October Glory Maple question.....trim it or not?

[JHctRednek]

I have an October Glory Maple that has a large branch starting near the base, the branch is small as the tree is only 4-5 yrs old. I have always been under the impression that large branches low on the trunk at an angle less than 45 degrees to the trunk were bad for the longevity of the tree and caused what I have known as "water rot" (crotches of branches that collect water and then weaken the tree, eventually splitting during a storm or hard winter). I have in my works cut down many old maples that split down the center of the crotch of such a low branch.

This tree is sentimental to my wife and I as it was planted in honor of our marriage.
View attachment 249221
I am therefore concerned with the low branch killing the tree in years to come due to "water rot". Here is a better pic
View attachment 249222

What is my best course of action?
Leave it or cut it this winter?

:msp_confused:

 

[beastmaster]

If it was me I think I would remove it as it could very well cause problems as the tree grows. It might be a good idea to maybe just take part of it this year, then rest of it the following year. The tree is young enough it should heal well and fill in the area removed and ten years down the road you won't even be able to tell a part of it was removed.
If left in place and it splits off(real possibility)years from now the damage could ruin the tree and make it off balance and unsightly.
If the tree was older and more set in its way, there are options to help prevent splitting, but removal is the best course of action on a young tree like that.

 

[ATH]

Yes. Remove it this fall.

It looks like you will also need some more pruning help in another year or two. The only reason I wouldn't do it all now is because you are taking 1/2 of the tree at once...we don't want to do more than that in one cut. Plan on having another corrective pruning in 2014 or 2015 - that tree needs some help to be a nice strong single stemmed (with one dominate leader) tree having good branch architecture. Then probably one more 3-4 years after that. I would probably do each of those prunings for $40-$50 if you can hire a good arborist when they are near by (don't ask somebody to drive 25 miles one way for $40...).

 

[Raintree]

Yes that side leader has to go. Never heard of water rot, splitting at that weak crotch is the concern.

 

[JHctRednek]

Thanks guys I was hoping to get the answers given.
This begs the next question, should I spray it with the pruning sealer or not? I usually don't use it when trimming dead limbs, I am kinda hit or miss on live limbs but use it religiously on my fruit trees. I can't say that I have ever really seen any great advantage from using it but my father always has so I don't question it.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks for the help

 

[Raintree]

Haven't used pruning paint in ages. Must have been back in the late 80's the last time a can was hooked to my scabbard. With a proper pruning cut you should be GTG, no paint.

 

[ATH]

....I can't say that I have ever really seen any great advantage from using it....

Neither has anybody else.

(the exceptions would be to mask volatiles from bugs if you have to prune red oak or elm during the growing season. Better to just wait until after the growing season to prune those and skip the paint.

There would be no benefit to painting the cuts.

 

[treeseer]

cut it all at once and the wound is likely to rot.

It might be a good idea to maybe just take the part of it that crowds the dominant leader this year, then rest of it later on. This gives it time to grow a collar so it will scar over better.

Trees do not like to be hurried.

 

[Dadatwins]

Agree with the above that the limb needs to go, part this fall, remainder next year. Also suggest a ring of mulch around the base to prevent the lawn mower/ string trimmer damage.

 

[Treewound]

In reply to your question about applying Tree Wound Dressing, the answer is yes. A thin coating of Tree Wound Dressing should be applied immediately or as soon as possible after the pruning is done. Recent studies have PROVEN that tree wound dressings help control the spread of tree diseases and reduce dieback (which is not really a concern with this type of pruning).
The negatives associated with Tree Wound Dressings result from missue, specifically too thick of an application - more is NOT better!
When a tree is pruned or wounded, insects often feed on the sap at the exposed area and can spread harmful pathogens, and pathogens can also be spread through the air. The tree will naturally compartmentalize the exposed area from within so there is no need to re-apply Tree Wound Dressing after the initial application it will do no good.
If Tree Wound Dressings are applied in a thick coating, when the tree wound begins to callus over it can "lift: the layer of Tree Wound Dressing off of the tree, creating a pocket behind the layer of Tree Wound Dressing. It is these pockets that can serve as host sights for pathogens.

 

[treeseer]

In reply to your question about applying Tree Wound Dressing, the answer is yes. A thin coating of Tree Wound Dressing should be applied immediately or as soon as possible after the pruning is done. Recent studies have PROVEN that tree wound dressings help control the spread of tree diseases and reduce dieback

Care to share these studies? I'm pro-sealant in some cases, and am looking for support. :msp_biggrin:

 

[Treewound]

Yes, I am out of my office where I have them, but will send several to you either later tonight or tomorrow morning.

