Lopi Flue questions.

[bullittman281]

Hello,
I need some help. I've got an Answer set up as a fire place insert. The fire place is all masonry. I'm running an appropriate SS liner through the masonry tile liner. The SS liner is 6" and the tile liner is rectangular 6"X10" so i had to ovalise the SS liner to get it to fit. I don't remember off hand but I know I have at least 15' of chimney. I've had the stove for 5 years or so. At the time I didn't know any better but I think it performance is sub standard.

I always burn seasoned wood. The current stuff has bean curing for 3 years. It wont get any dryer. I get ~10% on a Harbor Freight moisture meter so I know my problems aren't the wood. I also run the stove very hot at like 700* to 800* trying to keep it burning clean and heat the house. It is a bit undersized but is should still burn clean. It doesn't burn clean though. I have to clean the chimney once a month and even at that rate there are huge barnacles the grow from top to bottom. The whole length of the liner builds up. I have a suspicion but whats my problem? These stoves should not be finicky to run and mine is a monster. Unless everything is perfect the secondary combustion dies out an the thing just smokes and smolders. Or if I'm really lucky the thing gets hot enough to run away and the top will get 900* or more with the air control all the way off. This generally happens after a bout with trying to get it hot enough to keep the secondary combustion lit. The only time is is smoke free is when it runs away, any other time is smokes like a freight train. There is nothing I can do to change it. If I leave the air open so it smokes less it will rapidly over heat. Something is not rite.

I have a suspicion that my problem is the tile liner is mashed against my SS liner and it acts as a big heat sink keeping my flue cold and causing a poor draft. I forget to mention above that my chimney exits the house at the peak of the roof so there is no way the house is acting like a better chimney.
Am I on the rite track thinking that I have poor draft?

I talked to the stove place today to see what they though and they weren't terribly helpful. I got more of the "YAhhH!!!!" salesman pitch but I did ask them about removing my tile liner and insulating my SS liner. Their response was no can do. Per them my insert has to be installed in a code correct fire place. If I remove the tile liner the fire place is no linger to code and therefor the install is no longer to code. All this despite the fact that the tile liner lives inside of another brick structure that probably has a foot of clearance between it an the tile liner. Is there anything I can do to help situation with out completely tearing out the fire place or relocating the insert to a free standing stove? Let me know what you guys thing or would do. I'm kinda at a loss. Sorry for the long post. Thanks guys.

Bullittman

 

[remduck1]

I heated with a lopi answer for three years and had very similar problems. I found that the creosote build up would fall down and land on the fire brick directly below the flue and cause inadiquite air flow in the flue. I pulled out one of the bricks on the top under the flue and cut about 1 inch off its width and then positioned that gap under the flue. this helped but did not solve the problem entirely. The problem is in the stove not the flue. I have installed a new drolet stove using the same ss liner in a masonary chimeney and have no problems

 

[laynes69]

Leaving the air open will allow for those gasses to go out the chimney as well as heat from the unit. Are there any passages that are blocked with ash? Is the baffle in place, or is it warped allowing air to bypass? Whats in the chimney is it glaze, or just ash? I would think if your running that hot, nothing has a chance to condense in the chimney and the chimney should stay plenty warm.

 

[bullittman281]

Hello,
Every month when I clean the chimney I completely disassemble the stove. The Air tubes come out, The baffle and fire brick come out and I go nuts with a scraper and get the inside spotless. Then I vacuum the whole inside out. The last time I even pulled the stove and went nuts with an air blower. The thing was spotless. It does run better after I clean it all out but even squeaky clean it acts just like I describe. It only goes down hill from there until the next cleaning. My BIL installed a Pacific Energy T5 at thanksgiving and it runs flawless. We "cleaned" the chimney a while back out of paranoia but there was nothing to clean. He burns the exact same wood as I do and he can get away with murder as far running his stove. His is installed with the triple wall pipe though. Let me know guys. Thanks.

Bullittman

 

[whitemountain]

If the stove is the issue, step up to the Lopi Endeavor. It is a great unit. I highly recommend it after 3 heating seasons. Looking forward to seeing how it holds up the next 20+ years.

 

[Blazer]

Sorry to hear about your problems. I am on my second season with my Lopi Answer insert, and other than wishing I had a bigger stove, I love it. I have a zero-clearance fireplace with a 9" triple wall SS chimney. My installer insisted is was OK to just go into the existing flue with a 3 ft section of 6" stainless flex from the stove. I get great draft and have had no problems whatsoever. I clean my chimney every 2 months for peace of mind, but all I get is flyash. Never any creosote. My air control works very well, giving me even burns.

Hope you solve your problem, its no fun to burn if you have to watch it that close. Good Luck

 

[itn]

i have a lopi freedom insert with a ss liner inside of a square tile liner surrounded by brick. my installer packed cer-wool insulation around the top and bottom of the ss liner. keeps the pipe warm in between. i havent had any problems.

 

[woodguy105]

My Lopi answer works great. using it for 8 years. Clean burning and good draft.

 

[bullittman281]

Hello,
time for an update. I've been talking with the stove dealers here in town trying to get an idea of what they think my problem is and what the options are. I still haven't got a strait answer to the question of weather or not I can remove the tile liner and wrap insulation around the stove pipe but I did get a couple of suggestions. I also tested out the next larger stove with my fire wood and thermometer.

One of the recommendations was to run will a large bed of coals. I've always tried to minimize my bed of coals to make room for more wood. It looks like more coals do help a bit but its not a miracle. Another one of the suggestions was to insulate the top of my tile liner. I originally had just a piece of sheet metal keeping my SS liner centered but there was no insulation. Today I pulled it apart and wrapped/crammed insulation down and around the SS liner as far as I could an put it back together. Its still to early to tell for sure but is seems to have made a huge difference. The stove seems to get hotter faster and the secondary burn seems to burn better. The inside of the stove also looks like its burning hotter/cleaner as some of the deposits are pealing off or burning to a Grey color.

Something else I learned to day test driving my wood and thermometer on a different stove was how far off my thermometer is. The stove place had both a digital inferred temp gun and their own surface temp thermometer. Mine was off by about 100-150* at normal temps. The 700* I thought I was seeing was closer to 550-600*. Armed with a new thermometer I'll have to see how the stove behaves but so far its looking better. I'm gonna clean the pipe tomorrow so I can monitor how quick it gets dirty. I'm hoping I can make it thought the rest of the winter with out any more cleanings but I will have to wait and see. I'm still open to any ideas so let me know.

Bullittman

 

[Haywire Haywood]

I think a lot of folk pour vermiculite around the flex liner, thereby insulating the entire run from top to bottom. Seeing that you got good results by just stuffing some insulation around the top, if you did the vermiculite you might just completely solve the problem.

Ian

 

[itn]

i'm glad its working better