Saw fixing

[pioneerguy600]

sounds like a great deal all around. Glad it worked out.
I wish I could get paid with new saws. lol

First time for me to get a near new saw for payment,usually old beaters or broken needing parts and lots of work. Something no one would take on trade for a new saw. LOL
What comes around goes around or something like that.
Pioneerguy600

 

[dancan]

Man ,that's a good story right to the end .
Glad to see that a good turn gets repaid fairly and promptly .

 

[Bruce Hopf]

First time for me to get a near new saw for payment,usually old beaters or broken needing parts and lots of work. Something no one would take on trade for a new saw. LOL
What comes around goes around or something like that.
Pioneerguy600

Glad to hear that it all worked out for you. Bruce. P.S. Keep us updated, and let us know how it goes with your friend, and this saw, after this comming weekend. Bruce.

:greenchainsaw:

 

[mattinky]

Wow! Good for you Man! Sometimes these things work themselves out in a good way, glad to hear you did'nt get a hassle from the guy.

 

[Chris J.]

 

[Pebbles]

Good outcome! I certainly wasn't expecting that

 

[Bruce Hopf]

Good outcome! I certainly wasn't expecting that

Pebbles. Welcome to this fascinating website. I joined here in April, and I have learned so much from these forums. I've been running chainsaws for almost 30 years, and I have learned different things, and terms, that I have never heard of, or seen before. Great bunch of people on these forums. Always willing to help you, when you need it. Also great advice here as well. Just sit back, and enjoy yourself. I sit back too much, on this computer, and sometimes wind up in the Dog's House. Only problem with him, he takes up too much room, and makes more noise than my old Macs do when he is snoring.
Bruce.

:greenchainsaw: :greenchainsaw:

 

[pioneerguy600]

Well I added another saw to the collection today. I took 2 Stihl saws that I repaired back to a local shop to just drop them off and was in a bit of a hurry but the owner was serving a customer and signaled to me to wait a minute before leaving. Had to wait about 10 min as the customer was longwinded but finally packed it in after describing the problem with the pole trimmer in every aspect of operation in all positions. Shop owner says I`ve got sumpthin here you might be interested in and heads out back where he gets down on his knees and reaches back under a pile of saws,trimmers, lawn mowers and other gas engined gear and pulls out a chainsaw. Well she`s a Stihl of some kind and a dirtier saw would be hard to imagine. Only the Skil chainsaw he gave a month or so back was this dirty.
He says this saw is seized and the owner called after a year and says dump it its not worth fixin. Knowing you he says ,you`ll probably beat the piston out add a set of rings and have it runnin by the weekend so here ya go. I look it over quickly and make out with a little rubbing a 034 label on the very dirty top cover,its got a nearly new Stihl rollamatic E bar and new chain sticking out through the dirt encrusted saw casing.So I thank him and take my money and the saw as he hollers let me know how it goes and if you get it runnin.
Get back home in the shop and take the saw in and the guys say whered you get that thing etc,etc,snickers and guffaas . I take it to the bench and chisel the guck off around the bar nuts ,remove the bar and chain,sweet nearly new. Put the saw in the dishwasher and set the pre heat for 100 F and let er go for an hour. Take it out and it is some what cleaner, no broken pieces , no bad scratches and only a few paint chips showing. Now to get the pine gum off I put it in the gunwash cabinet with varsol as the solvent and let it run for 30 mins. Now thats better, the whole outside is quite clean and there is no damaged parts.
Now I can take this apart to see whats on the inside,I pull on the recoil handle and it turns a little then binds but this is a good thing,right.Take out the four cover screws and try to pry the cover off as it seems stuck somehow.It breaks free with some effort and when removed the recoil and flywheel and cavity around the flywheel is packed with something like fine mud mixed with sticky black goo.Never saw this stuff before but with some effort I chisel it out and the flywheel turns with compression.After a half hour cleanup around the flywheel,recoilrotor and the coil,replaced the flywheel and recoil and with new mixed gas in the tank and a squirt in the carb,2 pulls and it fires ,choke on ,one pull fires,push in choke,2 pulls and away it goes.Run it for a min or so and just adjust the low needle a 1/4 turn out and it runs at idle and WOT like it was used every day,no issues at all. What the ell was that mess in around the flywheel,guess I will never know, now what do I tell the shop owner,the truth as always.
Pioneerguy600

 

[Bruce Hopf]

