Cheap Chinese Clone vs. MMWS MS362C-M

[Chris-PA]

One thing is for sure, that chicom saw doesn't hold a candle to the 362 in terms of throttle response...it sounds lazy as hell!

That's an interesting observation, and I don't disagree - at least from the little you can hear as I did not do a proper piss reving at the beginning. Going back to listen it sure sounds like it's rich, misfiring quite a bit, even into the cut. I thought I could hear misfire even up to about the 5s mark in the first cut, and I wondered if I could see that in the plot.

I had to knock the length of the transform down to 32,768 in order to get a plot out of 1sec of data, but here is 4-5s:


Sure enough, you can see a small lump at about 1/2 the frequency of the main spike of 200Hz (12,000rpm)

Here is the same setting looking at 6-7sec after it cleans up:

Here there is little sign of anything down at half frequency - so it looks like you can indeed see "4-stroking". Further, it also looks like it is really at 1/2 frequency, or firing every other rotation.

 

[bikemike]

You know..... that's an excellent idea. Now I have to find a 80 or 90cc doner saw! And actually at that point who really cares what it looks like? I have a few old tillotsons from big old stihls. They have that round diaphragm, think they can deliver enough fuel?

I'm sure it's a good start

 

[angelo c]

Hey Chris,
Lemme know when you wanna port a 362......just to continue on this theme...
I'd love to lunch and learn as we used to call it in corporate world.
A

 

[Chris-PA]

Hey Chris,
Lemme know when you wanna port a 362......just to continue on this theme...
I'd love to lunch and learn as we used to call it in corporate world.
A

I got 2 Harbor Freight Dremels (including a $10 tool with a toy motor and no front bearing), a dirty bench in an unheated barn, and access to an ancient lathe driven by a leather belt. There's a reason I never port anything of value and have a pile of trashed Poulan cylinders! Here I only opened up the intake port a little.

Well, I do have a hoof rasp too, but have not tried that.

Anyway, thanks for the offer, but junk saws I can toss if I mess up are more my speed.

I see old Brush Ape is still hanging around though - he just loves this saw:

 

[angelo c]

I got 2 Harbor Freight Dremels (including a $10 tool with a toy motor and no front bearing), a dirty bench in an unheated barn, and access to an ancient lathe driven by a leather belt. There's a reason I never port anything of value and have a pile of trashed Poulan cylinders! Here I only opened up the intake port a little.

Well, I do have a hoof rasp too, but have not tried that.

Anyway, thanks for the offer, but junk saws I can toss if I mess up are more my speed.

I see old Brush Ape is still hanging around though - he just loves this saw:
View attachment 485135

tools don't make the man better.. the man makes the tools better.

 

[heyduke]

That's an interesting observation, and I don't disagree - at least from the little you can hear as I did not do a proper piss reving at the beginning. Going back to listen it sure sounds like it's rich, misfiring quite a bit, even into the cut. I thought I could hear misfire even up to about the 5s mark in the first cut, and I wondered if I could see that in the plot.

I had to knock the length of the transform down to 32,768 in order to get a plot out of 1sec of data, but here is 4-5s:

View attachment 485098
Sure enough, you can see a small lump at about 1/2 the frequency of the main spike of 200Hz (12,000rpm)

Here is the same setting looking at 6-7sec after it cleans up:
View attachment 485099
Here there is little sign of anything down at half frequency - so it looks like you can indeed see "4-stroking". Further, it also looks like it is really at 1/2 frequency, or firing every other rotation.

How a saw "sounds" doesn't always translate to how it performs in the field. "Sounds" is a subjective. aesthetic value. The four stroking, that you measured, just shows that you were right on the threshold of too-rich/just-right/too-lean. That's a good place to be. "Throttle response" is another over rated perception. That little 46cc husky in the earlier vid had great throttle response but wouldn't get wood on the ground, in the truck and chipped as fast as a tamer but bigger saw. A saw that has had its timing advanced might make a great vid cutting cookies but be out of tune in the real world of dicing rounds, guide bar buried, at 800o-9000 rpm. If you get your jollies "piss revving," you probably don't have much real work to do.

 

[schpankme]

I see old Brush Ape is still hanging around though - he just loves this saw:
View attachment 485135

Hey Chris, I am NOT "Brush Ape"; is this why you didn't answer my PM?

Please edit your comments and correct your mistake; I had no intentions of commenting, or adding to the drama, only following the Forums.

