Cheap Chinese Clone vs. MMWS MS362C-M

[Tor R]

How a saw "sounds" doesn't always translate to how it performs in the field. "Sounds" is a subjective. aesthetic value. The four stroking, that you measured, just shows that you were right on the threshold of too-rich/just-right/too-lean. That's a good place to be. "Throttle response" is another over rated perception. That little 46cc husky in the earlier vid had great throttle response but wouldn't get wood on the ground, in the truck and chipped as fast as a tamer but bigger saw. A saw that has had its timing advanced might make a great vid cutting cookies but be out of tune in the real world of dicing rounds, guide bar buried, at 800o-9000 rpm. If you get your jollies "piss revving," you probably don't have much real work to do.

throttle respons isnt overrated, special if you are doing lots of limbing.
I've had my parts of light limbing saws, and lots of my work in the forrest is limbing, most of my work is spruce threes, I do love the lightness to my modded 201, but I grab my 242 or 2147 or 2253 long time before the lighter one, simply because of the greater throttle respons they have. Limbing spruce threes the whole day you really dont want to have a turtle saw, simply as that.
Another thing people never speak much about is how the balance point are, the shape, antivib, what bar lenght they balance with, how they are to work with in real life.

 

[bikemike]

Seems like it made more noise than chips! Is that what happens when you pipe a saw?

I noticed that too he was pushing n pulling hard on that saw. Maybe it was sharp and rakers wernt knocked down. It sure wasn't much wood to cut.

 

[Chris-PA]

throttle respons isnt overrated, special if you are doing lots of limbing.
I've had my parts of light limbing saws, and lots of my work in the forrest is limbing, most of my work is spruce threes, I do love the lightness to my modded 201, but I grab my 242 or 2147 or 2253 long time before the lighter one, simply because of the greater throttle respons they have. Limbing spruce threes the whole day you really dont want to have a turtle saw, simply as that.
Another thing people never speak much about is how the balance point are, the shape, antivib, what bar lenght they balance with, how they are to work with in real life.

I like good throttle response too, although it's more important on smaller saws. This one actually revs up just fine when not tuned too fat like in the video.

As for balance and handling, it's just like the RedMax G621, which is to say it's light* and has a good feel. Balance is great with a 20" bar. It came with a heavy 25" bar, and it pulls that just fine but it's nose heavy in the extreme. In real life it's a great saw for what I do - it starts easy and isn't peaky, a great all around firewood saw. It is after all a Zenoah design.

*Note: I realized that up thread I had listed the weight as 11.5lb, which was a typo and it's too late to edit it now. It is 12.5lb as I had stated in my original thread on the saw.

 

[bikemike]

Just the power head or with b/c

 

[bikemike]

Beats lugging around a 20 lb homelite powerhead no b/c fuel or oil

 

[Michigan Escapee]

With mods it helps to stand on the shoulders of good engineering.

Now you could cut uniform bricks of pycrete or engineered lumber at low middle and high outdoor temps. Weigh out the sawdust to get n idea of what was removed, and then of course, weigh the fuel before and after, then bag up and test some exhaust gases to get some idea of internal chemistry, and how much metal is burning/frictioned away.

But nah, too much like real science and engineering. Piss revving and Piss taking, that's how rednecks roll!

Hell most saw monkeys would be hard pressed to take a torque wrench and an auger bit to determine what the general wood density and relative hardness is. Too complicated! Witchery!

Or hold a torch to the exhaust for a red neck chromatograph. More to find out if you are shedding metal, but you can ballpark unburned fuel, etc.

I think lots of saw monkeys would find real science results embarrassing, so nah, not gonna happen.

 

[blsnelling]

Seems like it made more noise than chips! Is that what happens when you pipe a saw?

The saw ran fantastic. It's only the chain that's severely lacking.

 

[Chris-PA]

Just the power head or with b/c

Powerhead only. I used the digital scale at work when the saw came in.

 

[weimedog]

The saw ran fantastic. It's only the chain that's severely lacking.

I was being a bit sarcastic. To divert the subject a bit. It did sound strong...so why would a person go to all that effort and then not put a chain on it? Especially for a video.... just sayin. BUT I don't want to have another tiff on a thread that's all about tiff's, so yea...that saw ran fantastic! Maybe the point was to show you need a piped saw to pull a Chinese chain?

 

[bikemike]

A saw is only as good as a chain that it pulls

 

[Chris-PA]

I was being a bit sarcastic. To divert the subject a bit. It did sound strong...so why would a person go to all that effort and then not put a chain on it? Especially for a video.... just sayin. BUT I don't want to have another tiff on a thread that's all about tiff's, so yea...that saw ran fantastic! Maybe the point was to show you need a piped saw to pull a Chinese chain?

Well, People who hop up engines don't necessarily know anything about saws and chain.

 

[heyduke]

Well, People who hop up engines don't necessarily know anything about saws and chain.

They often don't know much about hopping up engines.

 

[CR888]

Builders and modders only have one factor to improve which is cutting speed. Engineers that design these machines have many often conflicting factors to improve a model. If a OEM wanted to only improve power and cutting speed and had no rules & regulations to follow they could make saws MUCH faster EASILY! If builders and modders were tasked to improve power and speed and had to follow the same set of conflicting rules the oem engineers do, they would find it VERY difficult. I often laugh when I see a member post...'this oem left so much on the table with this saw', they simply don't understand what is involved.

 

[nenicu]

Hello. My clone is sick. After cutting 10 cubic meters of logs[20 inch and over] it started to act funny. After tear down the cylinder has some minor scoring, piston is ok[?], and the bearings are toast. Lots of fine dust inside [the filter is a joke] and i run it a little lean for 1-1,5 tanks. So [i think] the right way to handle these is: get the clone, change the bearings with good C3 spec ones, do a little fixing where is needed,asemble it with care to detail. I got my 70 cc clone used[like new] at around 70 bucks. After a little porting and a carb swap[H 372 China carb] it run great so i left my Husqvarna 268 aside and cut only with the clone.

 

[heyduke]

Hello. My clone is sick. After cutting 10 cubic meters of logs[20 inch and over] it started to act funny. After tear down the cylinder has some minor scoring, piston is ok[?], and the bearings are toast. Lots of fine dust inside [the filter is a joke] and i run it a little lean for 1-1,5 tanks. So [i think] the right way to handle these is: get the clone, change the bearings with good C3 spec ones, do a little fixing where is needed,asemble it with care to detail. I got my 70 cc clone used[like new] at around 70 bucks. After a little porting and a carb swap[H 372 China carb] it run great so i left my Husqvarna 268 aside and cut only with the clone.

nenicu-

i had a similar problem. could not figure out how large amounts of fine saw dust were getting past the air filter and into the engine. There was more sawdust on the inside of the intake than on the outside of the filter. It was a poorly installed flywheel side crankshaft seal. found it with a pressure test. it was sucking in the dust coming off the chain a few inches away. replaced that seal and everything has been fine since then.

 

[Chris-PA]

Lots of fine dust inside [the filter is a joke]

Yes, this is what I found too (documented in the build thread linked on the first page). Actually I don't like the filter design on the original RedMax/Zenoah. The whole thing just has too many parts and seams to leak, although it probably works better with properly formed parts.

One of the filter halves was warped, so I heated it with a heat gun and took the curl out of it, then smeared some Yamabond4 sealant on the edges before snapping it back together. I took that plate under the filter apart and used JB Weld to attach the metal facing parts to the plastic part. Then I added some thin foam gasketing where the filter sits on it. It works well now - here is what I get in the intake throat after the mods: