Wood drying questions from a new guy

[CWME]

Two questions for you experienced wood burners... I am getting ready for my first year(s) of full time wood burning. I have already cut/split/stacked 4 cords of Red Oak mid February. Now with all the mild weather Family and friends are asking for trees to be cut. Looks like I will be able to get at least 2 years supply free. opcorn:

Note: I have the wood stacked under a leanto that is open on three sides. The piles are two widths wide with a foot or so between the piles for air.

Here is question 1... Will this be seasoned enough to burn next fall? My Dad insists that this will not be ready until the following year.

Second question which relates to the first. A buddy of mine agrees with my Dad and suggests I buy one of those tarp carports to put my wood in. He says that the dark colored carport acts as a mild kiln and will dry the wood out by next fall. Anyone have experience with this? Makes sense because his is warm inside even in really cold weather as long as the sun is out.

Saws...
Husky 41
Husky 455 Rancher
Stihl 021 (was given this saw, really a neat little rig)
Stihl MS 440 Magnum, bought this used and all I have to say is "WOW" what a rig.

 

[stihlcountry]

I don,t burn any Oak until it,s 2 years old. We have alot of Red and White Oak here in N.C. The first year I leave it out uncoverd in all the the elements,sun, wind, rain, whatever hits it. The 2nd year I just cover the top of the stack. You can let Oak sit 3 even 4 years and it,ll get even better. I,m sure there will be a bunch more replys here to fill you in on how they season their hardwood. Your in the right forum to get all the info you need. Welcome to AS. :greenchainsaw:

 

[howellhandmade]

Burn it in what? Split how small? I wound up burning some oak from last spring this past winter when I ran out of 2-year seasoned locust. It burned all right, even in an EPA non-cat insert. Some pieces were lighter than others and I know some BTUs were wasted compared to what it will be next winter, but it's what I had.

The main thing is to have a good handle on your chimney to avoid creosote buildup. If you can monitor that easily, the difference between nine months and 18 months is a good/better/best thing. With a full summer of seasoning in the sun and wind you could be all right, especially if you split it fairly small. The carport business strikes me as barstool physics.

Now, if you happen to come across some ash or cherry for the Fall to give the oak a few more months it wouldn't hurt.

Jack

 

[lone wolf]

one year should work well.

 

[mdotis]

I like to cut my oak in the winter before I burn it. I usually limit myself to stuff cut, split and stacked by March. Anything after that gets burned the following year. Keep in mind that I have an outdoor burner so build up is not a concern. I know that if I could get a few years a head I would get more heat out of the oak but after a good winter spring and summer it burns OK for me. If I was burning in the house I would give it a lot more time to dry. Oak can never be to dry.....

 

[Grateful11]

I don,t burn any Oak until it,s 2 years old. We have alot of Red and White Oak here in N.C. The first year I leave it out uncoverd in all the the elements,sun, wind, rain, whatever hits it. The 2nd year I just cover the top of the stack. You can let Oak sit 3 even 4 years and it,ll get even better. I,m sure there will be a bunch more replys here to fill you in on how they season their hardwood. Your in the right forum to get all the info you need. Welcome to AS. :greenchainsaw:

2 years seems a bit extreme IMHO. Red Oak should dry out faster than
White but still 2 years? Red Oak I believe is porous enough to actually
blow air through so it should dry out fairly quickly. Personally I only cut
dead, down or trees in the way for firewood, I'm no tree hugger but there's
plenty of deadwood out there to cut.

http://www.wood-database.com/wood-articles/distinguishing-red-oak-from-white-oak/

 

[deerlakejens]

Your lean-to will probably work more more efficiently than the waterproof car port that may actually hold moisture in, unless you have some type of fan system to move the air in it. A year of seasoning has always been more than adequate for me.

 

[lobsta1]

Maine is a LOT different than NC. I've been burning for 35 years now & two years ago I switched from an old Russo to a new EPA stove. What burned in the old stove is an exercise in frustration in the new stove. I do burn a lot of red oak & keep it under an open 3-sided lean-to. I've found that if I want to burn with ONLY 2 years seasoning, then I have to cut it shorter & split it smaller than lighter woods cut in the winter & burned the next season.

