Just came across this...

[madhatte]

Oddly, the plundering of native sites is exactly why the Antiquities Act was written into law. Apparently, around the turn of the 20th century, spurred by the vogue for Egyptian relics, anything that seemed "ancient" was big business.

I have yet to find remains, but, especially in some parts of our forest near sketchy places like Spanaway, I'm always worried that I'm going to.

 

[BeatCJ]

I thought Eucalyptus was an imported species? Hard to see how it could qualify for any protection.

It seems foolish (now I'll get in trouble for thinking) to inhibit the timber industry for it's impact on the Monarch Butterfly when ethanol production (habitat lost from land taken out of CRP to plant corn) is a far greater issue. Heck, reseed logging areas with milkweed, and timber production would probably help preserve the species.

I drove a stake into a grave one time, it was off the edge of a cemetery. Not marked by a headstone or anything. We were widening at an intersection to add a left turn pocket, the excavation must have just missed it when they cut the slopes years before. We ended up having to buy Right of Way on the other side of the highway and shift the alignment. Hit a trash dump, had to have an archaeologist come look at it. She said it's just garbage, only cost us a few hours. Ended up placing all that material in the bottom of a hole we were filling.

 

[madhatte]

At this point, I'm pretty sure most of these issues are decided based more on emotional than logical or even legal precedents. The wildlife folks are so used to getting their way, and the agencies they push around so used to losing the battle, that due diligence is an afterthought. My suspicion is that this will continue until it's simply too expensive to buy timber products, after which point some court case will rule in favor of the timber sale, setting the stage for others to do likewise. In the distant future, I would like to see an equilibrium where both sides' basic needs are met. The business will not likely ever look like the heyday of logging in the 60's and 70's, nor will it look like it does today. I also suspect that climate change will drive some policy decisions, particularly the link between fire suppression and salvage, which have been at the center of a good portion of the hottest debates of late. My guess is that salvage will get easier, but it will be too late so save out much of the volume, so a return to timely thinning will be a viable discussion again.

 

[Gologit]

Great post. Great predictions too. What you wrote should be required reading for everybody involved, pro or con, in timber harvest.

 

[bitzer]

I was an anthropology major and I had a professor tell me that if I ever find any human remains to just bury em back up and go about my business. The ensuing paperwork and attention from ologists, indians, and the media would never end.

The Dnr is the only organization I really ever have to deal with and most of them are too lazy to get out of their trucks to follow up on MFL timber sales. Thats my experience anyway. Fully mechanized logging is widely understood and expected in these parts. Folks are usually surprised that people still cut timber by hand.

 

[treeslayer2003]

same here bitz....i am a dinosour around here. i guess no one would cut the oversize if i didn't?

i never have any problem on the job site, its getting the permits approved to start with.

 

[Gologit]

I was an anthropology major and I had a professor tell me that if I ever find any human remains to just bury em back up and go about my business. The ensuing paperwork and attention from ologists, indians, and the media would never end.

That's always tempting. Just walk away and forget about it because you know what's going to happen if you turn it in.
Twice I've found remains that turned out to be murder victims and once I found what was later determined to be a suicide. All three had been in the woods a long time and the remains were skeletal and somewhat scattered. There are places around here where 100 feet off of the road might just as well be the middle of nowhere and where most people never tread. Good dumping grounds I guess.
In all three cases the families of the deceased had gone many years not knowing what had happened. Now they know. I'm not sure if that's good or bad but it's not really my call to make.
Was it a major PITA getting shut down, filling out reams of paperwork, being interviewed by several different types of law enforcement, and dealing with media people? Definitely.
Would I report the findings again? How could I not?

 

[bitzer]

Permits? We don't need no stinking permits... farmers don't seem to when dealing with water. Last time I checked if you want to cross a navigable stream(can float a canoe one day out of the year) that'll start at 300 bucks, plus you need to wait for approval, etc.

Bob- I meant to mention remains that were of historical significance. Anything on the surface probably requires some notification. I've got some forensic training and can identify most human bones. If I've got a skull in my hand I could tell you approx age, sex, race, approx time frame of deposit. I'm typing on a tablet these days with one finger so I usually keep things brief if I can. I would have done the same thing.

 

[bitzer]

Oh and I will be starting round two of logging the indian burial ground near my house. See when the govt wants it done so they look good its called "restoration". Personally I liked it better with the trees in the park.

 

[HuskStihl]

Bitzer, ya should have majored in husky boots n' coils!

 

[bitzer]

Bitzer, ya should have majored in husky boots n' coils!

Theres no money in that. No money in anthro either or forensics or going to school forever to work behind a counter counting pills (ok some money in that, but it sucks). Medical examiner jobs are hard to get too. Found that out the hard way as well. I've got enough goddam organic chemistry, physics, and calculus under my belt to create life out of booger and some tin foil tho.

 

[northmanlogging]

well the ingredients are cheap... maybe you'll create something useful?