I was looking for some insite or ideals or suggestions on building a big go to hell log splitter like the timberwolf splitter. Me and a guy I work with both have hardy stoves and spend lots of time in the woods. So the ideal is a splitter with a box wedge like the tw-7 I have a 20 hp kohler and a autocycle valve now my plans are to use a 6"x30" cylinder with a 28 gpm pump and a smaller cylinder for the log lift. On hooking the pump to the motor I was gonna use the same concept as my swisher splitter has a v-belt drive that seems to work great I would love some input on this splitter and I'll take pics after I get started but I gotta work around duck season also so this may take a month or so, so be patient!!
planning to start building a splitter !!
- Thread starter dahmower
- Start date
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mga
wandering
do a search of this forum....you'll find tons of pictures and many ideas and suggestions.
tawilson
Addicted to ArboristSite
I've never seen a belt drive splitter. It seems like it would be easier to just mount the pump to the motor and take up less room in the process.
mga
wandering
true, but i've often wondered how well a clutch drive would work. at idle, it would take some strain off the engine and maybe make a pull-start easier to start.
log splitter part one
opcorn: :chainsawguy: :chatter:
A larger diameter cylinder will take longer to cycle from extend to retract with a small pump. It will generate greater oil pressure but it will have a slower speed to cycle.
A larger hydraulic splitter will also be a a huge heat loss- the hotter the hydraulic oil the more hydraulic power and the more efficient it is.
The oil in a hydraulic circuit for a splitter cylinder is captive and eventually heats up from friction and cycling and the cylinder tank and plumbing act as radiators releasing heat.
If you are really going that big or for that matter even a smaller cylinder-
creating a hydraulic oil race track with:
4 check valves.
4 tees to allow bypass of the check valves and oil return to tank.
8 additional straight pipe male to JIC male fittings for the check valves to direct the oil from the cylinder to the tanks and allows this more oil to move through the cylinder to be heated by simple friction.
4 additional hoses for each side of the cylinder to tie in the check valves and tees back to the valve body.
FYI the larger the cylinder rod diameter the faster the return speed and forward cycle time-due to the reduced amount of oil to move back and forth so when you talk about a six inch cylinder remember that part, and a cylinder that size will have one inch or greater oil ports.
FYI hydraulic pumps are tested at 1200 rpm and 100 psi so keep that in mind
doing the number crunching for pulley diameters and determining the rpm per pulley at an engine speed of 2200 rpm is a must if you intend to go that way.
FYI a pulley drive will put more strain on the pump seals as well if over tensioned so keep that in mind as well.
Having an adjustable tray for either the motor or pump will allow equal pressure adjustment on the belt as long as you count threads while tightening
the adjustment bolts, also be sure to use four bolts with tow back nuts on each bolt on the adjustment tray 2 on each side to create tension on the belt drive and keep it aligned properly.
Using a centrifugal clutch is fine but it will not allow you to use hydraulics at low rpm where the clutch disenegages from the outer contact plates mounted on the clutch housing-the business end that does the work.
:notrolls2:
opcorn: :chainsawguy: :chatter:
A larger diameter cylinder will take longer to cycle from extend to retract with a small pump. It will generate greater oil pressure but it will have a slower speed to cycle.
A larger hydraulic splitter will also be a a huge heat loss- the hotter the hydraulic oil the more hydraulic power and the more efficient it is.
The oil in a hydraulic circuit for a splitter cylinder is captive and eventually heats up from friction and cycling and the cylinder tank and plumbing act as radiators releasing heat.
If you are really going that big or for that matter even a smaller cylinder-
creating a hydraulic oil race track with:
4 check valves.
4 tees to allow bypass of the check valves and oil return to tank.
8 additional straight pipe male to JIC male fittings for the check valves to direct the oil from the cylinder to the tanks and allows this more oil to move through the cylinder to be heated by simple friction.
4 additional hoses for each side of the cylinder to tie in the check valves and tees back to the valve body.
FYI the larger the cylinder rod diameter the faster the return speed and forward cycle time-due to the reduced amount of oil to move back and forth so when you talk about a six inch cylinder remember that part, and a cylinder that size will have one inch or greater oil ports.
FYI hydraulic pumps are tested at 1200 rpm and 100 psi so keep that in mind
doing the number crunching for pulley diameters and determining the rpm per pulley at an engine speed of 2200 rpm is a must if you intend to go that way.
FYI a pulley drive will put more strain on the pump seals as well if over tensioned so keep that in mind as well.
