miking
ArboristSite Operative
The Echo website says 13 lbs wo b/c
Echo cs-600p owners?
- Thread starter Trigger Man
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Javelin
Addicted to ArboristSite
Could be an interesting alternative to a 362!
I've heard more than once from people that own both that they run right with the 4.4hp Stihl 361. Steve
o8f150
Tree Freak
i am getting my new 600p friday,,i will run it and see how it goes
bcsizemo
ArboristSite Member
And some people say that an engine that needs to be pushed to 4k rpm to make power and turns that much at 75 is a suck design as well....but then again I don't like Honda.
I think a better car analogy for an Echo would be the 90's Chevy S-10 with the 4.3 liter engine. Sure it's not pretty, nor fast. But it makes good mid range torque, and if taken care of will last you many many miles.
That or some versions of the Toyota Corolla...(if we need an Asian car.)
-either way I sort of see your point.
NuConcepts
ArboristSite Operative
i use to dislike echo saws, i loved every other product they brought to the table. ever since they started selling cs-370 and cs-400's i feel they have reinvented themselves as saw makers. I feel that quality has always been offered by echo along with simplicity. Although at times, i felt they didn't offer the best product on the market, they never offered a inferior product.im not going to lie, i buy 10 chainsaws a week from a a saw shop. all i can say is i see alot more ms250's that need crank bearings than the echo's and husqvarnas. even though echo will never have the resell value of stihl or husqvarna. it is a brand that has good dealer support, they have a large customer brand recognition from box stores, have a warranty that people acknowledge. its a product that has many selling points. I feel echo never lost quality, as i see plenty of 20 year old echo saws running strong right along with the rest of them. and to the above poster comparing echo to a company,sorry you can't compare it to a s-10 with a 4.3. that would make echo saws, compact gas hogs that are outdated. its more like a new civic si with power, torque, efficiency, and simplicity that people trust. The big question is what if honda made a chainsaw?
bcsizemo
ArboristSite Member
And when most people that will even run an Echo on here talk about them they typically mention the broad low rpm power band. A K20 with an 8k rpm redline and peak torque around 6k, isn't what I call a torquey engine.
If Honda made a chainsaw I'm sure it'd spin fast and want to run fast.
Hell as long as it cuts wood and has fairly good reliability that's half the battle.
It'd be interesting if Honda started making saws...I don't know if their reputation would be enough to sway people from the Husky/Stihl camps or not.
(Now I'll stop interrupting this thread.)
I love Echo. I became familiar with their weed eaters and blowers. I did not even know they made chain saws until about two years ago. Last year I bought a Poulan 4620. The first one the tool less adjust was cracked from the factory. The second one was an Awesome Cutter. However the tool less design constantly needed adjusting until it fell off while I was cutting. I decided to go with better Quality and got the Echo cs-400p and it was a great saw. I just needed more saw as I was cutting larger trees 30" plus. A few weeks ago I traded up for the cs-600p. I like the saw. It is a real screamer, And it gets there fast. It is a great saw right out of the box. However I want to get the most out of life. Like everyone else.
I am curious as to what tweaks, other owners/tuners have found this saw responds well to?
I am curious as to what tweaks, other owners/tuners have found this saw responds well to?
zogger
Tree Freak
I have two
Second tank (all using echo mix at 50 to one with non ethanol fuel 92 octane fresh)(ya, one guy near me still has non ethanol fuel) I used it more "regular" just cutting a few on a big oak branch, then stopping, letting it cool down while I was trimming more with my Husky137. Worked fine.
Next trip out, after cleaning and filing, was to attack a huge shagbark hickory that had blown over. Filled the tank, made about four cuts in some around 24 inch stuff, it stalled. OK, started it again (not pushing it hard, just letting it drop at its own speed in the cut). Stalled again...whuttheheck. Started it again, finished the cut, went to the next, stalled.....fine. This is six cuts now, big rounds on the ground. Went back to the tractor with it, opened the tank and it was freaking EMPTY. It had used all the mix! And it has not started since. Compression does not seem very good. Don't have it apart, it's not seized but it did seem excessively hot. I took the plug out, wet with fuel. cleaned it, dried it out by turning it upside down, etc (after draining the tank) pulled cord about a dozen times, let it sit, cleaned the plug good and dried it off, stuck it in..bupkis. I think I now have a very expensive to me piece of garage art. Maybe it is salvageable...
The second one is still in the box and I am afraid to even try it out now, as I borrowed the loot to get the saws in the first place and have no more scratch to get another big saw. (purchase price to me was close to two saws new for the price of one is why I got them, craigslist ). (Oh I checked the label, made in Japan models)
So you tell me if they are good or not. While running it would pull and cut fine, then it just..quit. It very well could be operator error on my part, I tried to break it in correctly, and not sure what I could do different.
