Need help with Stihl 056 ignition fix using Nova II module

[tntatro]

I think I made a small amount of progress. I kept advancing it and at 1-1/8" it would pull back sometimes.

I got it to start and decided to try a brand new spark plug. It started much easier but after a while it was hard again. I put in another new plug and got the same results. I checked the gap on all the plugs I tried and they were all slightly wide. I set the gaps to .020", some slightly less and it starts a little easier now but still not how I want.

I brought the flywheel back to 1/2" advanced and got similar results without the pull back from the cord. I suspect the coil itself may be bad because after it gets nice and warmed up it won't start back up after shutting it down. Strangely, if I can't get it to start then I can put a different plug in and it will start. The plugs aren't even getting overly hot either.

I'm going to try less advancement and see what happens now that the plug gaps are set. It will idle around 2,300-2,400 rpm okay but the chain still slightly advances. I guess it needs new clutch springs but these saws usually idle a little lower. If I turn the idle screw out any more then it won't hardly touch the throttle lever and will stall.

 

[tntatro]

I just tried less advancement and anything less than 1/2" advanced will not start. At 1 - 1/8" advanced it gets uncomfortable from pullback on the cord.

I set it at 7/8" advanced and put a plug with .020" gap in and it seems to start and run properly except the idle is slightly higher than I like, the chain advances slightly and if I hold it clutch side down for a while it sometimes stalls or the idle slows.

It passed a pressure vacuum test so I'm thinking maybe a carb rebuild and clutch springs. I still have to put it to work and see how it holds up though.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

If you can hold it with the clutch side down and the idle slows down it's possible you might need the clutch side crank seal. I had that on a Super XL and it worked fine after I changed the seal.

 

[tntatro]

It has new clutch side bearings with the original seal and I gave it a pressure/vac test when I put it together and then another one a few days ago to see if it sprung a leak since then. The flywheel side also has a new oem seal and bearings. This is the older model 045 with the seal built into the clutch side bearings.

 

[tntatro]

I ran it a little today doing some light milling. It cuts good and I discovered why it has been hard to start cold. There is a piece broke off on the top cover where a screw used to go above the carb linkage. Without that screw in the choke doesn't fully engage. Fixed it by bending the linkage up. It still wants to stall when turned sideways. I may do a pressure/vac test and hold it sideways and see if that shows a leak. Still waiting on carb kit and clutch springs.

The air coming out of the exhaust after a cut is much cooler on the 045 super than the 056 magnum. Are there ways to make a saw run cooler? They both have foam air filters and dual port mufflers. The compression on the magnum was 145 psi I think, last I checked. Used a .5mm cylinder gasket. Rings probably not broke in yet. The 045 was around 170 psi, no cylinder gasket and new rings.

I would have thought the 045 would be hotter considering the higher compression.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I'm sure there are several things you can do to affect the exhaust temp. Might try a muffler mod on some saws, along with fiddling with the timing and fuel mixture.

 

[tntatro]

It's looking like I've got things figured out but not positive. Today I just did a pressure test on the fuel line and it doesn't hold. No holes, just lost its elasticity around the fitting. Couldn't find a replacement with the same part number so I ordered some line that fits Husqvarna and ordered an OEM Husqvarna fuel filter. Hopefully that will fit. The leaky line might explain a high idle and stalling when turned on side. I must have had the tuning compensated for the leak and when turned on its side it would idle too low.

So the real issues - Timing needed to be advanced due to new module and the choke lever not fully closing due to broken screw piece on top cover caused difficult starting.

The final problem I suspect but have not yet confirmed is a leaky fuel line causing high idle and stalling when on its side due to compensation of carb settings.

 

[Rookie1]

Keep us posted.

 

[tntatro]

I got tired of waiting for my OEM Husqvarna fuel line and filter to come in so I used a fuel line to an 038 magnum and an old Husqvarna filter that was on a 50 cc Pioneer Partner saw. I also soaked the carburetor in parts cleaner for a few days and then cleaned it and put a new kit in it and also put new springs in the clutch.

