grinding the rizers ??
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By rizers, do you mean the depth gauges?
Wet1
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Yes... taking too much off will make the chain grabby and it possibly will not cut any faster.
Former Saw Builder
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A cheap file-o-plate from Baileys Online will help you get them file right everytime...
http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=65993&catID=273
Just get the right one for your chain size.
http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=65993&catID=273
Just get the right one for your chain size.
Yes the depth gauges right ahead of the cutters, we always called them rizers.
The problem Iv'e had with most gauges is they always say that the rizers don't need to be cut , they don't allow for wanting to take a little more oof , unless the file o plate is made different , I have only tried the gauges that are about 6'' long 1/2'' wide that you set on the chain . Like tis one http://www.hardwareandtools.com/invt/6564215?ref=gbase
The problem Iv'e had with most gauges is they always say that the rizers don't need to be cut , they don't allow for wanting to take a little more oof , unless the file o plate is made different , I have only tried the gauges that are about 6'' long 1/2'' wide that you set on the chain . Like tis one http://www.hardwareandtools.com/invt/6564215?ref=gbase
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We call them rakers here but it doesn't matter. really depends on your saw size and the bar size. If you have lots of horsepower and can pull the extra depth that the cutter is going to take then yes, it will cut faster. If you don't have the power, then the chain wil grab and bite and will be a real pita for ya. Try to take an equal amount off also or your chain will cut crooked.
I usually do it by eye, whatever feels right for you and your saw.
bluequill56
ArboristSite Operative
If time allows, I set them on new chains. Of course, if time does not allow, I just slap 'em on and go. I am surprised at the variationn I find. They seem to come set @ .025 +/- .005. I typically put them @ .030" using the Stihl depth gage tool & a file. I played with .035 a bit, but thought it was a little too aggressive for my preference.
logbutcher
Addicted to ArboristSite
I used to drop the rakers on new chains...for years thinking it would cut "faster". Uh-uh, no way. Yes, it grabbed, bounced, jumped in the cut and this macho thinking it was cool. Until a pro showed me the way of the raker: .025 to .030. More than that it dulls the edge faster, makes for a slower cut ( dumb me ), and gives you more of a chance to experience the Joy of Kickback ( JOK ).
Now I use the Pferd system filer: does the edge and the raker in one pass. Don't know why more don't use this system --just follow the witness line on the top of the chain.
Easy.opcorn:
Now I use the Pferd system filer: does the edge and the raker in one pass. Don't know why more don't use this system
--just follow the witness line on the top of the chain.Easy.
opcorn:Alright , I got my new chain a little screwed up , I eye-balled just tapping the rizers with a small cut-off tool and it made the saw a little jumpy in the wood , so I got out the gauges and got them more evenly filed down but its more than the gauges call for , it cuts better now but it seems like something is still not 100% , I have the northern sharpener on the way , maybe a good sharpening and a another look at the rizers will get it back to 100% , the only way I can explain what its doing is - first it will want to pull into the log and other times it needs a little rocking to get it to pull again , its off and on that way , not a nice steady pull.
Log butcher , seems like a good tool , never heard of them , if I didn't have the northern sharpener comming I would look into it . thanks
24d , what do you mean buy a larger sprocket ?
Log butcher , seems like a good tool , never heard of them , if I didn't have the northern sharpener comming I would look into it . thanks
24d , what do you mean buy a larger sprocket ?
scotclayshooter
Addicted to ArboristSite
http://www.arboristsite.com/showpost.php?p=11609&postcount=16
There are lots of posts on using a progressive method on the depth gauges
I use the Husqvarna version of the file o plate but it wont fit on all makes of chain, So i use the Stihl tool and then radius/angle the raker after setting the depth.
The raker gauge that comes in the Oregon sharpening kit is junk IMO I think they end up being progressive as the wear down real quick!
There are lots of posts on using a progressive method on the depth gauges
I use the Husqvarna version of the file o plate but it wont fit on all makes of chain, So i use the Stihl tool and then radius/angle the raker after setting the depth.
The raker gauge that comes in the Oregon sharpening kit is junk IMO I think they end up being progressive as the wear down real quick!
scotclayshooter
Addicted to ArboristSite
So whats your opinions on filing the rakers all from one side of the saw.
