ascenders?

[treeclimber165]

OK- I'm thinking about possibly buying an ascender or two soon. I've never used one or seen one used, but I'm thinking possibly a Petzl handled ascender (left hand) and an ankle ascender since I cannot footlock.

I'm looking for input on what ascenders you guys use, how often you use them, SRT or DdRT, static line or your lifeline, and any helpful info.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

If you are ascending STR you should have a single upper ascender on a cord, a second chest ascender for self belay (I use a ropeman the little I SRT) then the foot ascender. I will admit to occasionaly forgoing the self belay on ascents that will not colflict with any tree on the way up. Then I'll just fairlead the rope through a krab on by center D.

I will mostly DdRT ascend with paired handled ascenders while footlocking. a pantine will not work here because it would pull only 1 rope. MarBars would help if you don't want to learn to FL. I think they are way too bulky, but then I'm not going up 100ft gums.

for DdRT I think paired CMI asceners on a delta link with a sewn daisey chain webbing work very well, this way you can play with the distance to find out how far you like to have them away. If you want I can take a pic of my setup.

For SRT, Tom has a very good, compact assembly.

 

[treeclimber165]

Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn

I will mostly DdRT ascend with paired handled ascenders while footlocking. a pantine will not work here because it would pull only 1 rope.

I guess I'm not envisioning the same thing you are. I'm seeing myself using the ascenders on one side of the rope while the other side is clipped to my belt, like air-humping but easier.

So using the ascenders on your lifeline tail isn't commonly done? I was thinking that or setting a single line to ascend. I wish I knew someone who used these darn things. Getting into a tall tree is the hardest part of my job.

 

[Nickrosis]

The standard policy is to ascend on a doubled line with the ends tied off. If you work off the end of your climbing line, your efforts are cut in half, if that makes sense. If you shoot straight up with a doubled line, every inch of rope through the ascender is an inch away from the ground.

Nickrosis

 

[Kevin]

Brian,
I use the kong double ascender and back up hitch with a footlock on a doubled rope.
I also use a pantin and a distel hitch with SRT and it works great, a little slow but steady.
The pantin doesn`t feed the rope very well close to the ground but once you gain some height the weight of the rope feeds better through the pantin.

 

[Greg]

I have a pair of handled ascenders (kong) that are exactly like the Petzl ascenders that you are thinking about. I very rarely use them. They advance a little easier than a friction hitch, and I only break them out on long vertical ascents. I would trade them today for a Pantin and Gibbs (or other toothless) ascender. You just can't work in a tree with them, it is too difficult to descend a few feet, so I prefer to just start out with a hitch and just shorten the bridge for working in the tree. Mine have several holes where they can be joined for DbRT footlocking, but I just can't seem to get that configured right. The kong double looks like a good tool, but only for footlocking. I don't have a problem like most people mention with the teeth chewing up a rope, but again I don't use them a whole lot. --Any one wanna trade, I'd also take abig shot... - email me!
Greg

 

[treeclimber165]

Well, I'm certain I'm getting a Pantin foot ascender since footlocking is out of the question for me. And I've never had a problem holding a rope without a handle, so I'm thinking of getting a mini-traxion for clipping on at my waist under my hitch. That will give me more room to grab the rope above the ascender. Does this sound like a workable combination? Or do I even need the mini-traxion?

(I hate spending money on stuff I've never seen used before, but I really need to make ascending easier.)

 

[Tom Dunlap]

The Mini-Traxion is a good, multi-use tool. The catch is that it isn't rated for a 23kN load. The Maxi-Traxion is what you would need.

Another tool that works in this place is the Rocker. Yates sells the tool. It can be used for a load hauler like the MT but it doesn't have teeth to nip the rope. There are a few other things that make the Rocker a good choice.

Do a Google search for more information on the Rocker. You can also look here: http://storrick.cnchost.com/VerticalDevicesPage/VerticalHome.shtml


165,

If the only thing you're going to do is substitute an ascender for your friction hitch I think you're making your system more complicated for very little gain. Besides, you'll be spending money that might be better spent somewhere else. If you decide to convert all of the way to SRT then buying ascenders makes sense.

