Bucket babies:Are they all slackers?
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What is there to be proud of about spurless climbing? Try me, maybe I'll understand, sounds to me like "why use a boom truck when you could climb, and why use spurs when you could hump up a rope like a freak?" Is it really something to be proud of? Its kind of like the homos having "gay pride" parades, go ahead and be gay, ain't nothing to be proud of.rebelman said:
dhuffnmu
ArboristSite Operative
I know guys that can't climb a lick but can keep up to anyone out of a bucket truck on removals. They work the ground hard and when in the bucket do the job they need to do as quickly as the circumstances dictate. To me they are no worse than someone who can climb and work a bucket truck. That is like saying why can't that Car tow what that truck can. They both can get you from point A to point B but the car can't tow what the truck can. Does that make the car anything less in the process of getting you from point A to poing B? NO! Just means in certain situations you need a truck. Or in this case a climber.
For me it's a matter of quality residential work. I'm continually bidding against spikers and stubbers. I'm not sure words can bring you into the fold clearance, believing spurs harm trees is a start, I think you've admitted that, then several years of pruning without spurs, showing the dedication this industry needs, might enlighten you. Maybe you could make peace with your many prejudices first, gays, hippies, do gooders, tree huggers, then begin the process of respecting trees.
userdude
ArboristSite Member
BigJohn said:
If that guys at McD's knows all aspect of the business, from mopping to running the register, then he's good to go in my book.
TreeCo: Those smilies are about as gay as your avatar.
Good one dude, Rebelman, I know that spurs are not good, I don't care, I also don't leave stubs, as far as my predudices, I tells it like I sees it, I do not think it is healthy to hold it all in. Not out to start ethnic cleansing the homos, tree huggers etc., they have a right to be here like I do and also to say what they want, like me, and they have no problem with saying thier thing. I like some trees a lot, keep it in perspective, trees are just trees, no big deal.userdude said:
T
topnotchtree
Guest
I have a feeling userdude is a line clearance guy. Am I right? I kinda hear the same teasing sometimes as a bucket foreman. production is a huge factor in line clearance. the buckets job is to get good production, and make up for the manual crews pulling hang in the back yards. circumstances change from circuit to circuit, but we are generally instructed to just do bucket work and let the manual crews get the climbers. It is not that we are unable to do the climbing, or we are lazy, we are just doing our jobs as bucket crews.
userdude
ArboristSite Member
userdude said:
What gave you the idea I'm doing line clearance topnotch? Either that, or I'm working for a hella huge tree service.
Seriously though, I returned to the r.o.w. clearing world a few weeks back after being gone from it, climbing for a tree service, for 3yrs.
Again, I'm not knockin' a bucket man who is skilled at other aspects of this job, other than JUST running the bucket. I worked with one who was sick in the bucket, would have my jaw dropping regulary. This guy was good AND knew several knots AND could climb (even footlock), could set a throw line, etc. I had/have much respect for him, although he admits he hates to climb.
a few crews of worked on had bucket babys for sure.bad part is if your climbing on the same crew with the usual type of "managers" in the electrical veg managment you usually end up doing the babys work as its easier on "managment" and suposedly cheaper as a tower which has already been and looked at the job doesnt need to go back.
you can have the oposite as well bucket guys that go out of there way to eliminate you climbing rubbish jobs.
you can have the oposite as well bucket guys that go out of there way to eliminate you climbing rubbish jobs.
drag
moose you dragged buckets too definate good timeskmoose said:As far as utility work goes, it is a matter of production and safety. I don't care if you are a 9 foot tall, 3 armed chimp with a squirrel tail, good bucket guys will out cut climbers 2 if not 3 to one. Not just trimming twigs either, heavy overhang, 30"+ removals, you name it. If they can drag a bucket truck to it, it's down faster than 3 groundmen can chip or stack.
I give anyone their props for being good climbers. Climbing, rigging, and cutting aloft is an art and if time and hazzards permit, a good pecentage of the overhead cost their climbing eliminates should be awarded to them and there support crew. Still, after either is set up, the bucket will reach the top long before the climber........Buckets don't need a break and they don't get tired.
Now, if the groundmen where looking up when they heard a saw running like they are supposed to.........They wouldn't have to worry about being bombed.Man I can hear the crap storm comming on this one.
I expect a lot from the guys in the bucket. They better produce or they are behind a chipper or a rake. Some guys dont have what it takes to climb, and thats ok, but if they are gonna be in production with a bucket they need to get pretty good at it. I personally like to reserve the bucket for the aging tree climber with the aches and pains. A guy that has spent a lot of time climbing over the years will make a helluva bucket operator when he is ready to stop climbing. We just dont give the new guys one of the buckets its more of seniority thing most of the time. Thats in private tree care though.