In the new EPA stoves you will not get a proper secondary burn, you will have smoky glass, you will have creosote buildup & you WON'T get enough heat. You will get a big bed of unburned coals & your house will start cooling down while you are trying to get those coals burnt. You will also go through twice as much wood trying to get warm.

Think of it this way: water turns to steam at 212F. Secondary burn of the gasses is at over 1000F. How do you get to the higher temp if you are pumping out all that water vapor at the lower temp?

Forget about the oak for next season & start concentrating on trying to get some nice ash, cherry or even maple. You can burn that next year.
Al
P.S. This is what I am talking about.
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=130074

 

[peterc38]

To the OP,

I'm in Maine just like you. All of the wood that I burned this past winter was seasoned 9-12 months. I had about a 50/50 mix of red oak and maple. The maple seasoned faster but the red oak was still ok, even better than ok. I purposefully split a little smaller to attempt to facilitate seasoning. I agree that with red oak, generally speaking longer is better but I think you will be fine to get by for this year. Like some have suggested, try to mix in some other more seasoned stuff if possible.

:greenchainsaw:

 

[Rudedog]

Do you guys stack it on pallets, plastic or directly on the ground?

 

[xrayman]

Do you guys stack it on pallets, plastic or directly on the ground?

Pallets or old fence posts to get it up off the ground to get air movement under it. if you stack it directly on the ground it's probably going to rott the wood on the bottom.

 

[peterc38]

Do you guys stack it on pallets, plastic or directly on the ground?

I stack on pallets. Get 'em free from work. :greenchainsaw:

 

[CWME]

Thanks for all the replies... now for answers to questions...

I bought a Summers Heat/New Englander EPA approved stove from Lowes. $1100 stove on clearance for $824 AND it qualifies for the 30% tax rebate to boot! I fired it up in the yard to cure the paint and I can see what Lobsta1 is saying with the secondary burn. I had the air wide open burning pallets and it really put a damper on the fire. I can see how partially seasoned wood could be a real mess.

Splitting... To get you an idea take an 8" round and split it into four pieces. That has been the size I have been shooting for. I figured the smaller pieces should help with the drying time. Once I get a few years supply on tap I want to go with the one spit on an 8" round. Length has been about 20" give or take a few. Been cutting firewood for family for years at 15" so the eye reverts back to that length=) Cut a ton of wood over the years, just never had a house with a chimney and stove.

I have a chimney brush and mirror to inspect things as I am burning. I had the mason put the inlet pipe to the chimney 6' off the floor so I have plenty of room to work for cleaning.

My Buddy's car port has vents at the ridge line and he folds up the flaps at the bottom on the sides. In theory it seems to be a good idea. But I don't have $800 to find out.

All the wood I have so far is stacked on pallets.

Unfortunately 98% of the wood I have so far is Red Oak. I have two small trees I cut on Sat that are maple but aside from those everything is Oak. I have at least 3 cords of trees to cut at my Sister's house which I believe are Beech. But i won't be able to get to those for another few weeks. They are still on the stump.

So in summary it sounds like the oak will be ok to burn but not the best choice for less than a year seasoning.

I appreciate all the responses you guys have given.

 

[WoodchuckPaddy]

I have a lean-to that is open all 4 sides.
Last year I stacked 8 cords on pallets green.
Split to about the same spec as you do
Maple, Red and white oak, ash and birch mostly.

Essentially the wood seasoned undercover.
Never got wet once it was stacked in the shed.

Everything burned fine in my non CAT stove.
Forget the black tarp thingy and oven idea. Overthinking IMO.

Alot depends on the when you cut the wood.
More moisture in spring/ summer- less in fall winter.

I'm two years ahead now, so my wood will be dryer than a popcorn fart.
Very nice.

My one change for this year is 1" crushed stone on the ground under the woodshed instead of pallets.
I'm going to stack directly on that with some cross pieces.
I'm tired of getting my foot stuck and tripping on the gaps in the pallets.
Also, I can drive the wheelbarrow right to where I want it.

