I have owned several dodge and ford diesel pickups. The last one was a 05 ford one ton four door four wheel drive 6.0. It got 10 MPG empty or loaded. It only had 19000 miles on it as we don't do a lot of towing like we used too. I just sold it and ordered a new ford gas f-350 single wheel four door. I will not buy another new diesel pickup when it costs 6000 for the motor and 30 cents a gallon more for the fuel and more for oil changes.
Diesel
- Thread starter HeX0rz
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bullittman281
ArboristSite Operative
Get the coal burner. You wont regret it!! Something that doesn't transfer onto paper is drive ability. The diesels ooze with power. Some gassers may be "faster" but how happy are you winding them too the moon every time you want power. The diesel make good power below 2k and peak power occurs at 3k or less. Its much nicer driving the diesel. I'd look for a 03 or older 7.3. The best pickup there is with a good motor. Don't be too concerned about the electronics, they are very reliable and a trained monkey can work on them. Any of the later ford diesels are crap, you couldn't pay me to have one.
Bullittman
Bullittman
bullittman281
ArboristSite Operative
something to add. I normally get 17 MPG just commuting and have gotten 20MPG out on the highway. 17-18 is normal.
Al,
There is a away to inexpensively conver your front axle to locking hubs. I am researching it now. The conversion requires getting Dana 60 parts off a 92-98 Ford F350 single rear wheel truck out of a junkyard.
I can point you to a link if you want. Let me know and I'll post it.
There is a away to inexpensively conver your front axle to locking hubs. I am researching it now. The conversion requires getting Dana 60 parts off a 92-98 Ford F350 single rear wheel truck out of a junkyard.
I can point you to a link if you want. Let me know and I'll post it.
I'm on my third Cummins. First one was a 91 250 4x4 12 valve with 4 sp manual, 3:54 gear, locking front hubs . It got great millage going to and from work adveraging 21 MPH, 24 fully loaded with the flite way fiberglasscap and all our hunting grear and food for two weeks at deer camp had a 240,00 it when I sold it . Second one because I wanted a quad cab a 1998 2500 4x4 12valve with 5 sp manual 4:10 gear (gone were the locking hubs because city people don't like to get out and lock them) It got a steady 18 MPH going back and forth to work and loaded with a Jason fiber glass cap and our hunting gear for 2 weeks at deer camp. It could only do about 83 MPH on the interstate with the pedal half way thru the floor. 4:10 isn't a gear for me I found out even though I pull a tri axel 22ft equipment trailer and a 22 ft' enclosed V nose trailer About 50% of the time.
Now the third I have a 2004.5 SRW 3500 4x4 6 sp manual 3:73 gear. Just got back from Wisconsin a week ago I got 22 MPG running a mix of 2 lane roads where you got to slow way down going thru some of those small one store villages and I 75.
This would be a truck that got close to 25 or better MPG if the Dodge enginners had any brains. I't got over twice the rated HP of my 91 but they will only put a 3:73 gear in it, again the city people got the locking hubs removed and no option to get them.
Would i buy a new Diesel tomorrow over a gasser. You bet I would even with the city-facation of them.
1991
2004.5
Al
I wonder how much the new Ford 6-cylinder 3.5L Ecoboost (and successive generations) will change this. I'm not a convert yet, but the more I read about them, the more I like what I'm hearing.
bullittman281
ArboristSite Operative
As I understand the Eco boost it has to run on both gasoline and E85 to do its magic. I'll pass on anything that NEEDS 2 fuel systems.
Oldtimer
Addicted to ArboristSite
I have a 2000 F550 4x4 dump with a 9' plow, it's a 7.3 International Diesel.
Even though I have just replaced both front wheel bearings (Whole wheel hub is the bearing, $103 each) both locking hubs ($230 Warn) the fuel pump ($160), a stubby front axle shaft and U-joint ($140) and various related seals ($80)...I dearly love my truck. The engine is rock solid.
The stuff I replaced is all normal wear stuff on an 11 year old heavy work rig. Not upset.
When I want to haul 2 cords of green wood, or plow 28" of heavy snow, I can.
The diesel makes that possible. I suppose a V-10 could also do it, but 6 MPG vs 10-14 in my diesel? Heck no. Seriously, my 12 pound (EMPTY!) 4x6 truck can get as much as 14 MPG @ torque converter lock-up in 4th (Around 32-35 MPH).
Show me a gasser than can do that.
