2 feet of soil added to the bottom of oak tree

[kielbasa]

Hi, I'm looking for some information - hopefully you guys could help out.
Here's my situation: I had some grading work done around my home with a dozer (leveling out some hills, etc.), anyways, I told the operator I wanted to keep the oak tree that is growing in an area he was working in. He shaped the grade around it, looked good, except that the area around the trunk is about 2 feet higher. I mentioned that I thought that probably is not a good idea for the tree, but I'm not sure. Most people I mention it to just start to laugh and tell me to quit worrying, but 2 people already told me that the tree will suffocate, and that I should dig aprroximately a 3 foot diameter around the trunk back to the original grade and just fill it with big rocks to conform to the present grade....is there any truth to this?
FYI, it's an oak tree (don't know what kind, it has pointy ends on the leaves, not round like a bur oak), the tree is about 20~30 years old, about 25 feet tall. Thanks for any input!

 

[forestryworks]

2ft? that's a huge grade change.

it'll suffocate. but not overnight.

had the same thing happen to a pecan at an old folks' home.
i couldn't see any root flare so i dug around and dug around
til i could see it. the grade was 16" higher than the original.
it was already long dead. so down it went.

 

[Jacob J.]

How much of the root bed is covered by the new additional soil? That's the part to worry about, not the trunk.

I'd only worry about the trunk if you had drainage problems and the additional soil held water up against the trunk on a continual basis.

 

[treemandan]

How much of the root bed is covered by the new additional soil? That's the part to worry about, not the trunk.

I'd only worry about the trunk if you had drainage problems and the additional soil held water up against the trunk on a continual basis.

I don't agree with that and know for a fact that the dirt will hurt the trunk in many ways.

 

[kielbasa]

the entire area around the tree is covered...I wouldn't say I have a drainage problem though, as my area is sand/gravel.
So should I dig a 3 foot diameter around the trunk of the tree?

 

[treemandan]

the entire area around the tree is covered...I wouldn't say I have a drainage problem though, as my area is sand/gravel.
So should I dig a 3 foot diameter around the trunk of the tree?

What you have is a mess, a real one too. If you want to start digging go ahead, I'll just watch, its going to be a lot of work sounds like. I would call the yocal back and tell him to fix it before I sued him.

 

[arborist]

Hi, I'm looking for some information - hopefully you guys could help out.
Here's my situation: I had some grading work done around my home with a dozer (leveling out some hills, etc.), anyways, I told the operator I wanted to keep the oak tree that is growing in an area he was working in. He shaped the grade around it, looked good, except that the area around the trunk is about 2 feet higher. I mentioned that I thought that probably is not a good idea for the tree, but I'm not sure. Most people I mention it to just start to laugh and tell me to quit worrying, but 2 people already told me that the tree will suffocate, and that I should dig aprroximately a 3 foot diameter around the trunk back to the original grade and just fill it with big rocks to conform to the present grade....is there any truth to this?
FYI, it's an oak tree (don't know what kind, it has pointy ends on the leaves, not round like a bur oak), the tree is about 20~30 years old, about 25 feet tall. Thanks for any input!

The two people who told you, this tree will suffocate where correct.


See,basically,the root's need air.Bury the root's with 2 feet of addition dirt will kill your roots and of course then the tree dies.
The root structure your worried about is directly under the entire canopy,not just a few feet around the trunk.
Remove this 2' of addition top soil from the trunk outward to the tree's drip line if you wish to keep this tree. Be careful not to disturb the original grade in the process, thus hurting the roots.
All it takes is 4" of additional top soil spread under the tree's drip line over the roots,to kill a mature tree.The feeder roots simply cannot receive the required oxygen any longer,and once the tree's reserves are exhausted(can take years) the tree will die.I might state "might" if just a couple inches where added(there would be recommendations in this case),but 2 feet is certain death down the road.

 

[kielbasa]

The two people who told you, this tree will suffocate where correct.


See,basically,the root's need air.Bury the root's with 2 feet of addition dirt will kill your roots and of course then the tree dies.
The root structure your worried about is directly under the entire canopy,not just a few feet around the trunk.
Remove this 2' of addition top soil from the trunk outward to the tree's drip line if you wish to keep this tree. Be careful not to disturb the original grade in the process, thus hurting the roots.
All it takes is 4" of additional top soil spread under the tree's drip line over the roots,to kill a mature tree.The feeder roots simply cannot receive the required oxygen any longer,and once the tree's reserves are exhausted(can take years) the tree will die.I might state "might" if just a couple inches where added(there would be recommendations in this case),but 2 feet is certain death down the road.

Good information, exactly what I was looking for, Thanks.
Since I know very little about trees, I have a dumb question...is there any possibility of the roots starting to grow upward towards an oxygen supply (similar to how tree roots find their way to drain tile, etc seeking water)?

 

[treemandan]

Good information, exactly what I was looking for, Thanks.
Since I know very little about trees, I have a dumb question...is there any possibility of the roots starting to grow upward towards an oxygen supply (similar to how tree roots find their way to drain tile, etc seeking water)?

Yes. A lot of things will happen as well. It might take a long time for the tree to show signs.

 

[kielbasa]

Update

In the little spare time I do have, so far I've managed to dig a 2 foot diameter around the trunk. And I'd say the new grade is more like 3 feet over the original. It's been approx 3 months since the landscaping has occured, and it's actually hard to find the original grade - I would have thought it would be easier. Anyways, there's a bunch of hairlike roots (around the 3 foot depth) growing in the area I'm digging, wonder if it's the tree??
I'll keep picking away at it (anywhere from 20 to 30 minutes a day) and hopefully be able to save the tree, it's actually a good way to relieve some daily stress! Honestly, I'm not going to dig a 10~15 foot diameter around the trunk, but 4~6 feet is a definite possibility.