Well I added another saw to the collection today. I took 2 Stihl saws that I repaired back to a local shop to just drop them off and was in a bit of a hurry but the owner was serving a customer and signaled to me to wait a minute before leaving. Had to wait about 10 min as the customer was long winded but finally packed it in after describing the problem with the pole trimmer in every aspect of operation in all positions. Shop owner says I`ve got something here you might be interested in and heads out back where he gets down on his knees and reaches back under a pile of saws,trimmers, lawn mowers and other gas engined gear and pulls out a chainsaw. Well she`s a Stihl of some kind and a dirtier saw would be hard to imagine. Only the Skil chainsaw he gave a month or so back was this dirty.
He says this saw is seized and the owner called after a year and says dump it its not worth fixing. Knowing you he says ,you`ll probably beat the piston out add a set of rings and have it runnin by the weekend so here ya go. I look it over quickly and make out with a little rubbing a 034 label on the very dirty top cover,its got a nearly new Stihl rollomatic E bar and new chain sticking out through the dirt encrusted saw casing.So I thank him and take my money and the saw as he hollers let me know how it goes and if you get it runnin.
Get back home in the shop and take the saw in and the guys say where you get that thing etc,etc,snickers and guffaws . I take it to the bench and chisel the guck off around the bar nuts ,remove the bar and chain,sweet nearly new. Put the saw in the dishwasher and set the pre heat for 100 F and let er go for an hour. Take it out and it is some what cleaner, no broken pieces , no bad scratches and only a few paint chips showing. Now to get the pine gum off I put it in the gun wash cabinet with varsol as the solvent and let it run for 30 mins. Now that's better, the whole outside is quite clean and there is no damaged parts.
Now I can take this apart to see whats on the inside,I pull on the recoil handle and it turns a little then binds but this is a good thing,right.Take out the four cover screws and try to pry the cover off as it seems stuck somehow.It breaks free with some effort and when removed the recoil and flywheel and cavity around the flywheel is packed with something like fine mud mixed with sticky black goo.Never saw this stuff before but with some effort I chisel it out and the flywheel turns with compression.After a half hour cleanup around the flywheel,recoilrotor and the coil,replaced the flywheel and recoil and with new mixed gas in the tank and a squirt in the carb,2 pulls and it fires ,choke on ,one pull fires,push in choke,2 pulls and away it goes.Run it for a min or so and just adjust the low needle a 1/4 turn out and it runs at idle and WOT like it was used every day,no issues at all. What the ell was that mess in around the flywheel,guess I will never know, now what do I tell the shop owner,the truth as always.
Pioneerguy600

You Know, you are a lot like me, I go into somebody else's small engine repair shop, and pick up the odds and ends of chainsaws, I think I might need, as parts saws to keep mine going, because of no parts availability.
Try to find out what is wrong with them, and sometimes able to get them working after trying a couple of things, like changing the points and condensers over to a computer chip, and new spark plug. I have done this with great success a couple of times.
This is the first time, I've heard of a dishwasher being used. Since I have joined here in April, I have learned a great deal. I now soak my chains in oven cleaner to clean the gunk and oil off them, rinse them off with water, and let dry over night. I sharpen them and soak them in bar oil over night, and hang them up, with a drip pan under them, to catch the oil. I have found it easier on my grinding wheel, as well. I learned this technique off the Razor Sharp Chain Forum.
Now back to the dishwasher trick. Does this clean them better than stripping down, and using the air compressor to blow out the saw dust, oil, and gunk? Will this procedure hurt a good running saw in any way? or do you not recommend me trying this with my saws. I have an old dish washer in the basement.
Thanks. Bruce.

 

[pioneerguy600]

An old dishwasher works well if the water temp can be controlled,the automatic heat coil in most dishwashers heat the water really hot,that will clean the gunk off the saws really well but kind of fades the plastic and paint leaving them bleached looking so keep the water temp down. I run water soluble degreaser in the dishwasher if the saw is really dirty like this one was,it will clean the outside casings really well but it is best to take all the covers off the saw and wash them but not the powerhead unless you block the intake and exhaust ports,fuel and impulse lines and leave the sparkplug in. Regular dishwashing detergent meant for dishwashers does a really good job on most saws if they are not extremely gummed up. Pioneerguy600

 

[Bruce Hopf]

An old dishwasher works well if the water temp can be controlled,the automatic heat coil in most dishwashers heat the water really hot,that will clean the gunk off the saws really well but kind of fades the plastic and paint leaving them bleached looking so keep the water temp down. I run water soluble degreaser in the dishwasher if the saw is really dirty like this one was,it will clean the outside casings really well but it is best to take all the covers off the saw and wash them but not the powerhead unless you block the intake and exhaust ports,fuel and impulse lines and leave the spark plug in. Regular dishwashing detergent meant for dishwashers does a really good job on most saws if they are not extremely gummed up. Pioneerguy600

OK. How about just using the engine cleaning air gun with var sol, and keep the stream away from the exhaust, and intake ports and fuel and impulse lines. I have often thought of using that, like I do the Engines of Farm Tractors that I work on. Bruce.