 

[Full Chisel]

How a saw "sounds" doesn't always translate to how it performs in the field. "Sounds" is a subjective. aesthetic value. The four stroking, that you measured, just shows that you were right on the threshold of too-rich/just-right/too-lean. That's a good place to be. "Throttle response" is another over rated perception. That little 46cc husky in the earlier vid had great throttle response but wouldn't get wood on the ground, in the truck and chipped as fast as a tamer but bigger saw. A saw that has had its timing advanced might make a great vid cutting cookies but be out of tune in the real world of dicing rounds, guide bar buried, at 800o-9000 rpm. If you get your jollies "piss revving," you probably don't have much real work to do.

Throttle response isn't overrated for a saw that is used for limbing...actually quite the opposite. But I hear what you are saying. For a saw primarily used for bucking medium sized wood, it runs damn fine. I just noticed it was lazy on and off throttle where as the ported 362 is lightning fast(like a stock XP husky...heh).

 

[Full Chisel]

Chris, that sound analyzer is a pretty nifty tool and something I have not seen used here before. Good stuff.

 

[Chris-PA]

For those who saw Brush Ape claiming he was not "schpankme" before the comment was deleted, I just wanted to show he is an outright liar:

 

[schpankme]

For those who saw Brush Ape claiming he was not "schpankme" before the comment was deleted, I just wanted to show he is an outright liar:

View attachment 485197

Chris, I don't know where you get your information, but a quick search on the INTERNET would show you that my name -- SCHPANKME VERIMUCH -- has been in use for 20+ years. Now, your paranoid delusions is the TOPIC of discussion, not the Chinese Saw YOU PROMOTED, and YOU MODIFIED on this forum.

Is "Brush Ape" going to be able to claim every name, and have you slander another member?

Chris, you owe me an Apology, and if you'd like to do that over a Skype call, with another forum member, that would be fine with me.

 

[Chris-PA]

I'm sure it's a good start

OK Mike, this is for you - A 62cc Chinese clone AND a pipe!:

 

[bikemike]

OK Mike, this is for you - A 62cc Chinese clone AND a pipe!:

Oh yeah I saw that a few times. Chain looks a Lil dull but sure sounds good

 

[bikemike]

There is a lot fuctics or something like that ported piped and kick azz

 

[Chris-PA]

Oh yeah I saw that a few times. Chain looks a Lil dull but sure sounds good

That is basically the same as this saw. It seems to be running a bit over 11k, but the spectrum plot is strange looking - not sure if it's the pipe effects or what.

 

[heyduke]

Throttle response isn't overrated for a saw that is used for limbing...actually quite the opposite. But I hear what you are saying. For a saw primarily used for bucking medium sized wood, it runs damn fine. I just noticed it was lazy on and off throttle where as the ported 362 is lightning fast(like a stock XP husky...heh).

Thanks for the feedback but how does throttle response improve limbing? It may make you feel better but the figure of merit is how fast the saw cuts. Some of the tuners here will advance ignition timing to make throttle response sound more aggressive, then post a vid of the saw after the modification. None of them post before and after vids. The vid of the Husky 346 was typical. the tuner was making a big deal of the fact it would turn 14.5k unloaded. When those saws first came out many years ago they were advertised as having a max rpm of 14.5k without modification. I'm just advocating a scientific approach. There's more to a good work saw than a new sticker over the air filter. I mostly use echo top handles for limbing. They sound tame but they cut faster than the stihls and they don't fall apart after a year of use like a 200t. My favorite rear handle is a husky 575. It sounds as exciting as a Buick but I'll run it against any 70cc class saw out there.

 

[Full Chisel]

Limbing usually involves frequent throttle blips to get the chain speed up to make small cuts, so the faster the chain can spool up the better. A faster accelerating saw is also safer when limbing...a slow moving chain tends to be more grabby than a fast one.

There's a reason the 346 is considered by many to be the best limbing saw ever made...

 

[heyduke]

Limbing usually involves frequent throttle blips to get the chain speed up to make small cuts, so the faster the chain can spool up the better. A faster accelerating saw is also safer when limbing...a slow moving chain tends to be more grabby than a fast one.

There's a reason the 346 is considered by many to be the best limbing saw ever made...

I go from 36cc to 70cc, not much in between. I've wrecked a lot of trees and dropped or lowered a lot of wood but never needed or wanted a 346. still don't. different strokes.

 

[schpankme]

"schpankme" is an outright liar:

View attachment 485197

Hello Chris,
I've thought about this all night, and it it came to mind that YOU must have contacted "Brush Ape" and told him to stop sending you Private Messages with the "Schpankme" account;
Because, I did send you PM's asking you which saw I should buy, and describing my shipping problems and missing items with the saw ordered.

Chris, did you contact "Brush Ape" and give him my name?

 

[weimedog]

OK Mike, this is for you - A 62cc Chinese clone AND a pipe!:

Seems like it made more noise than chips! Is that what happens when you pipe a saw?