Anyone who might have any hints on resurrecting the first saw please chime in. The second one I will wait until I am more familiar with these saws (read a lot here so far before registering), or sell it still new and try to get something else that works in a similar class (I need a larger saw, my 137 works great for smaller stuff).
I bought two of them NIB from some dude who was going to start a wood business then got offered a heavy equipment operator job out of state and was moving (he had a lot of other stuff for sale at his garage sale). He had gotten them from HD and then never used them and waited too long to take them back. Anyway, I set one up with the 20" bar, started OK, ran it slow then some fast then slow etc for the first tank.Anyone running a echo 600p, looked one over at the dealers today, looked well made, any issues with them, what's the power output?, there site only gives cc's no hp #'s
Second tank (all using echo mix at 50 to one with non ethanol fuel 92 octane fresh)(ya, one guy near me still has non ethanol fuel) I used it more "regular" just cutting a few on a big oak branch, then stopping, letting it cool down while I was trimming more with my Husky137. Worked fine.
Next trip out, after cleaning and filing, was to attack a huge shagbark hickory that had blown over. Filled the tank, made about four cuts in some around 24 inch stuff, it stalled. OK, started it again (not pushing it hard, just letting it drop at its own speed in the cut). Stalled again...whuttheheck. Started it again, finished the cut, went to the next, stalled.....fine. This is six cuts now, big rounds on the ground. Went back to the tractor with it, opened the tank and it was freaking EMPTY. It had used all the mix! And it has not started since. Compression does not seem very good. Don't have it apart, it's not seized but it did seem excessively hot. I took the plug out, wet with fuel. cleaned it, dried it out by turning it upside down, etc (after draining the tank) pulled cord about a dozen times, let it sit, cleaned the plug good and dried it off, stuck it in..bupkis. I think I now have a very expensive to me piece of garage art. Maybe it is salvageable...
The second one is still in the box and I am afraid to even try it out now, as I borrowed the loot to get the saws in the first place and have no more scratch to get another big saw. (purchase price to me was close to two saws new for the price of one is why I got them, craigslist ). (Oh I checked the label, made in Japan models)
So you tell me if they are good or not. While running it would pull and cut fine, then it just..quit. It very well could be operator error on my part, I tried to break it in correctly, and not sure what I could do different.
Anyone who might have any hints on resurrecting the first saw please chime in. The second one I will wait until I am more familiar with these saws (read a lot here so far before registering), or sell it still new and try to get something else that works in a similar class (I need a larger saw, my 137 works great for smaller stuff).
o8f150
Tree Freak
those for some reason,,,well thanks to the epa,,is running real lean out of the box,,,i had to fatten mine up a little over a 1/4 turn on both sides,,,so trim the limiters and try it,,should take care of the problem
If Honda made a chainsaw it would probably be a 4-stroke.
miking
ArboristSite Operative
There are clear instructions in the owners manual about how to set the carb adjustments prior to any serious work time. I think a LOT of people miss this and have problems with Echo saws. My 600 hasn't had a ton of time yet but it has performed flawlessly. You might want to check that manual out before you get to carried away worrying about it. Just fyi.
if honda could make a 60cc 4stroke sound like 600cc they would really have something
zogger
Tree Freak
Well, thanks for the speedy reply! By trim the limiters, you mean cut them off or something? I still have the dang warranty card, it was never filled out and sent in, so I don't want to take a chance on any mods in case there's a wild chance I might be able to get a rebuild or exchange or fix. Like I said, it doesn't seem to have much compression, I can pull it easy without pushing in the decompression valve.
OK, I have its brother that is still new sitting next to me now, pulled the air cleaner cover to peek at the carb, see the two plastic caps for the adjustments, looks to be for the tiny screwdriver that came in the box with the scrench and the torx bit/handle thing. Will they adjust enough without taking those plastic caps out or off, or what? Thanks in advance. I WANT to like these new saws obviously, but I also don't want to bugger any chance I might have at the warranty in case the busted one is really fried. Nearest echo dealers to me are all quite a drive round trip. Not sure if home depot would take them back either without the original receipt, especially at a different store from purchase.
zogger
Tree Freak
Thanks, I'll check that manual again, just wasn't expecting it to not start at all and to go through a whole tank in six cuts after working just fine on some other wood. I guess I just wasn't aware that it needed a lot of adjustment right off the bat, thought you should wait until several tanks through the thing. That's why I stopped everything and read a lot here and joined the forum.(well, I am getting into cutting more lately as well and would have joined anyway. Possibility exists for me to be doing some extra work for money soon with saws so wanted them for both my storm cleanup duties/firewood and then on to some other work).
The saw worked great on my rooftop storm damaged huge log that fell, coupla tons of real old red oak, even took my time on the larger parts almost 30 inches and it cut it well. Coupla cuts, stop, let cool down. Tried to break it in what I thought was the correct way. This is only my second new saw, all my other ones have been well used and cheap, wore them out and got my money's worth from them. All cheapos though, these two new 600ps are my first foray into new and big.
The construction guys are supposed to be here like next week to fix all the damage, but in the meantime I still have next winter's wood to cut and I usually just combine that with my fence clearing and fallen over trees I have to cleanup.
dellwas
ArboristSite Operative
Mine is a Canadian model, and tuned by the dealer prior to picking up, and again after 5-6 tanks or so. No issues with mine. Don't know if there are any differences between the two, but Echo has manuals for Cdn. and American online. I suspect ours isn't quite as lean from the get go, as I'm pretty sure Canada does not have emission standards on chainsaws - yet....
I haven't found an Echo saw right out of the box yet that didn't need custom tuned. Without exception they have all been WAY too lean, and if some fuel had not been added, then would have lean seized in short order.
Other than that small problem, which is more of an issue with Echo trying to please the EPA that a fundamental design problem/poor construction with their saws, not the first problem one with any of the Echo saws that I own or have owned.
Some of the models they make are not all that impressive for power production, but all have bee dead solid reliable in all areas. I did NOT like the big CS-800, and sold both of the CS-670's that I had. I loaned out my CS-6700 over a year ago, and don't care if it comes back or not?
The CS-510 is very impressive, and it is one of my favorite saws. It is on par with a closed port Husqvarna 55 for power, and the anti-vibe is excellent.
I've been looking at the 600P's, but right now I'm good with saws in that range, so not in a really big hurry to get one. It would be nice to see how one compares to a Husqvarna 262XP?.....Cliff
Other than that small problem, which is more of an issue with Echo trying to please the EPA that a fundamental design problem/poor construction with their saws, not the first problem one with any of the Echo saws that I own or have owned.
Some of the models they make are not all that impressive for power production, but all have bee dead solid reliable in all areas. I did NOT like the big CS-800, and sold both of the CS-670's that I had. I loaned out my CS-6700 over a year ago, and don't care if it comes back or not?
The CS-510 is very impressive, and it is one of my favorite saws. It is on par with a closed port Husqvarna 55 for power, and the anti-vibe is excellent.
I've been looking at the 600P's, but right now I'm good with saws in that range, so not in a really big hurry to get one. It would be nice to see how one compares to a Husqvarna 262XP?.....Cliff
Zombiechopper
Addicted to ArboristSite
Honda wants nothing to do with anything two stroke so if they made a saw it would be valved for sure. I can't see how they would be even remotely interested in that market though...
zogger
Tree Freak
Update/got it running again
OK, I took the muffler off to take a peek at the piston and cylinder, looked medium shot to me, but what do I know, never worked on chainsaws before. Anyway, as long as I own it, and a new P/C is outta the question for now, I go whut the heck, it ain't running so who cares, and spray some pb blaster in the plug hole, after running it to the top, swirl it around so it can soak down and get to the ring, and let it sit for two hours in the sun. Then I leaned it over and drained out what was left, and pumped it several times to finish getting it out. I did notice it was "bubbling" a little as the piston went up and down, from below the ring.
Went and got the mix I was using for the husky, that has ethanol in it, because I am suspecting the non ethanol fuel, looks yellowish to me even though it was bought allegedly "fresh". I am going to dump that stuff.
Left the muffler off, pulled choke, few pulls, felt better, coughed. Another yank, vroom! Quick pushed in choke and squeezed it to keep it running. Smoked like your uncle ernie's old de soto. Let it run a bit, started clearing up some. Gentle revs up to guessing half WOT, then back, let it idle. Started it without using the decompression valve, I wanted all the compression it might have. And no idea what it is now beyond "working level", don't have a compression tester either, seems "reasonable" but not overly high or strong with the finger over the plug hole test.
Turned it off, let it cool, drained fuel, started it again, let it run out. Next day, same thing, same results. Seems to work better but still smokes on first start and always smokes a little even after running several minutes. Clears up some after it warms up but not all the way. Seems to have power, but I have NOT run it to WOT yet, as I am afraid to damage it further.
So..think it is salvageable as-is, just keep using it? I haven't done any carb adjustments yet because I am BAWK BAWK BAWK chicken. Can I just let it idle a lot and break it in that way better?
man I know these are dumb questions...I have successfully rebuilt car engines from scratch and they worked fine, no burning oil or leaks, but am still taking baby steps with these two stroke saws. All my other small engine stuff mostly works so never had to do much beyond cleaning out carbs, etc. Heck, I have a BS IC engine with over 1,000 hours on it still runs well and doesn't smoke! On its third mower body.