It no longer changes rpm or stalls when I turn it. It will now idle around 2,200 rpm. The chain still almost wants to advance slightly. It will idle at lower rpm but it still seems like something isn't quite right.

It seems to idle hard if that makes any sense. Each time it "blubs" it seems as though it's blubbing too hard and that is when the chain wants to advance. One of my 056 magnums has a nice smooth idle, the other blubs a little hard also but not so much that the chain advances.

Any ideas on what is going on, if anyone even knows what I am talking about?

One difference in the smooth idling 056 is that I didn't put in new rings. The other saws both got new Caber rings. I've noticed that old, used OEM rings tend to have really wide ring end gaps...

Or maybe it's a timing issue. Anyone know or have a good theory?

 

[tntatro]

Keep us posted.

The Husqvarna fuel line does not fit the gas tank fitting in the o56. I ended up using an 038 fuel line and the OEM Husqvarna fuel filter. I had to drill the hole in the weight that came with the filter to 3/8" so it could fit on the fuel line. The 038 fuel line is good because it is extra long to accommodate the long Husqvarna filter. This fixed the problem of stalling when turned on its side but not the chain advancing problem. I think it's a good alternative to the original set up.

I decided to remove the cylinder and add a cylinder gasket to see if it would idle better. I had used Threebond to make a gasket when it was having trouble starting a while back to see if it would help. The compression was pretty high at 170psi so I thought maybe if I drop the psi the chain would quit advancing. The piston is in significantly worse condition than it was when I put it together. It originally had some scoring on the intake side and now it has another deep score mark on the intake and wear and light scoring on the exhaust side. I had not run it very much, just a few days.

I put in a .5 mm cylinder gasket and a lightly used aftermarket Golf piston with Caber rings. It still runs the same. I'll run it like this for a bit and then check the piston. If it destroys this piston then I may just get a new ignition. I was hoping this would make a good alternative if the foggysail fix doesn't work but I can't seem to get it going right.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Sounds like ignition might be too far advanced. If it runs good at higher speed but won't idle well and possibly kicks back at starting you might have a timing issue. I checked my 031 with an automotive timing light and a lawn mower battery, I turned the engine over with a 16v drill. Seems like I also removed the spark plug.

 

[tntatro]

I readjusted the flywheel so it is now advanced 1/2". It was advanced 7/8". It seems to be slightly better but not much. If I advance it any less it may be too hard to start. It tends to flood at idle. It will idle for a while but if it stalls then it is hard to start back up. I guess I better get a timing light.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

In your case you probably need a timing light. You can probably find the timing specs on Acres chainsaw site.

 

[tntatro]

Before I get a timing light I'm going to try and figure out how to do it with a degree wheel that I just printed out.

 

[Okie]

I did not read all of this thread but I got into the same type results with Nova II chips.
I bought some of the 2 terminal that allowed for reversing the polarity.

One same saw one wanted neg polarity and the engine was out of time, but would run and the chip failed all at once when testing. Never did get to the woodlot.
The other chip wanted pos polarity and the saw was out of time when it finally started. It would not start with neg polarity but had out of time fire. (pull rope had severe kickback)
You can get a sackful of the chips and very few will [produce the same results most likely due to the use of low end electronic components inside the chips.

One guy said he removed the flywheel key to get his saw in time enough to start and was running the saw without suing a key.


When I contacted the vendor for a refund the said don't bother returning them, throw them in the trash and refund sent and the company selling them said they are going to stop offering the chips due to continous complaints. They were the Rotary brand chips. You can do a search and maybe find a thread about 4 mos' old on the subject of using the chips in chainsaws.

Summary: You need to stick with a original type ignition and forget about Nova II chips.
I was trying the chips because I could install them without having to pull the flywheel, just cut the points wire and wire in the module. The saw was running good with the points and I had other saws w I thought maybe I might use the chips on if the points started giving problems and not have to pull the flywheel, etc.

The Nova II chips are severely over rated and not reliable.