Even though I have just replaced both front wheel bearings (Whole wheel hub is the bearing, $103 each) both locking hubs ($230 Warn) the fuel pump ($160), a stubby front axle shaft and U-joint ($140) and various related seals ($80)...I dearly love my truck. The engine is rock solid.
The stuff I replaced is all normal wear stuff on an 11 year old heavy work rig. Not upset.
When I want to haul 2 cords of green wood, or plow 28" of heavy snow, I can.
The diesel makes that possible. I suppose a V-10 could also do it, but 6 MPG vs 10-14 in my diesel? Heck no. Seriously, my 12 pound (EMPTY!) 4x6 truck can get as much as 14 MPG @ torque converter lock-up in 4th (Around 32-35 MPH).
Show me a gasser than can do that.
Oldtimer
Addicted to ArboristSite
Also, not using a quality diesel supplement at every fuel up is very unwise.
The new low sulphur diesel fuel is very "dry", no lubrication value like the "old" diesel. Also, water is the enemy of a diesel. Religious use of a quality supplement keeps water at bay. And your truck is gaining water every day. It's just a fact.
TSC sells the Diesel Power supplement in a 1 gallon size for $12 here...that can take care of like 500 gallons of fuel. You are crazy not to use it.
The new low sulphur diesel fuel is very "dry", no lubrication value like the "old" diesel. Also, water is the enemy of a diesel. Religious use of a quality supplement keeps water at bay. And your truck is gaining water every day. It's just a fact.
TSC sells the Diesel Power supplement in a 1 gallon size for $12 here...that can take care of like 500 gallons of fuel. You are crazy not to use it.
I don't think there's any engine that requires both. My understanding is that Ford EcoBoost in the 2011 F-150 uses standard gasoline and not E85 or diesel.
jimbojango
ArboristSite Guru
I don't agree with your logic. I agree with Caterpiller's logic though. their fuel caps say "Buy clean fuel, keep it clean" and they mean it. If you buy #### you're getting ####. I never ever ever ever buy fuel unless it is at a reputable truck stop and i have several truck driver buddies to ask where to buy fuel.
If water was a problem you would think at 310,000 i'd have problems but i don't.. yet. My pump isn't running quite the PSI it did new (about 200 less) and i have a bad injector (or 2) but haven't ever replaced any of them. So spending $1000 bucks on her for the 2nd time in her life isn't much expense.
When you run 10,000 miles between oil changes how is that more expensive than a gasser? .... its not.
How is getting 20 MPG out of a diesel pickup not better than getting 14 or 16 out of a gasser. Just because the fuel per unit is higher doesn't mean the cost per 100 miles traveled is. The diesel will kill it driving the same distance.
A half ton w/ a v6 that gets the same milage is severly under powered to hold a longbed full of wood as well. Hell.. a v8 half ton is underpowered and underspringed to do it daily.
You guys are still buying snake oil for diesel additives. I'd believe the power service probably does some good but if i can go 300,000 without it i'll go another 200,000 without it. I just don't see any gains from it... i just don't. I don't run oil additives either.
One last thing: You guys and saying "gassers last 200,000" aren't thinking far enough ahead. If you buy a "newer" dodge and drive it to 500,000 and spend about the same amount on repairs as you would repairing 2 new gassers you're getting 2 pickups for the price of one plus the added engine cost, how the hell can you beat that? you can't!
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HD-tech-NH
ArboristSite Operative
I couldn't read it all because there was soooooo much crap! Crazy how people feel the need to chime in when they clearly don't know what they are talking about.
+1 to this! First we had low sulfur diesel now we have ultra low sulfur diesel. You need to add cetane and lubricity to this fuel. I use stanadyne. An additive is needed especially in cold climates My diesel will do whatever is asked of it with ease... that equals piece of mind. Also the cost of operation is far less than a gasser. That in addition to the performance and unsurpassed resale value make the initial cost easy to swallow for anyone with a drop of common sense.
trost66
ArboristSite Member
I had 95 12 valve, 97 dodge 12 valve , 2002 f450 with 7.3, 2003 dodge 5.9, 2004 2500 gmc with lb7 and a 2005 gmc with lly.
Stock I think the 12 valves were kinda under powered. Plus the early dodge front ends are junk. About every 6 months new track bar. Never had any problems with motor just not alot of power stock.
The 02 ford has been a good dump truck know problems. Had to replace a few things here and there but nothing major. I also think this motor is a little under power. I ended up putting a chip on it to give a little more grunt.