Tom

 

[Kevin]

Brian, I don`t see any benefit adding the mini-traxion.
My distel and pantin work just fine together.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Yates rocker

http://www.yatesgear.com/climbing/hardware

 

[treeclimber165]

Kevin-
You only use the Pantin and your hitch? Do you set a single line or do you use the Pantin on your tail? I'm just looking for an easier way to get up a tree, not to see how much money I can spend. Once I'm up in the top, working my way around and down is cake using a friction hitch. But if I can spend $55 on the Pantin and ascend easier, I can be more productive.

Does the handled ascender really help when ascending on the tail? Or is it best used on a single line secured in the tree? I am aware that ascending on the tail means that I only ascend 1' for every 2' passed through the ascender, but I imagine climbing a single line is also twice the effort.

 

[Kevin]

Brian,
I`m using the Pantin on the running end of a split tail system.
I can stop and rest on the distel when needed and pick up and go again without the hitch locking up like it did on all the other hitches I experimented with.
You`ll find the rope kicks out of the pantin occasionally until you get use to it and it`s also slow to get going until you get a little rope below you.
I know some guys like to use another ascender with a footpro or something similar for the other foot but it`s too much stuff for me personally.
I haven`t had the need for a hand ascender in conjunction with the pantin but I imagine it would make climbing even easier.
I may try that when I get a chance.
You might try just the pantin and if you feel the need for another ascender you can add it to your system later.
I haven`t found the pantin a problem in the tree but you might remove it once up in the tree.
I only noticed a problem when standing in a narrow crotch with the pantin on my foot.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Brian, it is half the efffort for twice the distance. Seems like a wash to me, I just want to get it over with.

If you use paired ascenders on DdRT, you can use one of them for SRT if you ever do it. Look at the rope man for a second ascender in SRT, it may not be exactly made for 13mm rope, but works for this purpose.

 

[Nickrosis]

Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn
Yates rocker

http://www.yatesgear.com/climbing/hardware

JPS, don't recommend stuff that isn't ANSI approved! It's gotta meet the Z! Regarding the Ropeman, it's not something I know anything about, but if it isn't designed for something, it shouldn't be used for it.

For my part, I have not found the Patin to be useful, but I don't have much experience with it, and I'm young and useless....er...restless. I have a lot of energy.

Nickrosis

 

[Greg]

Rocker?---- Is that at all like a Lockjack? If it had another hole for another biner it looks like it could be. Cool tool. That descender "belay slave" that yates makes also looks kinda interesting, looks like you can add biners to the descender like gates on a rack.

How is the rocker better than the MT, just becasue of no teeth?

Greg

 

[FBerkel]

Tom,

I'll be direct: What devices do you recommend on Srt?

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

When it comes to SRT, tom is like a woman. Always chainging his wardrobe

 

[Tom Dunlap]

JPS has been peeking again

Take a look at the upper right picture on this page: http://www.missouri.edu/~quinnl/trees/training/tomgallery.html

Substitute the Rocker for the lower Micro Cender and you have the system I use today. Maybe different tomorrow.

The beauty of this system is that it is SO compact. When I ball up the works it's no bigger than a snowball.

Lately, I've been using an Easy Bar for a foot ascender. This is a unit made by Greg Liu. It's his version of a Mar Bar. The rod is turned aluminum. I use it with a single CMI handled ascender. This is a nice, light unit and not too expensive. Since I SRT I ditch the EB when I get to the top. There's two ways to send the EB down. Most times I unclip the EB from the ascent side of the access line and reclip it on the leg that goes down to the anchor. The EB gets clippe so that the top of the ascender is pointing down. I have a small key chain biner in the lower hole in the CMI. The EB slides down like a speed line. With a few jiggles of the rope, the EB will slide down so that the groundie can remove it from the access line. You could also speedline the EB on the access side of the line too.

As easy as my system is to use I'm almost starting to feel lazy, almost...

Tom

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Hey Tom & Reed, Meesh-El came through on her vacation and we had a bite to eat on wednesday.

Serendipity had her pull off the road and go to the Zoo. I was working only a few blocks away.

 

[treeclimber165]

I got to try out the CMI ascenders today, with the footstraps on the lower ascender. They worked really nicely and didn't slip at all with my 175 lbs with gear. They did snag my Safety Blue rope slightly, though. They seemed to work a little better on Spencer's new Blue Streak which is a little bit stiffer rope, and they didn't snag as much either.

Now I definitely think I would benefit from a set of handled ascenders. I'm going to see how it works with just the Pantin and my friction hitch first, though. My hitch tender pulley virtually eliminates the need to address my hitch when ascending.