I've had points type ignition last for 30 years

 

[tntatro]

I did not read all of this thread but I got into the same type results with Nova II chips.
I bought some of the 2 terminal that allowed for reversing the polarity.

One same saw one wanted neg polarity and the engine was out of time, but would run and the chip failed all at once when testing. Never did get to the woodlot.
The other chip wanted pos polarity and the saw was out of time when it finally started. It would not start with neg polarity but had out of time fire. (pull rope had severe kickback)
You can get a sackful of the chips and very few will [produce the same results most likely due to the use of low end electronic components inside the chips.


When I contacted the vendor for a refund the said don't bother returning them, throw them in the trash and refund sent and the company selling them said they are going to stop offering the chips due to continous complaints. They were the Rotary brand chips. You can do a search and maybe find a thread about 4 mos' old on the subject of using the chips in chainsaws.

Summary: You need to stick with a original type ignition and forget about Nova II chips.
I was trying the chips because I could install them without having to pull the flywheel, just cut the points wire and wire in the module. The saw was running good with the points and I had other saws w I thought maybe I might use the chips on if the points started giving problems and not have to pull the flywheel, etc.

The Nova II chips are severely over rated and not reliable.


I've had points type ignition last for 30 years

This was a Bosch electronic ignition. The rest of the ignition failed but the coil itself is still good. I believe it is a different coil that was used for the points ignitions. It has a different part number anyway.

Stihl also makes a module similar to the Nova II but costs a lot more. I could get a used one for around $20. There are also modules from Germany for around $15 + shipping. There is also an aftermarket ignition compatible with the Bosch electronic ignition flywheel for around $110 shipped. I believe it is common to have timing issues when you use a non original/modified ignition but I think the timing can be corrected. You've made a good point. Yes, for $10 - $15 the Nova II is cheap so I shouldn't expect much. I guess I should try other options.

I also have another Nova II module, maybe I'll switch to see what happens.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I forgot to mention about reversing leads if the timing is off. I would try reversing the leads before I would try a different chip.

 

[Okie]

I forgot to mention about reversing leads if the timing is off. I would try reversing the leads before I would try a different chip.

Right about reversing the polarity if timing is off: I was using the 2 termi9nal version that allows for reversing polarity.
The Rotary single terminal is fixed a neg polarity.
The instructions with the two terminal indicates start with neg polarity and if engine don't run properly try reversing polarity to pos.

Polarity is determined by the direction of rotation of the flywheel. (but I found that the 2 terminal Rotary Nova II chips would fire with either polarity but timing would change when reversing polarity and also timing would vary from chip to chip.
If I had a saw that was running good (with points or otherwise) I would take a Inductive pickup timing light (type light with the timing advance adjustment would also be great) and check the timing as a timing reference BEFORE experimenting with changing to other types of ignition systems so as I would know when timing is correct.(or how much the timing changed from the witness reference)

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Those electronic chips are okay, I've used them myself, but I would never change one over if I had access to a new set of points..The points type are very easy to set timing, just rotate the points plate slightly or make the points gap bigger or smaller.

 

[tntatro]

It seems as though I have it figured out. I haven't put it to work yet but it seems to idle pretty good now and starts easily. The throttle response is good and it doesn't flood at idle. The chain still wants to advance but I can get it to idle low enough without stalling to make it stop. I think when it's warmed up it will stop advancing.

A while back when I was first making adjustments for the timing I turned the stator plate all the way clockwise hoping that it would start. It didn't start so I started making adjustments to the flywheel. What I did last night was set the stator plate back to where it should be with the timing marks lined up and then advanced the flywheel 1". I didn't think it mattered where the plate was set if I was changing the flywheel but now it seems to be running normal.

I still have to put it to work and then inspect the piston to make sure nothing bad is happening in there but judging by the way it starts, idles and revs it seems to be good. I also added a lightly used Golf piston with Caber rings and a .5 mm cylinder gasket. That took the compression from 170psi to around 145psi. Not as powerful but maybe easier on the bearings.

I never did get a timing light but now I may not need one.