Man Suffocates after dead palm fronds slide down over him. Cali, 8/03

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FSburt

FSburt

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Man Suffocates after dead palm fronds slide down over him.

Was reading the paper yester day and here is this article about a climber getting pinned against the stem by 800 pounds of dry fronds. Sound like he was up 45 ft and was trimming from the bottom and the vibrations caused the fronds to slide down the stem like a donut down a shaft. He was pinned between the stem and the branches. This happened around 3 pm. Firefighters were dispatched a 3:14 pm. A fire truck arrived at 3:46 pm but could not retyieve him with a the ladder becaouse it was deemed inappropiate for the task. At 4 pm a Climber from Visalia arived and made the body recovery in about 5 minutes. Sounds like this is not the first time this has happened around here Batt cheif made comment about 10 12 other incidents in Tulare, Fresno and Kings counties. I have never worked on palms but souds like they are pretty sketchy. Unfortunate the deceses was 31 yrs old. :(
 
This thread is not about bashing fireman but how unfortunate that some of this type of stuff is not preplanned beforehand about having a treeclimber on call when ever there is a tree rescue. Don't now if it would have saved this fellow unless his groundman could have climbed but he was alive for aliitle while after because he yelled to his cousin on the gound that he was going to die becuase he could'nt breathe. Also one fire truck had a 75 ft ladder but could not find a tree climber for the rescue. I guess the fireman did not feel comfortable goinup that high on a ladder. Anybody ever have this happen to them on a smaller scale though.
 
I've never worked a palm tree. Could someone explain to me the mechanics of how/what and why this happened? I'm sorry, but I don't quite get it.:confused:

Condolensces to the climbers' family. :(
 
The Fla guys like Brian and Spydy etc. have probably worked a LOT more palms than I but to answer your question. Palms are monocots. All growth originates at a single terminal bud ( which happens to be good to eat-at least in some species -tastes like a sort of nutty cabbage). Many live fronds persist at the same time but they are constantly dying and being replaced as the Palm grows. The dead ones are aranged in whorls around the trunk. Their bases interlock to form a sort of collar around the trunk itself. Ungroomed palms are incredibly trashy. The dead fronds cover the trunk in a thick nasty thatch. They do eventually come off but it takes awhile-the bases have to break down to a point where they come loose. In order to make things look neat the dead fronds are periodically trimmed off and the bases "peeled". If a significant time has elapsed since the last trim the old dead fronds up on the trunk may be ready to come loose. if the bases below them have been peeled previously the whole mass may slide down the trunk like a big spiked collar. I hate messing with palms!:(
 
My Dad worked for the city of Phoenix street department. When the crew would go out to skin palms, they would empty a giant fire extinguisher into the palms to kill the nasties, spiders, rats, scorpions.

Tom
 
The replies tell me one thing...
This site continues to be a great source of education.

Sounds like something you can't see coming until it's too late.
 
climber on call w/ fire dept. for aerial rescues.

The idea sounds great, but exactly how feasible is it? Could a climber be able to report as quickly as the rescue crew? What if the climber was climbinga tree two towns away?
I don't know if this means anything to you folks, but I just can't see myself being in that position (on Call). Too many things to go wrong, not to mention possible liabilities.
I think it would be great to offer my services if needed, just think efficiency would be an issue.
 
I have done a lot of palm trimming, and this seems very weird. To me it sounds like he was down below the skirt of the old dead palm fronds that must have been too thick to climb underneath (the small space between the hanging fronds and the palm trunk is an errie place -dark, many bugs & critters) so I wonder if he had a pole saw and just started cutting them loose expecting them to drop over his head, but instead a large mass of them came down between his lanyard and the trunk. Probably so thick he couldn't even see his feet?? I bet he was on spikes, I would have prefered to gaff out and slide down the trunk rather than stay pinned in.... Poor guy wish we knew more.
Greg
 
It was probably a Washingtonia robusta or Phoenix canariensis, here are some links for pictures:

http://www.plantapalm.com/vpe/photos/Species/washingtonia_robusta.htm

http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrology/Syllabus2/wrobusta.htm

http://www.hortpix.com/pc3167.htm

http://plantsdatabase.com/go/51657/

Sounds like the palm he was working on was seriously neglected. I pruned a neglected sabal palmetto once that filled the chip truck with mulch, easily several TONS from one palm. Fortunately, there was a tall cypress nearby and I could attack it from the top down.
 