 

[pioneerguy600]

We use one most every day and it works fine,the dishwasher works on its own and frees up time for us to work on other things while it is running its cycle,just a multi tasking thing I guess. We have a bulk feeder type with a pickup hose dropped into a 5 gallon bucket of cleaner of choice and a wash gun with a bottle attached directly to it. Both work well but take up our time to use them. I would not put my saws in a dishwasher on a regular basis but for extremely dirty cases it works good or if you were going to paint the metal parts it will leave them oil free. Pioneerguy600

 

[Bruce Hopf]

We use one most every day and it works fine,the dishwasher works on its own and frees up time for us to work on other things while it is running its cycle,just a multi tasking thing I guess. We have a bulk feeder type with a pickup hose dropped into a 5 gallon bucket of cleaner of choice and a wash gun with a bottle attached directly to it. Both work well but take up our time to use them. I would not put my saws in a dishwasher on a regular basis but for extremely dirty cases it works good or if you were going to paint the metal parts it will leave them oil free. Pioneerguy600

OK Jerry. What would you use or suggest how to keep the water blocked from entering the intake and exhaust ports of the power head? I am very intrigued by this idea, and wish to give it a try. I will practice with a scraper, that I'm scraping for parts. Thanks again. Bruce.

 

[Tazman1602]

Can you fix my saw? The question we all have heard before and over again. It don`t need much and won`t take long,I need it for Monday so I can go to work bucking hardwood.
I should say no but find it hard to, its 2 o`clock on a Saturday.He brings the saw in and I start to look it over,he knows I have a part saw that he has tried to buy from me for some time now. At first glance it needs the top handle AV mount and rubber buffer and the handle is bent quite a bit,rubber covering shredded. He says the clutch is not working so I figure a weak spring. The saw wants to fold up like a pizza box and I discover that the front two AV mounts are completely broken out ,the cases are busted and the felling dog has a broken bottom spike.
This thing is trashed and I have 4 cord of wood to split before dark, I will work on it Sunday. Well today I start in on it at 10 am and strip it,can`t believe the damaged parts. Luckily the donor saw is a NOS unit missing only the carb and p&c. These are the new parts necessary to get it up and running to my standards.Starter side cover with recoil,top handle with AV mount and rubber buffer, clutch cover ,brake handle and band cw chain adjuster,rear tank handle and gas tank,all new AV mounts and springs,both case halves with crankshaft, clutch girdle spring and debur the bar and a new 3/8 pitch chain.
I now have more new parts on his saw than what he could sell the saw for but he needs it to make a living.
I also have 8 hours labor in it so what should I charge for a job like this.The saw is a 6 month old Echo model CS 670. Should I offer to buy it from him and let him buy another saw? Pioneerguy600

Dude I wouldn't have even fixed it. My shop rate is $45/hour by the hour. Heck I've got overhead and my shop is just a home shop in the pole barn. I don't get much business but I don't really want much either -- not if it's going to cost ME money and 8 hours of my time is worth a helluva lot.

Are you an old guy or a young guy? I used to do this all the time when I was young, but time will cure you of the "nice guy" syndrome. I"ve gotten screwed on that a hundred times with automatic transmissions, carbs, fuel injection, etc and simply won't do it anymore.

................and people wonder WHY there are no small engine shops around anymore? Because there ain't no money doing that stuff, those days, sadly, are long gone..........

Just MHO.

 

[Brian S]

Dude I wouldn't have even fixed it. My shop rate is $45/hour by the hour. Heck I've got overhead and my shop is just a home shop in the pole barn. I don't get much business but I don't really want much either -- not if it's going to cost ME money and 8 hours of my time is worth a helluva lot.

Are you an old guy or a young guy? I used to do this all the time when I was young, but time will cure you of the "nice guy" syndrome. I"ve gotten screwed on that a hundred times with automatic transmissions, carbs, fuel injection, etc and simply won't do it anymore.

................and people wonder WHY there are no small engine shops around anymore? Because there ain't no money doing that stuff, those days, sadly, are long gone..........

Just MHO.

Tazman you are right on the money, most of the old saws and lawnmowers I've repaired needed hours and hours of cleaning and refurbishing but very few actual parts to bring them back up to snuff. People just don't understand or want to pay for time, they probably won't flinch at the parts pricing but they can't understand why it took 4+ hours to rebuild the recoil when you had to clean it for 3.5 hours just to get it apart! No wonder small shops can't stay in business.... I'm glad to have the skills and interest to do these things but I couldn't imagine being able to make much of a living at it!

 

[Bruce Hopf]

Tazman you are right on the money, most of the old saws and lawnmowers I've repaired needed hours and hours of cleaning and refurbishing but very few actual parts to bring them back up to snuff. People just don't understand or want to pay for time, they probably won't flinch at the parts pricing but they can't understand why it took 4+ hours to rebuild the recoil when you had to clean it for 3.5 hours just to get it apart! No wonder small shops can't stay in business.... I'm glad to have the skills and interest to do these things but I couldn't imagine being able to make much of a living at it!

I've tried to do Restoration of old farm tractors, and did a couple of complete restoration jobs, sandblasting right down to bare metal, and starting fresh, but just gave up on it. Time and labour, cost of parts don't add up to what people are willing to pay.
I had one job, parts and labour where over $7000.00, and when you hand the customer a bill, he stands there and tells you what feels the tractor is worth. You feel like asking, if it's worth that much, why did you want it restored in the first place?
I ate over 3 grand on the job, and when the guy asked when you can do another job for him, I just look at him, and shake my head, and walk away from him.
I've had guys ask me for a quote, and I tell them high, and they tell me what it's worth. I simply tell them that it's worth that much, don't get it restored, leave it as is. I then get asked, what I think? I just say I already told you.
Unless your working for a shop, it's hard to do it on your own.
Bruce.

 

[pioneerguy600]

I hear all of you on the not worth it to do restoration and repair work on any old machines. I only do it as a hobby and it`s not my full time work. It started out as doing work for friends and family and eventually spreads to their friends and friends of friends and their relatives ,well you know how it goes. I have been involved in mechanicals all my life it seems and can do work on all types of engines. I operate heavy equipment and work on it as well,but have been doing renovation work on homes and buildings for the past ten years as it allows me to be around home and not have to travel away from home for extended periods of time. I occasionaly have a day off now and then and like to work on my own collection of chainsaws but find myself doing too much work for others so will have to wean them off slowly. LOL Pioneerguy600

 

[pioneerguy600]

OK Jerry. What would you use or suggest how to keep the water blocked from entering the intake and exhaust ports of the power head? I am very intrigued by this idea, and wish to give it a try. I will practice with a scraper, that I'm scraping for parts. Thanks again. Bruce.

You can simply make a solid gasket to fit behind your muffler and carb then tighten the screws or bolts down and it will block the entry of water just like if you were doing a vacuum check. Pioneerguy600

 

[Zodiac45]

Ok the guy came in this morning to pick up the saw and I knew immediately that he had been partying all weekend as he looked haggered and hung over as usual. He`s jovial and has a coffee for me. Looks the saw over and says it looks like new,does it run and cut good. I answer yes its fine and he says that all he expected was to have it patched up good enough to run for the week and he would bring it back next weekend and have some more done to it. Didn`t expect me to work on it all weekend etc.
So he gets around to whats the"damages" and when I tell him how much work I did on it and the parts I used then tell him how much he don`t seem too stressed. He`s quiet for couple secs. and then says that he is short on cash and I expect the inevitable song and dance but he then says to me you like Stihl saws don`t you? I say yes of course and he replies ,would you take a nearly new MS260 in trade for the job. My mind envisons a beat to death POS but he goes out to his truck and fetches back a brand new looking saw ,no dirt or scratches,nothing. He states it is on its third tank of gas and is no use to him as it is too small.
From his pocket he produces the bill of sale and warranty card just to prove he owns it as it was purchased over a year ago at a local dealer who has since moved across town to a new location.He says if you are happy I am happy and with that he is off to work and I am the owner of a nearly new MS260 that I just had to take out and try out. Well I ran three tanks of gas through it today and it is a new saw allright , smooth,powerful for a small saw and could ask for nothing more.
Now I have someone in mind who could really use this saw and will be taking it over to him this weekend,I think he will be a really happy camper. So it turned out a lot better than I expected and my blood pressure is back down and now I feel like I can help a friend out that really needs help . This makes me feel good and my week will be much better after all the turmoil over the weekend. LOL
Pioneerguy600

Outstanding outcome Jerry! I love it when a plan comes together!

 

[Bruce Hopf]

You can simply make a solid gasket to fit behind your muffler and carb then tighten the screws or bolts down and it will block the entry of water just like if you were doing a vacuum check. Pioneerguy600

OK. I'm learning as I go here. Correct me if I'm wrong. I pull the carburetor, and muffler, put in a solid gasket, and reinstall the carburetor, and muffler. I've never done a vacuum test on an engine. Just compression and spark tests. Your input is greatly appreciated. Thanks again. Bruce.