This is the first time I've posted a thread here so hello to all of you. As a municipal arborist in Ontario, I spend about 75% working on trees out of a bucket truck. However, that 25% spent climbing is usually done in greenbelt areas of the city where there is no bucket access. These trees are usally dangerous removals so even though we dont climb as often as the everyday private climber, we need to know what we are doing when the time comes. I take it as insult to be grouped as lazy and uneducated. Our crew takes a lot pride in our pruning and removal practices and we are constantly taking educational courses and seminars to get better at what we do. As for being lazy, our crew here rotates through, so you make work two days in the bucket and your third day is on the ground. This way we all work to help each other out and watch out for eachother.
ROLLACOSTA
Addicted to ArboristSite
Welcome leafman,I don't think the guys are bashing all bucket truck operaters
glad to be here. im sure that no offense was really meant to anyone when this thread was started. its really too bad that a lot of climbers think badly of buckey babies as you guys call them, and vise versa. the main thing is, and someone already pointed this out, that if you have guys whether they are groundies, climbers or bucket workers, that want to learn more then all aspects of our work should improve. I have learned a lot from the former private climber in terms of climbing, and hes learned a lot from me and the others how to operate and function working out of a bucket. its helped our crew in all aspects.
just want to point out that this is a great site, lots of good topics and interesting information here.
just want to point out that this is a great site, lots of good topics and interesting information here.
tshanefreeman
ArboristSite Operative
Wow..........this thread is really based on a one-sided, extremely biased stereotype.
...All climbers are more educated and ambitious...
...All bucket operators are ignorant and lazy...
...All girls are weak...
...All boys are strong...
Seriously. Wow!
If the bucket operators that you are referring too are the way that you say, their problem is more due to their boss or company. If they have little education, experience, or ambition, why is their employer keeping them around.
I know that you have tried to re-word your initial thread by saying that their are some operators that are educated and ambitious, but didn't you honestly think that you were going to get jumped on by people.
I initially took offense to your stereotype. Here's why: I'm a business owner. A climber. A bucket operator. A stump grinder. A groundie. A chemical applicator. An ISA certified arborist. A university graduate. A college graduate. I'm not saying that I'm the next Nobel Prize Winner, heck, I don't even want a pat on the back, but I'm certainly not deserving of your stereotype and neither are the countless men and women that strive to better this industry in their own ways. I'm sure that for the eight people that you are referring too, there are probably thousands that would put your theory to shame.
A bucket truck is nothing more than a tool that has been created to make the lives of business owners and employees much more efficient and effective. I wouldn't say that it makes people lazy. People make themselves lazy. If anything, these tools increase productivity. If a company can better both their gross and net income, why not utilize one or two or three of these machines. Perhaps you should start a thread saying that people that use chippers are lazy and uneducation. That the smart and ambitious people load all their branches manually into half-ton trucks. If the people operating the equipment don't want to learn and don't want to work, chances are that they won't have their job for long. At least they wouldn't if I was signing their cheques!
Really....Wow....
...All climbers are more educated and ambitious...
...All bucket operators are ignorant and lazy...
...All girls are weak...
...All boys are strong...
Seriously. Wow!
If the bucket operators that you are referring too are the way that you say, their problem is more due to their boss or company. If they have little education, experience, or ambition, why is their employer keeping them around.
I know that you have tried to re-word your initial thread by saying that their are some operators that are educated and ambitious, but didn't you honestly think that you were going to get jumped on by people.
I initially took offense to your stereotype. Here's why: I'm a business owner. A climber. A bucket operator. A stump grinder. A groundie. A chemical applicator. An ISA certified arborist. A university graduate. A college graduate. I'm not saying that I'm the next Nobel Prize Winner, heck, I don't even want a pat on the back, but I'm certainly not deserving of your stereotype and neither are the countless men and women that strive to better this industry in their own ways. I'm sure that for the eight people that you are referring too, there are probably thousands that would put your theory to shame.
A bucket truck is nothing more than a tool that has been created to make the lives of business owners and employees much more efficient and effective. I wouldn't say that it makes people lazy. People make themselves lazy. If anything, these tools increase productivity. If a company can better both their gross and net income, why not utilize one or two or three of these machines. Perhaps you should start a thread saying that people that use chippers are lazy and uneducation. That the smart and ambitious people load all their branches manually into half-ton trucks. If the people operating the equipment don't want to learn and don't want to work, chances are that they won't have their job for long. At least they wouldn't if I was signing their cheques!
Really....Wow....
Climb020
ArboristSite Operative
It is cheaper for a company to put who ever he has in the bucket to get the job done then let a $100,000 piece of equipment sit in the shop. So it is the employers fault for being too damn cheap to get proper help and just send a rookie up in the bucket cause he has a CDL.
This has happened to me where a rookie started with a CDL took over the bucket, made more then I did cause he had a CDL and I can climb and prune the tree faster then he could with the bucket 60% of the time or more.
This has happened to me where a rookie started with a CDL took over the bucket, made more then I did cause he had a CDL and I can climb and prune the tree faster then he could with the bucket 60% of the time or more.
skwerl
Will Climb for food
It's not the employer's fault that you don't have a CDL. If you can't legally transport the truck to the job, then how can you call the employer 'cheap'? Go get your CDL. It isn't your employer's responsibility or fault that you aren't properly licensed.Climb020 said:
