salvage miling

[mtngun]

I posted pics of this area a couple of months ago. It was clearcut last year, then the slash fire got out of control and damaged many surrounding trees, which blew over during the winter. I assumed there would be a salvage operation on the blowdowns, so I've been trying to get as much wood out while the getting is good.

But instead of salvaging the blowdowns. the area was burned instead. I understand it has to be cleaned up to reduce the fire hazard and the bug hazard, but geez, there was enough lumber there to build several houses. What a waste!!!! It was only 10 - 20 acres, and in a remote location, so maybe the red tape would have cost more than the timber was worth ??

The sad thing is that this year's burn has damaged even more trees. It won't necessarily kill them outright, but it seems to weaken them and many will blow over in future wind storms, which are a regular event here.

Anyway, a few blowdowns escaped the fire, including this douglas fir. Maybe 80 - 100 years old, around 18" dbh (they don't grow very fast here compared to the Pacific coast). So I did my part to reduce the fire and bug hazard.

I use the guide board for each and every cut. I've tried it both ways and the boards are straighter when I use the guide board. It only takes a minute to set the guide board on and put a drywall screw at each end to hold it down.

Saw is a new-to-me 660 with 36" bar and Bailey's 33RP milling chain. The 660 is a little tired (133 psi) but adequate for softwood. It doesn't pump nearly enough bar oil for milling, though -- 1/3 tank oil for each tank of gas -- so an auxilary oiler is in the works.

I've tried both cutting cants and cutting slabs, and have settled on slabs because it lets me get more wood in the truck in a day's work. Later, I use a circular saw to edge the slabs. It's a race to get wood out of the forest because our cutting season is short and, as you have seen, the desirable trees don't stick around forever.

Most of the lumber will be used to build a wood shed next year.

 

[RPM]

"The sad thing is that this year's burn has damaged even more trees. It won't necessarily kill them outright, but it seems to weaken them and many will blow over in future wind storms, which are a regular event here."


Oh well.....more for you next year :greenchainsaw: . I hate seeing good wood (esp. doug-fir) go to waste. Glad you're doing something worthwhile with it.

 

[BobL]

Good work mtngun! Thanks for posting the pics. I'm also one that advocates using guide board (in my case rails) for avery slab.
Cheers

 

[slabmaster]

Nice pictures! Bet that chevy truck has earned it's keep,mine have though the years.I keep an oiler bottle at hand to lube when i feel the bar and chain need a little more help at times while milling.I usually lube when i stop to give the saw a break every 6" or so.It sure helps on the lifspan of the bar and chain.

 

[woodshop]

Great pics, thanks. I too rarely run down a log without a guildbar. You can get away with it once in a while, but the saw will continue to exaggerate the slight dips and twists that occur with each slab if you don't start with a new surface every time. The way I look at it, if you're going to take the time to mill, take the little extra time to do it right.

So... do you need a permit or anything to run out there and take that Doug fir or is it just free wood first come first serve? Curious.

 

[irishcountry]

Nice score I think I need to make up a guide board too sometimes it seems like more work setting rails although I know there a need in certain case for them a board seems like quick set up!! Thanks for the pics irishcountry

 

[mtngun]

So... do you need a permit or anything to run out there and take that Doug fir or is it just free wood first come first serve? Curious.

It is state land and the state has a gazillion regulations, that for the most part, nobody pays attention to.

But.... yes, I do have a firewood permit. It is only for two cords, but the forester told me to take all I want. Because of the remote location, steep terrain, and weak market, they have a hard time selling timber at a profit, and few outsiders will drive this far to cut firewood. Most of the trees on state ground are grand fir, which is hardly worth the cost of hauling to the mill (grand fir is commonly called white fir, but I believe it is properly called grand fir).

Before the white man came and screwed things up, most of this mountain was ponderosa pine, douglas fir, and tamarack. Grand fir was present, but wildfires kept it in check, since grand fir is not fire resistant like ponderosa and douglas.

Early logging was done on a "best first" basis. The best trees were harvested and the worst trees were left behind to reproduce. Tamarack no longer grows on this mountain -- it was completely wiped out by logging. Douglas is scarce on state land. Ponderosa still grows well, but the shady slopes that used to be douglas fir and tamarack are now grand fir.

Each year, the government spends millions of dollars fighting wildfires to protect the worthless grand fir forests. Thanks to Smokey the Bear, the grand fir forests are taking over. Your tax dollars at work.

Most of this original clearcut was white/grand fir. When they logged it, they only hauled away the douglas and ponderosa, and left the grand firs laying on the ground to rot or be burned. It seemed terribly wasteful, but I imagine it was a deliberate attempt to thin out the grand fir in the hopes that it would be replaced by douglas fir. Douglas is one of those trees that springs to life after a fire.

Anyway, getting back to the rules and regulations ...... the forester never bothered to give me a copy of the regulations. He told me he would only cut trees on the ground. I replied that I prefer to take dead standing trees, because the ones on the ground are usually rotten. He didn't argue with me, so I took that to mean he didn't care.

Someone told me that the rules say that you can't haul out a piece longer than 4 feet, which would sure put a crimp on amateur milling. I guess rules like that are necessary to discourage illegal logging. Nonetheless, most locals haul their firewood home in truck-length chunks, and then buck it at home. It's faster that way, and in this remote location, nobody cares about regulations.

The regulation I most commonly run up against is that I am not allowed to cut, nor will they issue a permit, if there is a timber sale in the area. In theory, that would be like stealing logs that belong to the logging company, even though I normally only take dead trees that are no value to them.

The problem is, there is almost always a timber sale in the neighborhood, so some years they won't issue firewood permits. My home is heated with wood, and only wood, so what am I supposed to do ? I told the forester "if you won't sell me a permit, I'll cut wood anyway, so you might as well take my money." He just shrugged his shoulders and said "well, as long as you only take deadwood, all you are doing is reducing the fire hazard." In other words, no body cares, as long as you don't take valuable trees.

This year I bought a permit early in the spring, when logging was shut down due to mud. The permit is good for the calender year, so even if they have a logging sale later on, as they usually do, my permit is still good. I've learned how to play their permit game.

My own code is to never take a healthy tree, only dead trees. And there are plenty of dead trees. Ponderosas die because of beetles. Douglas gets some kind of root rot. Dead white/grand fir everywhere you look. We routinely have hurricane force windstorms that blow down even healthy trees.

That said, I rarely get a shot at a non-rotten douglas fir. I was lucky to find these blowdowns.

So do the regulations allow me to take these fallen but otherwise prime douglas fir ? Probably not, but no one cares, and like I said, they were trying to burn these suckers !!!! Every fall, the state burns more wood than I will use in a lifetime. Every fall, my mountain air looks like Los Angeles smog, due to smoke from slash piles and controlled burns. To my way of thinking, I don't see anything morally wrong with putting these blowdowns to good use. Better to be used, or at least burned for firewood, instead of being burned in the forest.

 

[woodbooga]

Thanks for posting the pics. I've been returning to the Bailey's page with the guide bar listing and wondering how it's been working out for folks.

We had some real high winds this summer and a lot of good wood going to waste. If we had wind events/blowdown like this year, I'd invest in a set up like that in a second. Even if only to have a steady supply of free boards for upkeep on my 150 year old barn.

 

[7oaks]

Excellent pics

Those are some excellent and very descriptive pics. Thanks for posting them and the accompanying info...Carl

 

[Brmorgan]

Mtngun, sounds like you guys are in a similar situation to us up north of the border. Our firewood permits explicitly state that they do not permit the use of "Alaskan-type" chainsaw mills. But I know a few people who do it along with myself, and nobody seems to care unless, like you said, an existing timber sale is involved. I agree with you about putting the blowdowns to good use, it either reduces the fire hazard or saves someone else a cleanup job. And if we're not selling the wood commercially and avoiding stumpage fees, what should anybody care?

About the Douglas Fir root rot - that's kinda strange. Is it rather wet where you live? There are huge dead Douglas Firs standing around here that have been dead as long as I've lived here, almost 22 years now. But it's quite dry here most of the time. Heck, I've cut a couple old rotting Fir logs that had saplings growing out of them. Sure, there's a few inches of rot around the outside, but the heartwood can stay good for years in the right conditions. Beetle-killed pine, on the other hand, might stand for 3-5 years at most.

I thought Grand Fir was a fairly nice wood, somewhat similar to Hemlock? Unless maybe it's Subalpine Fir, which is total garbage. Does the wood smell like old cat piss when you cut it? If so, that's Subalpine. Though I wouldn't expect to find it with Ponderosa.

 

[mtngun]

Not wet at all here, less than 30" a year. However, our hot, dry summers can weaken the trees and make them more vulnerable to disease and insects.

Here's a link to the fungus, often called "root rot", that attacks douglas fir. root rot

I've yet to see subalpine fir on this mountain. I believe it is a smaller tree. Our grand firs get decent size, 24" dbh and 75 - 100 feet tall. They grow quickly and thickly -- you can hardly walk through a stand of grand fir -- but are short lived. The forest is chock full of dead grand fir. It's a fire hazard.

Here is a link to grand fir, sometimes called white fir. grand fir It is a weak wood and checks like crazy. One local stud mill saws a little grand fir, but mostly it is used for pulp. We are a long drive from the nearest paper mill, so if a logging contract requires clear cutting, the loggers may simply burn the grand fir rather than lose money trucking it to the mill.

The amount of wood that is deliberately burned each year is mind boggling.

I am certainly not an expert on forestry, but at a local level, we have a surplus of poor quality timber like grand fir, that isn't worth hauling to the mill. Sometimes they can't get anyone to bid on timber sales, and with all the mill closings, I don't see that changing anytime soon.

This is a far cry from the prevailing wisdom over on the logging forum, which would have you believe that loggers are being put out of work for lack of timber, due to environmental regulations.