Having an adjustable tray for either the motor or pump will allow equal pressure adjustment on the belt as long as you count threads while tightening
the adjustment bolts, also be sure to use four bolts with tow back nuts on each bolt on the adjustment tray 2 on each side to create tension on the belt drive and keep it aligned properly.
Using a centrifugal clutch is fine but it will not allow you to use hydraulics at low rpm where the clutch disenegages from the outer contact plates mounted on the clutch housing-the business end that does the work.
:notrolls2:
mga
wandering
don't most splitters run at HI or near HI speeds?
so, disengaging at LOW rpm's wouldn't matter....right?
so, that being the case, why couldn't i put a "throttle control" on the hydraulic control lever that would boost enging RPM's when in the push/pull state, but let the engine idle when in the neutral position?
that way, the engine would only be on WOT part of the time.
log splitter et. al.
A hydraulic log splitter will run all the way down to idle but not do much at idle but stall out as the oil is always moving due to the pumps being connected to the coupler of the engine with out a centrifugal clutch.
If you are going that far-a (load sensing throttle/motor carburation set up) will be better for your application and will work better as the yanking of the throttle cable will wear it out prematurely and cause problems.
I would check with the engine manufacturer to see if a modification set up is available for your engine to replumb it that way or what a small engine set up that way would cost as the savings from reduced fuel use, premature wear, and less noise (decibel load) would be worth it.
A new carb kit and linkages should be all you need for this if it is possible to reuse the engine.
A newer engine can be ordered with option very easily as well too.
And they will use less fuel too.
opcorn: 
A hydraulic log splitter will run all the way down to idle but not do much at idle but stall out as the oil is always moving due to the pumps being connected to the coupler of the engine with out a centrifugal clutch.
If you are going that far-a (load sensing throttle/motor carburation set up) will be better for your application and will work better as the yanking of the throttle cable will wear it out prematurely and cause problems.
I would check with the engine manufacturer to see if a modification set up is available for your engine to replumb it that way or what a small engine set up that way would cost as the savings from reduced fuel use, premature wear, and less noise (decibel load) would be worth it.
A new carb kit and linkages should be all you need for this if it is possible to reuse the engine.
A newer engine can be ordered with option very easily as well too.
And they will use less fuel too.
opcorn:
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Crofter
Addicted to ArboristSite
Some of the duplex pumps that have a high / low delivery have a very small shaft that I would not consider to use for belt drive. I cant remember what my Haldex was 12 or 16 GPM but it had only a 1/2 in. or so shaft so direct coupling is preferable and cheaper than belts and pulleys. You can get some advantages in speed and heat savings by some of the things mentioned but cost and complexity comes to mind. I made my own 4" cylinder from scratch and the 3" chromed shafting would have been way more expensive than the 2" I used. If you really need a high production machine it might be well worth it to shoot the works, but I need the rest period while the machine is doing its job anyways. A push button switch on top of the valve lever and a simple plunger solenoid is easy to make an on demand throttle up for peanuts and does cut down on fuel consumption and noise. I would go that route rather than the complication of a centrifugal or electric clutch. I dont like gadgets, LOL!
mga
wandering
A hydraulic log splitter will run all the way down to idle but not do much at idle but stall out as the oil is always moving due to the pumps being connected to the coupler of the engine with out a centrifugal clutch.
If you are going that far-a (load sensing throttle/motor carburation set up) will be better for your application and will work better as the yanking of the throttle cable will wear it out prematurely and cause problems.
I would check with the engine manufacturer to see if a modification set up is available for your engine to replumb it that way or what a small engine set up that way would cost as the savings from reduced fuel use, premature wear, and less noise (decibel load) would be worth it.
A new carb kit and linkages should be all you need for this if it is possible to reuse the engine.
A newer engine can be ordered with option very easily as well too.
And they will use less fuel too.
actually, i was thinking more of a servo-type controller that would be triggered electronically from the control valve lever. that way, there would be an immediate increase of RPM's when the lever was pushed forward.
log splitter
Greetings and salutations MGA from the soon to be frozen "eastern wilderness" @ 1140 feet above mean sea level.
The load sensing demand mechanical throttle for small gas engines is still non electrical as far as I know and used in a lot of applications for small gas engines.
I know that Honda has them too. opcorn:
Greetings and salutations MGA from the soon to be frozen "eastern wilderness" @ 1140 feet above mean sea level.
The load sensing demand mechanical throttle for small gas engines is still non electrical as far as I know and used in a lot of applications for small gas engines.