 

[tomtrees58]

the tree should last 3 years that's it never grade from the drip line in tom trees

 

[kielbasa]

the tree should last 3 years that's it never grade from the drip line in tom trees

ouch...so the 4~6 feet around the trunk I'll dig out is a waste of time? Would it afford the tree any time to establish new roots? I guess I'll find out.
My brother graded all of 4 feet (if not more) around a willow tree at least 10 years ago - tree was about 10~15 feet tall then, double that now - tree is looking good, didn't seem to affect it at all.

 

[tomtrees58]

ouch...so the 4~6 feet around the trunk I'll dig out is a waste of time? Would it afford the tree any time to establish new roots? I guess I'll find out.
My brother graded all of 4 feet (if not more) around a willow tree at least 10 years ago - tree was about 10~15 feet tall then, double that now - tree is looking good, didn't seem to affect it at all.

willow is a weed tree you can cut wood and leave it on the ground and it will grow wen you well a tree you have to put drainage in or the tree drowns tom

 

[buzz sawyer]

Update

It's been approx 3 months since the landscaping has occured, and it's actually hard to find the original grade - I would have thought it would be easier.

Did they clear any vegetation and soil from the area before adding the new soil? If so, they may have damaged roots at that time. Did they run heavy equipment close to the tree? Both would be bad. How about some photos?

 

[kielbasa]

no, nothing was cleared, just filled over (dozer) with a mixture of pit run, soil and clay....I'll post a pic soon.

 

[Anomalychick]

I know this post is old but it seems similar to something I just posted on citrus trees. Does the ENTIRE drip line need to be cleared or can you sacrifice a part of it? Part of my orange and grapefruit trees are over the property line and they did construction and dumped fill dirt over them. Its over a foot deep on part of the orange tree and this is after I dug out to the property line.

I know you can cut some of the roots without killing the tree, and I im trying to figure out if its better to leave it as is or cut the roots off at the edge of the fill dirt. This was done about a year and a half ago, I spend the last year trying to save my trees without really knowing why they dropped most of their leaves. They have come back a lot and look a lot better than they did, but I want to give them the best chances.

 

[afflatusfarm]

Hi, I'm looking for some information - hopefully you guys could help out.
Here's my situation: I had some grading work done around my home with a dozer (leveling out some hills, etc.), anyways, I told the operator I wanted to keep the oak tree that is growing in an area he was working in. He shaped the grade around it, looked good, except that the area around the trunk is about 2 feet higher. I mentioned that I thought that probably is not a good idea for the tree, but I'm not sure. Most people I mention it to just start to laugh and tell me to quit worrying, but 2 people already told me that the tree will suffocate, and that I should dig aprroximately a 3 foot diameter around the trunk back to the original grade and just fill it with big rocks to conform to the present grade....is there any truth to this?
FYI, it's an oak tree (don't know what kind, it has pointy ends on the leaves, not round like a bur oak), the tree is about 20~30 years old, about 25 feet tall. Thanks for any input!

 

[afflatusfarm]

Hi, I'm looking for some information - hopefully you guys could help out.
Here's my situation: I had some grading work done around my home with a dozer (leveling out some hills, etc.), anyways, I told the operator I wanted to keep the oak tree that is growing in an area he was working in. He shaped the grade around it, looked good, except that the area around the trunk is about 2 feet higher. I mentioned that I thought that probably is not a good idea for the tree, but I'm not sure. Most people I mention it to just start to laugh and tell me to quit worrying, but 2 people already told me that the tree will suffocate, and that I should dig aprroximately a 3 foot diameter around the trunk back to the original grade and just fill it with big rocks to conform to the present grade....is there any truth to this?
FYI, it's an oak tree (don't know what kind, it has pointy ends on the leaves, not round like a bur oak), the tree is about 20~30 years old, about 25 feet tall. Thanks for any input!

I know this is an old post from 2009 but I have the exact same scenario with a poplar tree and am wondering what remedy/path you took, Kielbasa, and what the outcome was.

 

[afflatusfarm]

I know this is an old post from 2009 but I have the exact same scenario with a poplar tree and am wondering what remedy/path you took, Kielbasa, and what the outcome was.

 

[HavinFun]

Clear the trunk of the tree from all of the additional dirt added. When you pile dirt or mulch above the rootball you are doing what’s called “volcano mulching”. Search on the internet for volcano mulching and Mike McGroarty. Mike is a nursery man in Ohio and has a recent post about this. Yes, you will suffocate the tree, and possibly cause the tree to form advantageous roots in the new higher layer of soil that usually end up growing around the tree trunk and girdling (strangling) them. Also, driving heavy equipment within the drip line will compact the soil and crush some roots that also hurt the tree.
When I bought my place, the drive into the property went past a house with beautiful mature willow trees at the entrance. Dumbass owner, also a developer, thought it would look “better” if he piled dirt over the roots and put large stones on it. Not only did he destroy a beautiful vista, but now three years later the willows are falling over dead. I’ve taken landscaping and horticulture certificate courses for my business and volcano mulching is just wrong. When you drive around look at some of the nicely landscaped and maintained commercial properties and the “professional” landscaping companies do this on a regular basis. That’s it for my rant.