove top a reasonable place to do it?



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[CaseyForrest]

Oh... something else to remember... The stove getting hot can lead to a perpetual cycle... As the secondaries start to fire, and the stove continues to get hot.. The secondaries continue to increase output, which leads to the stove continuing to heat up. Just something to keep in mind, its not like a non epa stove where you set the air and thats the fire you get. You have to think of the secondaries as an auxiliary heat output almost independent of the fire itself. Our stove will normally run with just the secondaries burning and no visible flame from the wood.

 

[U&A]

Oh... something else to remember... The stove getting hot can lead to a perpetual cycle... As the secondaries start to fire, and the stove continues to get hot.. The secondaries continue to increase output, which leads to the stove continuing to heat up. Just something to keep in mind, its not like a non epa stove where you set the air and thats the fire you get. You have to think of the secondaries as an auxiliary heat output almost independent of the fire itself. Our stove will normally run with just the secondaries burning and no visible flame from the wood.

That’s exactly what I learned last night. You could not see any of the wood itself burning just the secondary was blowing flames down onto the word. Here’s the video when I was at 720. It’s very impressive.... to me anyhow.

Sorry the video is fuzzy. For some reason this keeps happening when loading videos from my phone to YouTube.




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[CaseyForrest]

I can’t really read stove pipe temps with my double wall pipe in the house so the best I can do with that is take a reading right at that collar welded to the top of the stove that the pipe is attached to.

if I remember right, last night that never got much higher than 500. It may have reached close to 600....If it did it was not by very much and for very long at all.

Is that where I should be reading temps? At that welded on collar i speak of?

or is reading the temp at my stove top a reasonable place to do it?



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The recommended point to read flue temps is 18" above the collar. You can get a flue thermometer made for double wall pipe. It requires you to drill a hole in the pipe and insert the probe.

500 is on the lower end of where I like to see flue temps 18" above the stove. You'd be surprised how much the gasses cool as they go up the chimney. We have a very tall chimney, 10' of single wall and 16ish' of double wall above the roof. If I'm at 500 at the stove, Ill be 300 at the ceiling.

Good flue temps are also a byproduct of seasoned wood. Wood that's to wet requires more air to maintain stove and flue temps. Which means you're burning more wood than you need to. Wood that's to dry can create a flue temp that's to high.... Which can be very bad if you've been burning wood that's to wet...

 

[U&A]

I have hesitated to put a stove pipe thermometer in as i see such a WIDE range of opinions on each product. Good reviews to terrible. I don’t know what brand to get honestly.

Im not afraid to spend money on a good one. Any recommendations?


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[CaseyForrest]

That’s exactly what I learned last night. You could not see any of the wood itself burning just the secondary was blowing flames down onto the word. Here’s the video when I was at 720. It’s very impressive.... to me anyhow.

Sorry the video is fuzzy. For some reason this keeps happening when loading videos from my phone to YouTube.

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Yep, that's what it looks like. The wood will almost burn from the top down. But not without a hot stove and a good bed of coals. If the stove is cold, the secondaries will not remain ignited.

 

[CaseyForrest]

I have hesitated to put a stove pipe thermometer in as i see such a WIDE range of opinions on each product. Good reviews to terrible. I don’t know what brand to get honestly.

Im not afraid to spend money on a good one. Any recommendations?


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Ive regulated myself to buying cheap ones because they don't really last very long. I have a magnet one sitting on the flue and one with a scale specifically for soap stone on top of the stove. This year I'm comfortable not setting the stove top thermometer out. Ive gotten a pretty good read on the stove and how it behaves.

I usually grab the Red Devil ones whenever they are on sale.

 

[CaseyForrest]

Here's ours purring along on autopilot. Flue temp is right at 500 and stove temp is 400.

And just to give you an idea on temp variance in the flue, its 620 at the collar and 230 at the ceiling.

sent from a field

 

[Ronaldo]

That’s exactly what I learned last night. You could not see any of the wood itself burning just the secondary was blowing flames down onto the word. Here’s the video when I was at 720. It’s very impressive.... to me anyhow.

Sorry the video is fuzzy. For some reason this keeps happening when loading videos from my phone to YouTube.




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That's a beautiful secondary combustion.......getting great efficiency and heat. That is exactly what my PE Super 27 looks like. Nice flames and burn coming out of the baffle holes. Mine has been heating our 2000 SF home for 15 yrs. I love it.

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[U&A]

So we agree that 600 stove top is a reasonable MAX. And i may have been to hot with a 720 stove top temp.


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[U&A]

That's a beautiful secondary combustion.......getting great efficiency and heat. That is exactly what my PE Super 27 looks like. Nice flames and burn coming out of the baffle holes. Mine has been heating our 2000 SF home for 15 yrs. I love it.

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15years. Good to hear.


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[U&A]

Found this

https://woodheat.org/thermometers.html


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[bubmiller]

So we agree that 600 stove top is a reasonable MAX. And i may have been to hot with a 720 stove top temp.


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I heat with a different brand stove of similar design and in cold weather run every load to 700- 750.
Several times when someone else was running it I've showed up to find it over 900. It's not glowing yet at that temperature.

It's a heavy steel box. It's not going to explode, implode, or melt into a puddle. Repeated extreme temps will likely warp the steel baffle inside (in a pe summit) as several of my friends have found out. High temps will also kill a thermometer. I just use an ir gun now.

As you run your stove more you will find your own comfort zone. But don't panic if you find your stove hotter than that.



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