The point being I don't feel totally helpless, just don't want to further damage the saw by doing something stupid, and maybe get it "good enough" to use for this winter at least.
IF you were a saw tuner noob, how would you go about it, seeing as how I have no saw tach and my ear isn't trained yet? I believe you guys on them not running right out of the box and need adjustments with the limiter caps pulled off. Driving a whole bunch to pay some guy ain't happening right now though.
Think I should pop for just another stock cheap piston ring first (buy it online some place? Where?), or just wear out what is there? I am mostly tapped finances wise until..well..next year so any fixes have to be cheap.
Also, the mix...is 10% ethanol premium OK, I can get the freshest gas around here at the highway truck stop most likely, and then 50 or 40 to one with echo mix oil, or what? The saw guys I have spoken to around here all hate ethanol, but that non ethanol stuff I got looks rank, so that is out, no more. He must get it already stale or something, small independent station.
I can use this first saw for my experimenting and getting used to it, then apply what I learn to the other NIB model I have sitting here untouched. I need these here saws to work, and eventually have one with the 27" bar for bigger stuff I need to cut once in awhile (that is what is recommended right on the saw casing on a sticker). Then I will have three, 16" on the husky, this one is 20, then the larger, should suffice for all my needs.
thanks in advance, oh ye great smart guys!
OK, I took the muffler off to take a peek at the piston and cylinder, looked medium shot to me, but what do I know, never worked on chainsaws before. Anyway, as long as I own it, and a new P/C is outta the question for now, I go whut the heck, it ain't running so who cares, and spray some pb blaster in the plug hole, after running it to the top, swirl it around so it can soak down and get to the ring, and let it sit for two hours in the sun. Then I leaned it over and drained out what was left, and pumped it several times to finish getting it out. I did notice it was "bubbling" a little as the piston went up and down, from below the ring.
Went and got the mix I was using for the husky, that has ethanol in it, because I am suspecting the non ethanol fuel, looks yellowish to me even though it was bought allegedly "fresh". I am going to dump that stuff.
Left the muffler off, pulled choke, few pulls, felt better, coughed. Another yank, vroom! Quick pushed in choke and squeezed it to keep it running. Smoked like your uncle ernie's old de soto. Let it run a bit, started clearing up some. Gentle revs up to guessing half WOT, then back, let it idle. Started it without using the decompression valve, I wanted all the compression it might have. And no idea what it is now beyond "working level", don't have a compression tester either, seems "reasonable" but not overly high or strong with the finger over the plug hole test.
Turned it off, let it cool, drained fuel, started it again, let it run out. Next day, same thing, same results. Seems to work better but still smokes on first start and always smokes a little even after running several minutes. Clears up some after it warms up but not all the way. Seems to have power, but I have NOT run it to WOT yet, as I am afraid to damage it further.
So..think it is salvageable as-is, just keep using it? I haven't done any carb adjustments yet because I am BAWK BAWK BAWK chicken. Can I just let it idle a lot and break it in that way better?
man I know these are dumb questions...I have successfully rebuilt car engines from scratch and they worked fine, no burning oil or leaks, but am still taking baby steps with these two stroke saws. All my other small engine stuff mostly works so never had to do much beyond cleaning out carbs, etc. Heck, I have a BS IC engine with over 1,000 hours on it still runs well and doesn't smoke! On its third mower body.
The point being I don't feel totally helpless, just don't want to further damage the saw by doing something stupid, and maybe get it "good enough" to use for this winter at least.
IF you were a saw tuner noob, how would you go about it, seeing as how I have no saw tach and my ear isn't trained yet? I believe you guys on them not running right out of the box and need adjustments with the limiter caps pulled off. Driving a whole bunch to pay some guy ain't happening right now though.
Think I should pop for just another stock cheap piston ring first (buy it online some place? Where?), or just wear out what is there? I am mostly tapped finances wise until..well..next year so any fixes have to be cheap.
Also, the mix...is 10% ethanol premium OK, I can get the freshest gas around here at the highway truck stop most likely, and then 50 or 40 to one with echo mix oil, or what? The saw guys I have spoken to around here all hate ethanol, but that non ethanol stuff I got looks rank, so that is out, no more. He must get it already stale or something, small independent station.
I can use this first saw for my experimenting and getting used to it, then apply what I learn to the other NIB model I have sitting here untouched. I need these here saws to work, and eventually have one with the 27" bar for bigger stuff I need to cut once in awhile (that is what is recommended right on the saw casing on a sticker). Then I will have three, 16" on the husky, this one is 20, then the larger, should suffice for all my needs.
thanks in advance, oh ye great smart guys!