Overall, I think you will be fine.

 

[WoodchuckPaddy]

BTW

Red oak is my favorite to split stack and BURN!

 

[woodbooga]

I've burnt 7 month seasoned red oak. Split wickid fine. I lived to tell about it but do not recommend. Oak's real dense and is mighty stingy about letting go of its moisture.

To me, one year seems too short. 2 years might be a little more than is needed, but more seasoned is better than less. 18 months seems good.

I'd suggest hunting for deadfall where you're cutting to supplement some of the maple you'll be into. That'll be the safest route. Also, the most efficient since you'll be getting the most outta your oak (heat not steam) in 2011-12.

I'm in the same climate. I stack outdoors in full exposure to rain, sun, wind until a dry spell in the fall when the winter's supply is brought under a barn roof.

 

[Grateful11]

Maine is a LOT different than NC. I've been burning for 35 years now & two years ago I switched from an old Russo to a new EPA stove. What burned in the old stove is an exercise in frustration in the new stove. I do burn a lot of red oak & keep it under an open 3-sided lean-to. I've found that if I want to burn with ONLY 2 years seasoning, then I have to cut it shorter & split it smaller than lighter woods cut in the winter & burned the next season.

In the new EPA stoves you will not get a proper secondary burn, you will have smoky glass, you will have creosote buildup & you WON'T get enough heat. You will get a big bed of unburned coals & your house will start cooling down while you are trying to get those coals burnt. You will also go through twice as much wood trying to get warm.

Think of it this way: water turns to steam at 212F. Secondary burn of the gasses is at over 1000F. How do you get to the higher temp if you are pumping out all that water vapor at the lower temp?

Forget about the oak for next season & start concentrating on trying to get some nice ash, cherry or even maple. You can burn that next year.
Al
P.S. This is what I am talking about.
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=130074

That's good to know because we've been looking at a new Buck 81 stove to
replace our 30 some year old Buck that will basically burn anything. May
have to rethink our decision. The new Buck is a non-catalytic stove but I
was wondering if they have to be burned a lot different from the older
stoves. Replacing the old stove, a 6" flex SS liner, installation removal of
old stove and cleaning the 9"x12" before installing the new liner is like $2900.
There's like a $900 tax credit on the entire system through this year.

Thanks for the info. on the drying of wood for newer stoves. How about standing dead Elm that's rock solid, would it be ready for next year, got
2 of those that need bringing down?

http://www.buckstove.com/wood/model81.html

 

[Rudedog]

Be careful about those tax credits for woodstoves and other Federal Government energy upgrades. I forget the term but these are unfunded tax credits. You won't qualify if you don't owe any taxes. If you owe taxes at the end of the year you will probably be "ok". There are those whose income is low enough that they qualify for "earned income credit". Those people would not qualify for the woodstove nenergy rebate. It is not as straight forward as the stove sales people make it sound. Hence the very small print "check with your accountant" when they make the pitch.

 

[Dale]

Myself, I don't like burning any DENSER live wood after only 1 season of drying time. 1 season drying time is really a relevant term though right ? I don't start working wood until after Xmas, so from the time I cut, until my first burn is really only about 9 1/2 months. I WOULD NOT burn live Oak with that short amount of season time, nor would I burn live Locust or Elm for instance. These are dense hardwoods. Cherry and Maple on the other hand, no problem if you split to the size you mentioned. You'll know that your wood isn't seasoned when you put a log onto hot coals and it starts hissing and you see water bubbles escaping. If you do, stop burning. You're wasting good wood and gettting very little heat value.

BTW. Standing DEAD Elm with absolutely no bark, I'll cut split, and burn the same day. That is one HOT BURNER too.

 

[CWME]

Thank you for all the replies. I am going to try to get to my Sisters house and get those Beech trees on the ground and bucked up this weekend. I will pile the rest of the oak rounds for now and worry about splitting those later.

I cleared some small scrub brush on my lot so I can stack the Beech where it will have full sun exposure from morning to night. Need to find some pallets to stack it on now.