I always hold the tool in my left hand and file with my right but never turn the saw to do the rakers! Seems to work fine for me
I always hold the tool in my left hand and file with my right but never turn the saw to do the rakers! Seems to work fine for me
Cadenhill
ArboristSite Member
We always referred to them as rakers in this area also. I had a tough old time logger teach me to file chains by hand in the 60's and can honestly say that I have never had a machine sharpened chain on any of my saws. Some of that is to do with a dealer we had in the area in the old days who was a bit of a shyster who would grind more than needed hoping to sell chains. Once he got good competition he was gone.
I file the rakers about every 3rd time I sharpen and have never used a gauge. Sometimes you can get a little grabby but after a few cuts it will start to smooth out. Different brand chains vary in the hardness of the raker also
Like someone stated horsepower, makes a difference how the chain pulls and can determine how much you are able to take off rakers. At the end of the day I always like to clean the saw up, sharpen, flip the bar and dress it with a file, clean the groove and oil holes. Nice to pick up the saw and its ready to go.
Something people don't look at also is that dull chains are tough on anti-vibration mounts.
I file the rakers about every 3rd time I sharpen and have never used a gauge. Sometimes you can get a little grabby but after a few cuts it will start to smooth out. Different brand chains vary in the hardness of the raker also
Like someone stated horsepower, makes a difference how the chain pulls and can determine how much you are able to take off rakers. At the end of the day I always like to clean the saw up, sharpen, flip the bar and dress it with a file, clean the groove and oil holes. Nice to pick up the saw and its ready to go.
Something people don't look at also is that dull chains are tough on anti-vibration mounts.
Lakeside53
Stihl Wrenching
So whats your opinions on filing the rakers all from one side of the saw.
I always hold the tool in my left hand and file with my right but never turn the saw to do the rakers! Seems to work fine for me
I do... works fine.
flatpikr
ArboristSite Operative
Wood Hardness and depth gauges.
I'm not sure if anyone mentioned it- but I'm guessing you should use less depth for ironwood than for cedar. I just bought an .040 depth gauge tool and will be experimenting with that depth as I cut green cedar (juniper) exclusively. I also use a round stone in a dremel and take them down quite quickly. Of course, I've spent most of my adult life with a drill in my hand so I'm comfortable cutting down depth gauges as I do. I'd rather hit the timber a little on the low side (say 035) than on the high side (say 025). The professional loggers I know, who cut pondo and fir, like .040.
I'm not sure if anyone mentioned it- but I'm guessing you should use less depth for ironwood than for cedar. I just bought an .040 depth gauge tool and will be experimenting with that depth as I cut green cedar (juniper) exclusively. I also use a round stone in a dremel and take them down quite quickly. Of course, I've spent most of my adult life with a drill in my hand so I'm comfortable cutting down depth gauges as I do. I'd rather hit the timber a little on the low side (say 035) than on the high side (say 025). The professional loggers I know, who cut pondo and fir, like .040.
scotclayshooter
Addicted to ArboristSite
You ever notice that the rakers on one side might take 3 rubs of the file and the other side only one? Or is that just me
scotclayshooter
Addicted to ArboristSite
The Husqvarna tool has 2 holes for the raker to stick through one has hard and the other soft marked on them.
Lakeside53
Stihl Wrenching
You ever notice that the rakers on one side might take 3 rubs of the file and the other side only one? Or is that just me
Depends on the angle you hold the raker tool at and whether your left and right cutters are the same height
Lower rakers on one side (and with respect to the cutter) will make you cut crooked far faster than anything else (other then rocking-out one side lolol).
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scotclayshooter
Addicted to ArboristSite
Depends on the angle you hold the raker tool at and whether your left and right cutters are the same height
Lower rakers on one side (and with respect to the cutter) will make you cut crooked far faster than anything else (other then rocking-out one side lolol).
My chains cut straight
(Mostly)Sharpening a chain is almost fun but rakers are hard work, My hand hurts doing rakers.
Did the chain on our other squads ms180 the other week they sharpened it from one side only so 30deg on one side of the cutters and 5deg on the other!
I doubt the rakers were ever done and the freehanded 4mm file with no handle they were using was almost fully below the tooth!
Lucky i have a Stihl kit with guide its bloody awkward trying to pull the file up to lose the hook!
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