 

[JHctRednek]

In reply to your question about applying Tree Wound Dressing, the answer is yes. A thin coating of Tree Wound Dressing should be applied immediately or as soon as possible after the pruning is done. Recent studies have PROVEN that tree wound dressings help control the spread of tree diseases and reduce dieback (which is not really a concern with this type of pruning).
The negatives associated with Tree Wound Dressings result from missue, specifically too thick of an application - more is NOT better!
When a tree is pruned or wounded, insects often feed on the sap at the exposed area and can spread harmful pathogens, and pathogens can also be spread through the air. The tree will naturally compartmentalize the exposed area from within so there is no need to re-apply Tree Wound Dressing after the initial application it will do no good.
If Tree Wound Dressings are applied in a thick coating, when the tree wound begins to callus over it can "lift: the layer of Tree Wound Dressing off of the tree, creating a pocket behind the layer of Tree Wound Dressing. It is these pockets that can serve as host sights for pathogens.

Is this tree wound dressing thin like spray paint or thick like tar?

The pruning sealer I have is really thick, makes me curious if there are diferences.

 

[Treewound]

There are differences. First, let me let you know that our company manufactures Treekote Tree Wound dressing. There are three basic types of aspahltic tree wound dressings as well as a couple of other types which I am not very familiar with. Of the aspahltic types there are the aerosol asphalt, asphalt emulsions (modified asphalt so that it is water soluable), and liquid asphalt.
The aerosol types are an asphalt cutback which results in a fast drying easy application. I would like to point out that our product, Treekote, contains more asphalt (35%) than any of the other brands that we have compared it to (16%). Aerosol Tree wound dressing provide good coverage and protection from disease but due to the solvents the can not be used to seal grafts.
The asphalt emulsion wound dressings, have been shown to reduce dieback, offer good protection, are safe for use in grafing, but take longer to dry and to apply. It is VERY important when using this type especially to apply the wound dressing in as thin a coating as possible while getting complet coverage. care should be taken to get the material on the edges of the wound to control dieback, but NOT thickly! If it is applied to thickly it can lift off and create a "pocket", this is where the problems that have been related to use can develope.
The liquid asphalt type sealers (non-emulsion), in my opionion are the last choice. They offer no additional benefit than the asphalt emulsion pastes, but the solvents used make them unuseable for grafting because they can (minimal) damage the cambian layer., and they are not as convinient or fast drying as the aerosols.
No matter which product you choose, remember that it should be applied as soon as possible after wounding or pruning, and in a thin yet complete, coating - More is Not Better!
Here is a partial list of studies and/or guides that support the use of Tree Wound Dressings.
Diseases of Apples and other Pome Fruits, N.D.S.U, H.Arthur Lamey, Robert W. Stack
Diseases of Apples and Other Pome Fruits
Silver Leaf Disease of Trees and Shrubs, Agiculture and Agri-Food Canada
www4.agr.gc.ca/AAFC-AAC/display-afficher.do?id=1198274535415&lang=eng
Overland Spread of the Oak Wilt Fungus in Minnesota, Journal of Arboriculture 11(11):November 1985, Jennifer Juzwik,D.W. French, Jon Jeresek
Studies on Pruning Cuts and Wound Dressings for Oak Wilt Control, Kim Camilli, david N. Appel, Todd Watson, Arboriculture and Urban Forestry 2007 33(2):132-139
Tree Susceptability, Inoculum Availibity and Potential Vectors in a Texas Oak Wilt Center, D.N. Appel, R.Peters, R. Lewis, July 1987,Vol.13, No.7 - Journal of Arboriculture
Healinf of Wounds on Trees, Dan Neely, Journal of American Society of Horticukltural Science (95(5):536-540
How To Prune
www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo.pubs/howtos/ht_prune/addinfo.htm
Pruning to Prevent Silver Leaf
HortFACT - Pruning to prevent silverleaf
Silver Leaf Disease in Fruit Trees
P.Larkin Hedges.ie
Silver Leaf
www.sardi.sa.gov.au/pestsdiseases/horticulture/horticultural_crops/apricot_pests_a
Sapstreak Disease of Sugar maples
treehelp.com/trees/maple/maple-diseases-maple-sapstreak.asp
Diseases of Sugar maple
Diseases of Sugar Maple | eHow.com
Disease Control in Cheries, Plums and Other Stone Fruits, NDSU
www.ag.nsdu.edu/pubs/plantsci/hortcrop/pp689w.htm
Black Knot of Plums and Cherries, Department of Crop Sciences, University of Illinois At Urbana-Champaign,RPD No. 809, September 2000
Black Knot of Plum and Cherry, Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada
www4.agr.ca/AAFC-AAC/display-afficher.do?id=1198101468695&lang=eng
Black Knot Diseases of Plums and Chokecherries, NDSU Extension Service
Ask Extension Database, NDSU Extension Service
Oak Wilt, The Gardening Lauch Pad
http://gardeninglaunchpad.com/oWilt.html
The Dutch Elm Disease,David French, Mark Ascerno, Ward Stienstra, Minnesota Extension Service, University of Minnesota, AG-BU-0518, Revised 198-0
Cankers on Locust Trees
Diseases of Tree Bark | eHow.co.uk
How To - Identify, Prevent and Control Oak Wilt, USDA, Forest Service, NA-FR-01-11
How to Prune
www.na.fs.fed.us/spof/pubs/howtos/ht_prune/addinfo.htm
Our company has also conducted a study on wound closure which is available on our web site :waltereclark.com

