Mtronic Upgrade?

[Crispexx]

Question for you knowledgeable folk, if I have a version 1 Mtronic 261 could I simply swap the original ignition module with a new one and the saw is now essentially a version 3 Mtronic?


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[huskihl]

Carb, flywheel, coil, wiring harness, and possibly the choke linkage and control lever

 

[Crispexx]

Carb, flywheel, coil, wiring harness, and possibly the choke linkage and control lever

So all of those items have changed between the 1st and 3rd gen mtronic?


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[huskihl]

So all of those items have changed between the 1st and 3rd gen mtronic?


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My bad, I misread your post. I thought you had an adjustable carb.
The coil and carb should be the only differences between v1 and v3. The coil contains the v3 programming and the carb has the white solenoid and a bigger main jet

 

[Captain Bruce]

Question for you knowledgeable folk, if I have a version 1 Mtronic 261 could I simply swap the original ignition module with a new one and the saw is now essentially a version 3 Mtronic?


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You Need POGO.

 

[Crispexx]

My bad, I misread your post. I thought you had an adjustable carb.
The coil and carb should be the only differences between v1 and v3. The coil contains the v3 programming and the carb has the white solenoid and a bigger main jet

Nice, I didn’t know the jet was bigger! Good info.


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[Crispexx]

You Need POGO.

What’s POGO?


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[jacrider]

Two questions:
- What has changed between V1 and V3?
- What's POGO?

I also have a V1 261C, so interested.

Thanks.

 

[huskihl]

Two questions:
- What has changed between V1 and V3?
- What's POGO?

I also have a V1 261C, so interested.

Thanks.

There have been 3 versions of Mtronic, the early 261s were V1, the current ones been produced since I believe 2018 are V3

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

@PogoInTheWoods

 

[DND 9000]

The main difference is the calibration function on the v.3 module. In the past it was a reset to the factory default and now it is a calibration under full throttle. Of course the firmware is different between the modules.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

if I have a version 1 Mtronic 261 could I simply swap the original ignition module with a new one and the saw is now essentially a version 3 Mtronic?

So what's wrong with the saw as it is currently?

It's my understanding that the v3.0 MS261C-M is a redesigned saw in several key areas that are not backward compatible with v1.0 saws without significant reworking -- including changing the entire top end and intake stuff, not just the module and solenoid. There's a thread on the subject somewhere..., maybe over on Opie. I've never actually had to work on a 261 M-tron, so am a bit limited in my experience with one.

I was also under the impression that a 2nd generation MS261C-M v3.0 (originally intended for release in 2020) has yet to be made available domestically..., let alone its components. I could certainly be mistaken there and welcome any information otherwise. A friend just bought a new one and now I'm curious.

I do know there's a T.I. specifically stating to not use the latest white 5104 solenoid with the 261C-M v1.0 modules (among other v1.0 saws), but that was back in 2017~2018. Perhaps that's changed since. Regardless, the orange 3518 finer micron fuel filter is recommended on any M-tronic saw.

DND 9000 can probably provide more detailed information on the subject being much closer to current sources.

 

[DND 9000]

I do know there's a T.I. specifically stating to not use the latest white 5104 solenoid with the 261C-M modules (among other v1.0 saws), but that was back in 2017.

That was on the MS 362 C-M.

I can`t say much to the MS 261 C-M, but the m-tronic v.3 on the MS 261 C-M must have started with control unit 1141 400 4738.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

v3.0 was initially introduced domestically in 2017~2018 with the 661 and 362. I'm unaware of it being introduced with the 261 domestically to date, but will certainly be corrected if I'm mistaken. My notes and T.I.s do not cover any reference to v3.0 being associated with the first version of the M-tronic MS261 and I have no documentation for the 2nd generation MS261C-M design -- purportedly using the v3.0 M-tronic firmware.

That said, the v1.0 MS261 was specifically included with the other v1.0 saws that were not intended to use the white solenoid while the MS362C-M actually was.

And anyone out there with a 2nd Gen MS261C-M with v3.0 M-tron firmware, please chime in!

​

 

[gtmwoodworking]

OK, so I have a 261 CM parts manual from the 2019/2020 timeframe. It shows part 0000 120 5104 (white solenoid valve) as part of the "M-Tronic Service Kit" along with the orange fuel filter. I have a saw from 2014 (assumed to be V1 control module) so I went to the dealer to ask for the right parts to do a tune up and fix a few other things. They sold me the white valve and told me that it was the right part. Has anything changed since that bulletin was released? What will happen to the saw if I run the white solenoid and the V1 control module?

 

[DND 9000]

Your saw is to old from the built date for the newer parts. In 2014 the "white" valve was not introduced yet. Replace your old black valve with the current green one.

What will happen to the saw if I run the white solenoid and the V1 control module?

Maybe it does not run right.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

The determining factor is the carburetor, not the version of M-tronic, though the white solenoids are generally associated with v3 systems. It's my understanding that there are fitment issues between the different carburetors with how the white solenoids actually seat. Older solenoids will still work just fine on the newer carbs, but not the other way around. That may be why Stihl finally lowered the price of the white 5104 solenoids from $85 down to $35.50 like the 5110 always was (and the re-introduced green 5111 now also is). Guys were just replacing plugged 5104s with 5110s for half the cost.

But as mentioned, that saw should use a black or green solenoid unless the carburetor has been changed to one that accepts the white one. Your dealer should know that.

And while I've seen reference to v3.0 MS261s in print, I've still yet to see or hear of anyone actually having one domestically. Anyone?

 

[DND 9000]

It's my understanding that there are fitment issues between the different carburetors with how the white solenoids actually seat.

No. To my understanding the limiting factor is inside the control unit/firmware. In some cases carburetors which came originally from the factory with the black valve can be refitted with the white valve, but the limiting factor is the control unit/firmware.

That`s the reason why you should always talk to your dealer (analyzing the current situation, which parts are present in the current case) and then choose the right part.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

Obviously not to his dealer.

We simply have different levels of understanding about the solenoid compatibility issue. A white solenoid on a compatible carburetor using a V.1 module simply needs the original V.1 setup procedure as described in the tech release above in reference to the MS362.

I've seen specific references to the base of the 5104 not being compatible with carburetors provided with the saws in the above tech note, hence their requirement of a 5110 or 5111 solenoid.

Stihl claimed a black solenoid wasn't compatible with a v3 module, too. That's also known to be less than factual.

The point is, the saw in question above should use the black or green solenoid as you indicated, and for the reasons you provided. No argument there.

 

[Abbeville TSI]

I have an MS261 CM, V 3.0. I purchased it over a year ago.