Need help with Stihl 056 ignition fix using Nova II module

[powerking]

I will check my plug gap......Yes, the choke plate does close all the way. I tried to drop start it yesterday, and after about 10 pulls and the throttle zip tied wide open, it fumbled for about 5 seconds then died......never to start again

 

[tntatro]

Have you checked the metering lever and cleaned the carburetor? I take a razor from a utility knife and use the side edge as a straight edge to slide across the surface above the metering lever and if it catches then lower it. I like to get it even or a hair lower so the razor doesn't catch. It can be difficult to get them just right. I've had to take one out six times to re-bend it before finally getting it right. It's also good to check the needle valve tip. I've had a new one before that was slightly lop sided. I've had carburetors that didn't run right until I removed all the small parts and soaked the carb for a few days. I have one carburetor that I suspect might just be no good, but most of them have worked good again after soaking and cleaning and soaking the diaphragms in kerosene. I have a gallon can of carburetor/parts cleaner that I bought at an auto parts store that is a maybe a little stronger than the average stuff. I cleaned some bad varnish buildup out of an old gas tank and it stripped all the paint out also. Remember to remove the jet screws and that tiny screen to soak and clean also. It seems like your saw is flooding. It could be an ignition problem but also the carburetor. I think a good thorough cleaning, readjusting the metering lever, inspection of the needle valve and inspect + soaking the diaphragms should rule out the carburetor. After all that the screws should be set to 1 turn out for L and 1 - 1/8 turn for H and it should start, unless it's a Walbro carburetor, then the H screw should be seated closed. The next thing would be to check the fuel line and impulse line.

 

[powerking]

....I think i may pressure test the saw....Im wondering if that may be an issue? I am getting aroung 150lbs compression...I would think that even with a bad crank seal, I should still get it to at least run a little

 

[tntatro]

....I think i may pressure test the saw....Im wondering if that may be an issue? I am getting aroung 150lbs compression...I would think that even with a bad crank seal, I should still get it to at least run a little

I have found that with an air leak they can still start but depending on how bad it is you may need to adjust the carburetor to an extreme to get it to start. For an air leak you would have to open the screws, for a high metering lever or plugged air flow you would have to close them. It's best to do a pressure test even if the saw started. It's an old saw and could need new lines and new oil seals. I got my pressure tester on ebay for about $35. It is a used Mityvac Silverline. I had to buy a new gauge that reads both pressure and vac because the original only shows vacuum and I made a barbed fitting from a spark plug. Then just put rubber between the carb and muffler and put pressure through the spark plug fitting. A pressure tester is a good tool to have if you want to fix your own saw. In a pinch you can replace the fuel line with 1/4" id fuel hose and the impulse line with 3/32" id fuel line if they are questionable. Just put a rubber grommet in the hole to protect the impulse line. 3/16" will also work for the fuel line but it is really hard to push on the fitting unless you split the gas tank.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

These points replacement modules also have problems if you're using a flywheel with multiple magnets on it. My 041 has 4 magnets and I haven't got a chip to work on it yet, thinking about going back to points..

 

[tntatro]

These points replacement modules also have problems if you're using a flywheel with multiple magnets on it. My 041 has 4 magnets and I haven't got a chip to work on it yet, thinking about going back to points..

That's interesting, I thought the points ignitions would have better results than the electronic. I finally got mine to work nicely with the Bosch electronic coil but it has to be tuned between 1,800 to 2,000 rpm or the chain will spin at idle. It has four metal plates about evenly spaced on the flywheel. I've heard them referred to as poles. I wish I knew where to get some more of those plates because I have a points flywheel that has them all rusted and falling off. It's kind of hard to find points flywheels for the 056. I think there are new points and condensers for the 041 for a reasonable price on ebay. I tried my points coil with the Bosch electronic flywheel and it started and idled great but only had half the max rpm.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I checked ebay and they did have several sets of points for the 041, I may already have a set but I'll have to look, maybe tomorrow or Monday. I'll have to find the screws and the points cover also.

 

[mgr]

I tought when you fixed the ignition with a nova module, that the ignition needs to be advanced a bit.

Search on google: dolmar ignition repair and you wil find a link from a dolmar 133 with the nova module and it runs.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I did that on an 031 I owned a while back, don't remember what flywheel was on it but I remember I had to advance the flywheel on it to get it to run right. I tried that on the 041 I'm working on and it made it run worse. I read the info on the Nova II and it said not to use it with multiple magnets which the 041 has. This 041 has been sitting in a shop for a long time until I tried to revive it so it's hard to tell what it has on it until I start looking at part numbers. I do know it doesn't have a Nova on it, looks to be an Oregon or a Stens. The Atom blue module was made for what I'm doing, unfortunately they are out of production.
I checked this one out with my timing light and it appeared to have a good spark at the right time so I may need to look at something else (again).
In case someone is wondering, I take the sparkplug out and turn the engine over with a half inch drill when checking timing. I used a electric shop power supply set at just over 12 volts to run the timing light.

 

[powerking]

.....What and how do you block off the round intake port for testing? do you leave the carb on and just block off the intake side of the carb?

 

[tntatro]

.....What and how do you block off the round intake port for testing? do you leave the carb on and just block off the intake side of the carb?

I cut a piece of rubber and punch holes to fit the carburetor mount bolts and slide it on and attach the carburetor over it. Same thing with muffler. Also unscrew the throttle adjust screw so it doesn't get caught on the throttle lever or remember to flip the throttle lever up onto it. I broke a throttle adjust screw that way once. You can plug into the impulse line to add pressure/vac or make a fitting from a spark plug. I made a spark plug fitting because it works on many saws. If there is a small leak but you can't find it then I have found that it is a good idea to disassemble the pressure tester and clean all the parts with soapy water. Sometimes the vacuum part of the tester will suck in fine dust and it will cause a false reading.