 

[Tree Pig]

Care to share these studies? I'm pro-sealant in some cases, and am looking for support. :msp_biggrin:

Treeser I have been trying to get the same thing (supporting documentation) in another thread you may want to take a read

http://www.arboristsite.com/arborist-101/204952-3.htm#post3798503

 

[Treewound]

Already replied and advised them to look at this post.

 

[beastmaster]

The use of sealants in areas were oak wilt is prevalent is understood and known, and accepted. Not being a Scientist or having a PhD in anything I can only make decisions on what popular literature says and claims. We know what they say about the use of sealants in most cases.
Here in our local mountains where there is a bark beetle problem, It's excepted practice by most to spay sealant on fresh cuts to stop bark beetles from smelling and entering the wounds. I sometimes have to do it at the request of the home owners, though it goes against what I have read and been schooled in. So based on what most literature says its not good, but it does seen logical it would control the attraction and entry of beetles. I want to do what is right for the trees and customers.
As the companys that makes the product, it would be easy to be bias a little, but that in its self don't mean your wrong. I don't mind having my opinions changed, feel free to change my opinion, with facts and study's. I'm going to read some of the studys you offered, and it wouldn't hurt if you offered up more proof of your products usefulness. I am a seeker of the truth.

 

[Treewound]

Thank you for your interest and I am sure that after you read some of the reports you will aggree with our position.
I would like to make it clear that I do not hold any advanced degree in this field either, but have done a lot of research.
As for Pine Bark Beatles (there are many types of bark Beatles with different life cycles) I would love to be able to tell you that the application of Tree Wound Dressing will help control the infestation, but I am not aware of any data to support that.
Many types of Bark Beatles are attracted by open wounds and can spread harmful pathogens when they land on the exposed areas which can weaken or kill a tree, and Pine Bark Beatles rely on weakened trees (weakened by drought, poor nutrition, diseases and other factors) when they penatrate trees to reproduce, and they do not (to my knowledge) enter at,at least not exclusively, areas where the tree has been wounded.
So I suppose (do not know!)that treating wounds with tree wound dressing, which can reduce the spread of disease, which may in turn make a tree more seceptable to infestation can be somewhat helpful, but it would probably be of minimal benefit. I would love to be able to say otherwise, but at this point I can not.

 

[Tree Pig]

The use of sealants in areas were oak wilt is prevalent is understood and known, and accepted. Not being a Scientist or having a PhD in anything I can only make decisions on what popular literature says and claims. We know what they say about the use of sealants in most cases.
Here in our local mountains where there is a bark beetle problem, It's excepted practice by most to spay sealant on fresh cuts to stop bark beetles from smelling and entering the wounds. I sometimes have to do it at the request of the home owners, though it goes against what I have read and been schooled in. So based on what most literature says its not good, but it does seen logical it would control the attraction and entry of beetles. I want to do what is right for the trees and customers.
As the companys that makes the product, it would be easy to be bias a little, but that in its self don't mean your wrong. I don't mind having my opinions changed, feel free to change my opinion, with facts and study's. I'm going to read some of the studys you offered, and it wouldn't hurt if you offered up more proof of your products usefulness. I am a seeker of the truth.

Beast I agree and that is all I was asking for is facts that change what current beliefs are.

 

[Treewound]

Please read my reply to Beastmaster