The 03 cummins I had was a good motor. Decent fuel milage and power. Put a bully dog programmer on it to give it a little more power.
The 04 gmc with lb7 has been a great truck. The thing that has chevy has over everybody else is that they have efi live. This is a great computer program for any gm product. You can do your on tuning or dianostic. It is so easy to get the hp out of the this trucks. The chevy will get the best fuel milage out of all of the big 3. I think alot of people on her are full of crap when saying there getting 20 or more with the cummins. I have had 3 cummins and never ever got better than 18.
Plus with efi you can have a tune mad just for fuel economy. I have 5 tunes mad just for my lb7. My big tune put I put down 628 hp to the ground. My daily driver tune put down 520 and will get 20 miles per gallon.
The only big problem with lb7 is its injectors. I replaced mine at 175,000. I ended up doing them myself and it wasn't really that bad.
I love the cummins and the duramax. I would have to go with the duramax over cummins just because I have had better luck.
Dont ever by a ford 6.0 . They will go through a few head gaskets.. When they designed the 6.0 they didn't put enough head studs in it. Worst part it if it blows you have to pull the entire cab off to fix it. There is a reason why you can get the pretty cheap.
Greatest thing about diesel is that there really easy to add hp. If you have ever road in a 5 or 6 hundred hp truck it will put a really big smile on you face. Espcially when your blowing by the little imports or mustangs. You know they say that diesel are the new muscle car.
Stock I think the 12 valves were kinda under powered. Plus the early dodge front ends are junk. About every 6 months new track bar. Never had any problems with motor just not alot of power stock.
The 02 ford has been a good dump truck know problems. Had to replace a few things here and there but nothing major. I also think this motor is a little under power. I ended up putting a chip on it to give a little more grunt.
The 03 cummins I had was a good motor. Decent fuel milage and power. Put a bully dog programmer on it to give it a little more power.
The 04 gmc with lb7 has been a great truck. The thing that has chevy has over everybody else is that they have efi live. This is a great computer program for any gm product. You can do your on tuning or dianostic. It is so easy to get the hp out of the this trucks. The chevy will get the best fuel milage out of all of the big 3. I think alot of people on her are full of crap when saying there getting 20 or more with the cummins. I have had 3 cummins and never ever got better than 18.
Plus with efi you can have a tune mad just for fuel economy. I have 5 tunes mad just for my lb7. My big tune put I put down 628 hp to the ground. My daily driver tune put down 520 and will get 20 miles per gallon.
The only big problem with lb7 is its injectors. I replaced mine at 175,000. I ended up doing them myself and it wasn't really that bad.
I love the cummins and the duramax. I would have to go with the duramax over cummins just because I have had better luck.
Dont ever by a ford 6.0 . They will go through a few head gaskets.. When they designed the 6.0 they didn't put enough head studs in it. Worst part it if it blows you have to pull the entire cab off to fix it. There is a reason why you can get the pretty cheap.
Greatest thing about diesel is that there really easy to add hp. If you have ever road in a 5 or 6 hundred hp truck it will put a really big smile on you face. Espcially when your blowing by the little imports or mustangs. You know they say that diesel are the new muscle car.
flyfshrmn
ArboristSite Lurker
diesel trucks
There is no reason to buy a gas truck if you do any hauling at all. Get a diesel. It will get better overall mileage, better unloaded mileage and far better towing mileage. I've owned two fords, an 87 6.9L and a 2003 7.3L. Had the 87 for 16 years and I'm working on year 7 for the 2003. Towed anything and everything, from small tent trailers to a 23 foot airstream and a 16 foot flatbed that will hold 5 cords (25000 lbs.) of wood. The dodges have great engines, get a little better mileage but have more mechanical problems. The earlier Chevy Duramax was underpowered, had a lot of tranny problems, but they seem to have addressed those issues. The single biggest problem is that it's very difficult to work on these units and do anything other than routine maintenance on them. On my 6.9 I did all the repairs, upgrades, maintenance, etc. but that engine had no computer. The newer engines are better and far more reliable as a tradeoff against complexity. they will cost more to maintain and repair. Do proper maintenance and upkeep and the truck will go at least 250K without requiring much except oil, filters, and lubrication and a few belt changes. And they will tow anything, anywhere. Not the case with gassers.