 

[tntatro]

I tought when you fixed the ignition with a nova module, that the ignition needs to be advanced a bit.

Search on google: dolmar ignition repair and you wil find a link from a dolmar 133 with the nova module and it runs.

I have mine advanced a half key width. Anything less and it won't start well. It starts and runs at one key width but the chain advance problem seems to be worse and there is a little snap back on the pull cord if not pulled fast enough.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Too bad they don't still make the Atom modules, they had ones designed for about any saw. I just found one in my tool box but it was yellow and I have no idea what it is for.

 

[tntatro]

Too bad they don't still make the Atom modules, they had ones designed for about any saw. I just found one in my tool box but it was yellow and I have no idea what it is for.

Have you checked out this site? http://pickersyard.weebly.com/atom-universal-electronic-ignition-module.html

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Yes, I checked it out last week. The owner of the saw probably would rather I just put a set of points back in it as to spend money on a replacement. I found a couple of sets of points that looked pretty good and the cover and screws so I'll probably try them first. I checked the part numbers on the 041 and it indeed does have a points flywheel. Kinda thought that because it had windows in it for point adjustment.

 

[Okie]

I did not read all 6 pages of this thread:

But if you are still trying to get a NOVA II ignition system to operate, you are wasting your time.
The chips are not reliable nor are they very precise.

You can take a handful of them, all of same type and some will require positive ignition and some require negative ignition on the same saw or engine and usually the timing will be off, then if you get lucky and get one to running correctly it usually won't last very long.
They are wimpy, erratic and a waste of time and money.

Yep, I know some guys brag on the chips, but I suspect they are also some of the same ones who brag on and voted for Hillary.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I did not read all 6 pages of this thread:

But if you are still trying to get a NOVA II ignition system to operate, you are wasting your time.
The chips are not reliable nor are they very precise.

You can take a handful of them, all of same type and some will require positive ignition and some require negative ignition on the same saw or engine and usually the timing will be off, then if you get lucky and get one to running correctly it usually won't last very long.
They are wimpy, erratic and a waste of time and money.

Yep, I know some guys brag on the chips, but I suspect they are also some of the same ones who brag on and voted for Hillary.

What chips have you had a good experience with? Our local shop recommends Oregon but I don't think they can be used with multiple magnet flywheels like some Stihls have.

 

[Okie]

You asked:
What chips have you had a good experience with? Our local shop recommends Oregon but I don't think they can be used with multiple magnet flywheels like some Stihls have.

I have not had any good experience with any other chainsaw ignition mods. I just had bad experience trying to use the Nova II chips. Their use sounded great, don't have to remove the flywheel, just cut the wire outside the flywheel that is coming from the points and viola. I ordered 3 because they sounded so good and I would have a spare at the ready. The existing saw was running good with points and condenser 20 years old or older, but the points and condenser were old and NLA unless I found New Old Stock and the NOS price was not user friendly. The first test Nova II chip was amazing at first, easy to install, saw started right up, but I could tell when pulling the rope that timing was little too fast, had to ease it up on compression stroke to pull thru, but saw ran great, piss reving and still at the shop. I let the saw sit overnight for a cold start re-test next day, it started right up and I set the saw outside idling and then it died. Lost ignition. Installed 2nd chip, no go, reversed chips polarity to positive and timing was off so much that was about to break pull rope or fingers, installed 3rd chip and it would not start with neg polarity, reversed polarity and it started but would not accelerate. None of the 3 Nova II chips had same ignition test symptoms.
I sent the chips back to the seller and they refunded and said they were going to stop offering the chips, they had several returns and complaints.
I'm a lic'ed electronics tech/Registered electrician/mechanic and only good experience I've had with electronic ignition mods from points and condenser to electronic ignition for reliability is first try to use what the manufacturer of the equipment has used or recommends for a upgrade from points to electronic and stay away from aftermarket upgrades.
Therefore my bad experience when attempting to use the Nova II was no great surprise to me. My good experience with the Nova II was all the failures and the experience happened at the shop while testing instead of in use when the equipment was actually being used and needed and it was not a airplane engine in flight.
AND yes the Nova II chips were properly heat sinked.
Some of the guys on this site were having to remove the flywheel key so as to get their saw timed for a test run. (I need a reliable saw when I'm in the woods ready to go to work)
And if I were going to convert a Stihl chainsaw to electronic
I have 30 plus year old Stihl chainsaws that I still operate with same original points and condenser and if I were considering converting them to electronic ignition I would go with recommended Stihl ignitions designed for that Model saw in question. (But as long as points and condensers are available and my saws have PROVEN reliability I will leave them as is.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

So, tell me why this saw had really good spark, timing looked to be several degrees before TDC (don't have a degree wheel) great compression and fuel mix squirted into the carburetor and it still doesn't run but pops a bit then dies. I've done this kinda work for a long time also and this saw doesn't sound like a good saw would under the same circumstances. I know these saws take 20 some degrees of timing and this appeared to be close to that but it did seem the timing was way slow.

 

[mgr]

Under compression you lose spark.

I have a dolmar 112 with points converted to nova module. It did run for some time and on 1 day it wont start. Fuel, spark all good. Replaced the nova to dolmar 116 ignition and problem solved.

Try to duplicate the nova module, there are schematics on google.