Brian,
If your fire dept is open minded about using outside "experts" then I hope that you are called. I have been a firefighter for over 20 years and have that some fire depts are very hardnosed about admitting that there are other ways of accomplishing a goal. If the officers realize that there just may be other people more able and trained to do the job then there is more of a chance of a "mutual aid" agreement with outside resources. Unfortunately this never seems to happen until dire consequences have occurred. I have about given up trying to get the military surplus (it was old when I started ) rope replaced that is supposedly for rope rescue on our rescue truck"because we haven't needed it yet so why replace it" mentality that the officers on my department display. I have been trying for years to get all of our rope and hardware replaced but to no avail. Now with that attitude do you think that I would have any luck with trying to convince them that the rope and hardware shouldn't be used? No need to even answer that question.
What I'm trying to point out is that a good working relationship with your local department is a must. You should find out when they are doing their rope training and offer to join in. That is the only way that a fire dept is going to feel comfortable with calling for help. They want to know firsthand what they are getting.
 
Now this is just public brainstorming and I've never even seen anyone (besides a barefoot Jamaican) climb a palm tree.. and it seems to me that if I was on the ground, I'd fell the tree rather than wait as the climber was smotherred to death and the fire department just stood around and watched.
I wonder if some safety protocol to that effect could be studied and taught if proven effective...
Depending on how high the climber is and how soft the tree can be felled, as long as the climber doesn't end up under the tree, it seems he'd get a little or maybe even a lot banged up, and that's a whole lot better than getting dead.
The tree could also be felled on a house or a car (truck or chipper)or anything to keep it off the ground and soften the landing.
 
In rethinking the above scenario..
The climber managed to announce he was getting suffocated...
So the ground person had been informed. A quick rescue would have made the difference between life and death. How long did the climber have??? How many minutes...5?,10?, 15?, I would guess on the outside maybe 20, but probably more like 10.
So what were his chances of waiting for responce and rescue by FD??? Close to 0% I would guess...
What would his chances of survival have been if the groundperson had immediately felled the tree... Close to 100% if I was running the saw, I would guess. I would have cut high with a 90*+ notch and aimed for a raised object even if I had to pull the truck up as a target.. Those 800lbs of fronds would have to provide some cushion/breakfall. Climber might have even walked away with nothing more than scratches.... Lot easier to replace a tree, truck or roof than a life...
So how often does this happen and how often do such incidents result in death. Tim Walsh might be able to give us some insight as he has a report on arboricultural fatalities over an 8 year period...
AS you might be able to tell, something here has got me going... I smell life and think of a man going home to his family for dinner rather than the family going to his funeral.
 
For what it's worth Murph, that sounds quite logical to me.
Dial 911, apprise them of the situation, and then Do what you have to DO to get him out/down.

At the very least, if he was injured from the fall, the medics would have already been on their way.
 
In re-reading the given info I notced the climber was supposed to have been up at about 45'..... Now that's up there for riding a felling tree.... How tall do palms usually get????
Might have to lean it into the back of the truck, then pull foward to slowly bring it over... In any case if you could keep the tree and man from hitting the ground, the flex of the wood would provide some shock absorbtion. I imagine there would however be a sewrious potential of breaking the climbers back.
 
Hmmm..... I tried to put myself in this situation. If someone hollers that they are suffocating I tend to assume it is psychological-if they can yell they are breathing. Having felled a few palms I would not try to let anyone ride one down. They are terribly heavy and have little wind resistance. Not being normal wood making a 'slow hinge' is too unreliable (for me anyway). I wasn't there so don't know what I would have done but I don't think I would have felled the tree.
 
here's a little article from the Principes Journal of the Palm Society Vol.2, No.2 April 1958

PALM FRONDS SUFFOCATE MAN

Los Angeles, Dec. 10 - A man trimming a palm tree in a cemetery was suffocated when a mass of palm fronds slipped down the trunk of the tree and completely enveloped him.
The body of Melchor Vargas, 30, was found yesterday 40 feet up the tree under a huge circle of fronds that had been loosened by his trimming and had slipped down some six feet.
Vargas, father of six children, was still fastened in his safety belt. Investigators said the fronds, weighing several hundred pounds, had pinioned his arms. He apparently had been dead for several hours.


my guess is that the palm was a Washinigtonia, apparently this has happened before. not a pleasant way to go.
 
I think Spencer came up with a fairly easy way to be "tied in" to a palm tree. I know that spikes on a pruning job isn't exactly the right thing to do. However I am pretty sure it is allowed in an aerial rescue. I have no experience with palms, but I think if I was on the ground and saw that happening, I would have called 911, then strapped on a cheap saddle and some spikes with a good hand saw and hauled ass up there to cut those fronds off the guy. Going straight up a pole on spikes really isn't a horribly difficult skill to master.
 

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