There is no reason to buy a gas truck if you do any hauling at all. Get a diesel. It will get better overall mileage, better unloaded mileage and far better towing mileage. I've owned two fords, an 87 6.9L and a 2003 7.3L. Had the 87 for 16 years and I'm working on year 7 for the 2003. Towed anything and everything, from small tent trailers to a 23 foot airstream and a 16 foot flatbed that will hold 5 cords (25000 lbs.) of wood. The dodges have great engines, get a little better mileage but have more mechanical problems. The earlier Chevy Duramax was underpowered, had a lot of tranny problems, but they seem to have addressed those issues. The single biggest problem is that it's very difficult to work on these units and do anything other than routine maintenance on them. On my 6.9 I did all the repairs, upgrades, maintenance, etc. but that engine had no computer. The newer engines are better and far more reliable as a tradeoff against complexity. they will cost more to maintain and repair. Do proper maintenance and upkeep and the truck will go at least 250K without requiring much except oil, filters, and lubrication and a few belt changes. And they will tow anything, anywhere. Not the case with gassers.
bullittman281
ArboristSite Operative
It looks like I'm wrong on the ecoboost. Some prototypes used both fuels. It looks like the production one only needs one kind of fuel. It still wont perform like a coal burner though. HP peek is 5k. Tq numbers are better but its specs are more inline with a gas v8 instead, so you get all the limitations of a gas motor, plus more complexity, for fuel mileage that approaches a diesel with out all the extra power.
bullittman
bullittman
HD-tech-NH
ArboristSite Operative
ding! crap
ding! crap
ding!... see this is only the last page and it's full of people who dont know what they're talking about... To the OP do your own research on the web and test drive all of the trucks you are considering.
jimbojango
ArboristSite Guru
Really now? I'm starting to wonder if you're the one with DING! CRAP!
Everyone is entitled to an opinion. I just don't see how 90% of the people that live within 30 miles of me that i know, most of whom are farmers/ranchers, don't use any fuel additives, hardly ever have to have injectors or pumps rebuilt, and don't pull the ever living hell out of them. Almost all are Dodges BTW. Hardly any of these guys ever have their trucks worked on unless they hit someone. Maybe where you live your diesel is different than ours, and maybe you drive a chevrolet or something but the only dodge I've ever heard anyone complain about was an 07 6.7 and dodge wound up giving the guy another truck because it was electrical related, not engine related.
jimbojango
ArboristSite Guru
I'm also pretty willing to bet that one of the best engine mechanics in the world for pickups lives about 60 miles from here and he's the one that told all of us not to use a bunch of that crap. Besides that, how many diesels are in New Hampshire? I'll bet not very man per capita
I probably own more diesel engines that most towns back there.I brought a yacht up from florida a few years ago and she had dirty fuel in her tanks. We had the fuel pumped out and scrubbed somewere in North Carolina by a guy who takes care of the Coast Guard and Navy boats down there (they only keep there diesel fuel for 6 months, if it is unused they pay this guy $2.50 a gallon to take it away) He told me that of the over 200 different kinds of diesel fuel supplements on the market, only two or so passed military testing and are approved for use in military engines. I was told that unless I was buying these military spec fuel additives, I was in effect buying "Snake Oil". With that said, I still use anti-gelling agent in my off road tanks but have never run it in my pickups or heavy trucks.
trost66
ArboristSite Member
ding!... see this is only the last page and it's full of people who dont know what they're talking about... To the OP do your own research on the web and test drive all of the trucks you are considering.
I have owned and driven the big three for 14 yrs now. We own a tree service and do alot of pulling. Not sure where you are getting where I dont know what I"m talking about. I've did alot of research on the forum about these trucks. All the stuff I've stated in my last post is from my own experience. Not sure what you think is crap. As of right now I have 4 diesel trucks and the gmc by far is the best one.
To the OP I think it also comes down to how much you want to spend. Of the big 3 they all have there problems. Of the big 3 I have had the least amount of problems with my GMC.
I have owned and driven the big three for 14 yrs now. We own a tree service and do alot of pulling. Not sure where you are getting where I dont know what I"m talking about. I've did alot of research on the forum about these trucks. All the stuff I've stated in my last post is from my own experience. Not sure what you think is crap. As of right now I have 4 diesel trucks and the gmc by far is the best one.
To the OP I think it also comes down to how much you want to spend. Of the big 3 they all have there problems. Of the big 3 I have had the least amount of problems with my GMC.
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