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Problem Hand Filing @ 10 Degree Down Angle with File Holder?
- Thread starter Philbert
- Start date
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TraditionalTool
Addicted to ArboristSite
That's ok, I use handles on mine.
You go right ahead and palm the tang with your callus, it's your palm after all.
Some people had to learn with training wheels before riding a 2-wheel bicycle. Once they gain their balance, they never use them again.
My son, a very athletic person, recently broke his leg and had to walk with a crutch until he regained the ability and skill to walk without one. Some people are handicapped and walk with a crutch their whole lives, but find that it enables them to do something that they could not do without it.
A crutch is just a tool, an aid.
Philbert
wigglesworth
Booned
I agree.....a crutch can be a tool, but they can be a hindrance also. Nobody wants to rely on the crutches. If you really want to learn to ride that bike, kick them training wheels off. How long you been using a guide?
Usually use a grinder. Use a file with an Oregon/STIHL style guide for touch ups.
I like that they help me keep the angle and file depth consistent, and reduce the amount of file wobble visually and by resting on the top plate of the cutter.
Could free-hand in a pinch, but would not keep the cutters consistent.
Philbert
wigglesworth
Booned
Im thinking in order to get the 10 degree angle, your gonna have to pitch the guide. Since the guides ive seen are designed to ride flat on the top plate, If you put the 10 degree angle on it, it is going to make your corner higher than its supposed to be. If im wrong, somebody correct me.
I never could never free hand and I always used the File and Joint before I bought my grinder....That would help you alot if your uncomfortable with free handing...You would be suprised how good a job you can do with one of them,,and how close each cutter length will be if you keep the same pressure on and count each strokes....Get a paint pen,,or blue dye,,and check that way too....
WW,
That's exactly the starting point for this thread.
Since I don't normally run full chisel chain, I had to ask for future reference.
Philbert
smokinj
Addicted to ArboristSite
:agree2:
J.W Younger
ass kissing impaired
I don't think of a FOP as a crutch, its a very useful tool and it keeps a lot of the fileings out of the b/c.
wigglesworth
Booned
Now IC. I guess you normally run semi chisel?
Yep.
Plain old, boring, full-comp, round-filed, semi-chisel, chain with reduced kickback features! Sometimes, vanilla is best.
Philbert
I got a similar answer when one of their charts said to grind a chain at 30 and 60 degrees, and another to grind the same chain 35 and 55 (or something like that). She said that it is more important for the cutters to be sharp and the same, than exactly at a specific angle.
I am sure that the different angles make a difference under specific circumstances. But either Oregon doesn't think that it is that big of a deal, or figures that if we are not at a level where we already understand and appreciate the differences it is not worth their time on the phone to try and explain it?
Philbert
huskystihl
Addicted to ArboristSite
Yep. I can file free hand and do a darn nice job when i'm setting at the bench with the saw clamped in a vice But while at work I always use a plate for the simple reason your depth is controlled and you have a sightline to keep your angle right. Not to mention it is much more efficient when time is money.
Same here with the addition of a golf ball as a file handle. Touch up the chain every couple of tanks except the climbing saw, it gets it after finishing in the tree.
TraditionalTool
Addicted to ArboristSite
Golf Ball is an XLNT idea!
A golf ball is an EXCELLENT file handle, IMO, as it fits in your palm. That's a damn good idea! Rep comin' your way for mentioning that!
Ray,
A golf ball is an EXCELLENT file handle, IMO, as it fits in your palm. That's a damn good idea! Rep comin' your way for mentioning that!
Oregon Engineer
ArboristSite Operative
Philbert
I would have to agree with our service tech that gave you an answer on the phone. Work on getting a sharp and consistent chain, with the correct depth gauge setting, first. Worry about the nuances of the specific angles, and getting them dead nuts on target, second. We hope that ALL of our users reach the point where they can file a chain to the optimum performance for their working conditions. It is impossible for one overwhelmed service tech to educate every caller, for every work situation, over the phone. But they do an amazingly good job of talking people through their problems when they call.
Most chain that I see returned from the field is not well filed, some is filed very well though. The typical faults are inconsistent angles, backslope instead of hook and depth gauges taken down too far.
We have recently gone through a couple of iterations of our filing/grinding instructions to make them more useful, in more circumstances. During that effort the angles did get rewritten a couple of different ways, but that should not be a great concern. We seperated the filing and grinding instructions into two seperate pages to be less confusing to the users. If you have specific comments regarding the filing instructions we would be happy to hear them and would consider them in the next revision cycle of the filing instructions.
Given that, please understand the filing instructions are an example of a good average filing for an average situation. Different wood, tree size, bar length, saw size, type of cutting, environment, sand, etc. all can influence what the best angles for you are.
If someone is new to the filing game the file holders will help them achieve a good set of consistent angles. If you hand file with just a file there are some extra tweaks you can apply to the chain, such as down angle or cleaning out the gullet. I like putting in down angle when I hand file my chain. I cut my own firewood, work with a saw in the local park and at friends farms. I normally use different medium size saws (50cc) that I check out from work for the job. I personally use 95VPX which I hand file aggressively and don't take the DG's down too low. I count my strokes to keep the top plates equal in length, touch-up the edge frequently and keep the chain out of the dirt.
Maybe some of this helps.
Oregon Engineer
Thanks for your comments OE,
Just to be clear, I never felt that the service tech was 'blowing me off' in any way - just trying to give a simple answer.
I have always had a good response calling the Oregon technical help line and appreciate Blount keeping this service alive, when so many companies have become so difficult to reach directly.
In fact, it was probably your newer instructions that inspired this thread - the note at the bottom (please see first post) about the Oregon file holder, which, as I noted, I had only used at 0/90 degrees. It never occurred to me that it might be an issue with chisel chain filed at 10 degrees.
I appreciate the technical information Oregon makes available, and have referred many people on this forum to it. It's just when people are discussing fine points (excuse the pun), discrepancies in the published literature become a subject of interest and discussion.
Philbert
Oregon Engineer
ArboristSite Operative
Philbert
I understood that, I was just making the point that our typical answers fit the typical situation.
OE