I know that Honda has them too.
opcorn:
Bowtie
Gearhead
Its kind of surprising somebody hasnt employed technology like what you guys are discussing to a logsplitter already. It sure makes my homemade splitter sound ancient! You have to walk to the back of the splitter to idle my 11.5hp I/C Briggs engine down on mine. By the way its a vertical shaft engine mounted to a Haldex 13.6 pump. Bunch of people said that wouldnt work. I called Haldex/Barnes about it. They said, "Mount it up and use it".
I called Haldex/Barnes about it. They said, "Mount it up and use it".Crofter
Addicted to ArboristSite
Its kind of surprising somebody hasnt employed technology like what you guys are discussing to a logsplitter already. It sure makes my homemade splitter sound ancient! You have to walk to the back of the splitter to idle my 11.5hp I/C Briggs engine down on mine. By the way its a vertical shaft engine mounted to a Haldex 13.6 pump. Bunch of people said that wouldnt work.
That is exactly the setup I have; a vertical shaft Lawn tractor motor with the pump directly coupled under neath. I even used the original tank and dash and all controls. It would be nice to control throttle from the control lever; maybe some rainy day project1
mga
wandering
Greetings and salutations MGA from the soon to be frozen "eastern wilderness" @ 1140 feet above mean sea level.
The load sensing demand mechanical throttle for small gas engines is still non electrical as far as I know and used in a lot of applications for small gas engines.
I know that Honda has them too.
if non-electrical, what senses the load? there won't be any load until you push the lever, and, since we're using a clutch, there won't be any load unless the engine runs wide open. the engine can't run wide open unless it senses load....back to square one.
so.....that's why i mentioned an electronic sensor on the control valve handle. as you push it forward, it sends the signal to a solenoid, which in turn triggers the servo, which inturn moves the throttle cable to full speed.
all in quick sequence, that is. that way, the second the control lever is pushed to begin splitting, the engine hits wide open throttle. it would need a delay to shut down to idle when on the return stroke so that it returns at full speed. when the lever resets itself, the signal tells the motor to idle until the lever is once again pushed forward.
we'll bring log splitters into the 21st century yet! LOL computerized log splitters.
Bowtie
Gearhead
LOL, I used the old controls and tank as well. Thats the beauty of using what ya have!
mga
wandering
Its kind of surprising somebody hasnt employed technology like what you guys are discussing to a logsplitter already. It sure makes my homemade splitter sound ancient! You have to walk to the back of the splitter to idle my 11.5hp I/C Briggs engine down on mine. By the way its a vertical shaft engine mounted to a Haldex 13.6 pump. Bunch of people said that wouldnt work.
i've been using vertical shaft engines since day one. took them off lawn tractors. the electric start made things perfect.
i began with an old twin 18hp briggs until that smoked. i then went to a 12.5hp kohler which is what i'm using now, pushing a 22 GPM pump.
i just acquired another newer 18hp briggs and i'll be installing that this winter.
the problem with that kind of technology is that it requires electronics. the technology is out there now and being used in some cars where the gas pedal sends electrical impulses to the injectors etc etc, but something has to process that information.
i think we're just doing some technological daydreaming here....all in fun.
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Bowtie
Gearhead
mga
wandering
yep. it's possible to do, but i don't have enough electronic knowledge to follow thru with it myself.
i still like the idea of a clutch tho. at idle, you wouldn't be pushing oil, giving it a break to cool down, it would be less strain on the engine, and you wouldn't have that screaming monster there while you're getting wood ready to split.
the only problem is getting the engine to respond immediately when you need it to.
Bowtie
Gearhead
How about a hand throttle setup on the control lever? That should work well, just let off the handle when you arent operating it, and it returns to idle.
mga
wandering
i'm going to be putting an 18hp back on the splitter this winter.
i think i'll give that some thought.
however, is there some kind of in-line clutch available?
brisawyer
ArboristSite Operative
I have a splitter set up with a 6x24 cylender. It has 12 horse and either a 16 or 18gpm pump. It is a tad slow but not like you are standing around waiting on it to split. The 28 gpm should make that cyl zip. If you are set on using belts I would set up a jackshaft with pillow blocks to keep the side load off the pump use a lovejoy off the end of that to the pump.At 28 gpm you may want to go to 3/4" hoses look around the net I think parker has a sizing chart based on flow/duty cycle. The barnes /haldex pumps are rated @3600 rpm. You are going to be in the 40 ton range think beefy and brace well.
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