Some questions from concerned green guy

[Uldis]

Hi everyone,
I have a few questions that bothers me, that I have also sent to STIHL, but as they don't reply, maybe the questions are stupid, but I would like to know a few things:
1) Is it OK, if I bought a chainsaw from US and used it in Europe? (Stihl states US saws should be used in US only; I want to buy from US, because it is a LOT cheaper plus we can't get all models - only up to MS361, but the price - even with expensive shipping and taxes I can get MS441(not sold in my country) for 200$ cheaper than our local dealer sells the MS361);
2) What octane rating gas You use in US saws? Here we have the 95 (has 5% bioethanol) and 98(no bioethanol). Is it OK to run the 98+Stihl HP Ultra in my US MS441? Is there a difference in HP Ultra sold in US and in Europe (European Ultra is made in Italy)?
3) Stihl recommends bars from 16" to 32" on Stihl MS441. Is it OK to run the 16" all the time (here we have a lot of fir trees) for quick limbing?
Although these questions might seem like come from caring mother, but I want my "baby" to run smooth for years to come.
Thanks in advance for replies.
Uldis.

 

[spacemule]

1)No, it's not ok. If you use an American saw in Europe, it will revolt and start a revolution. Not sure what you're wanting on this one.

2)Europe uses a different octane rating on fuel than does the US, so the numbers are not directly comparable. Stihl recommends 89 or above.

3) No, of course it's not all right to use the bar Stihl recommends on its saws. The Stihl engineers do not know half of what a bunch of internet geeks do, so you're smart to ask this forum.

 

[Uldis]

1)No, it's not ok. If you use an American saw in Europe, it will revolt and start a revolution. Not sure what you're wanting on this one.

2)Europe uses a different octane rating on fuel than does the US, so the numbers are not directly comparable. Stihl recommends 89 or above.

3) No, of course it's not all right to use the bar Stihl recommends on its saws. The Stihl engineers do not know half of what a bunch of internet geeks do, so you're smart to ask this forum.

Well thanks for reply, but:
1) This is from Stihlusa.com: "STIHL products sold through U.S. STIHL dealers are for distribution in the United States only."
Is it because of warranty or technical differences?
3) It is just from this:

Does anyone see anything wrong with running a 660 with a 20" bar. I asked a local Stihl dealer and they told me that I would burn up the engine.

[..] sales guy said I would "burn up" the saw with the small bar and it would not be covered under the warranty.

That dealer doesn't know what he's talking about.
Sounds like your dealer doesn't even read his product literature.

If we can't trust dealers, whom can we trust? {rhetorical question}

 

[belgian]

Hi everyone,
I have a few questions that bothers me, that I have also sent to STIHL, but as they don't reply, maybe the questions are stupid, but I would like to know a few things:
1) Is it OK, if I bought a chainsaw from US and used it in Europe? (Stihl states US saws should be used in US only; I want to buy from US, because it is a LOT cheaper plus we can't get all models - only up to MS361, but the price - even with expensive shipping and taxes I can get MS441(not sold in my country) for 200$ cheaper than our local dealer sells the MS361);
2) What octane rating gas You use in US saws? Here we have the 95 (has 5% bioethanol) and 98(no bioethanol). Is it OK to run the 98+Stihl HP Ultra in my US MS441? Is there a difference in HP Ultra sold in US and in Europe (European Ultra is made in Italy)?
3) Stihl recommends bars from 16" to 32" on Stihl MS441. Is it OK to run the 16" all the time (here we have a lot of fir trees) for quick limbing?
Although these questions might seem like come from caring mother, but I want my "baby" to run smooth for years to come.
Thanks in advance for replies.
Uldis.

1. yes, if you can find a dealer who takes care of intl shipping. No technical limitations. Make sure your local dealer can service the saws you import.

2. run 95 or 98 with stihl ultra.

3. 16" is OK.

good luck

 

[Uldis]

Thanks belgian,
I see You're from Europe too. Have You bought any chainsaw from US, or only in Europe?

 

[belgian]

Thanks belgian,
I see You're from Europe too. Have You bought any chainsaw from US, or only in Europe?

I do collect old saws and have purchased/traded a few from the US. But no new saws so far.

 

[Rookie1]

I wonder if they have a zero tolerance rule about moving saws from one market to another. Example is our wonderful EPA regulations. CErtain models are stil being sold in Brazil and not here because of emissions.So Stihl says you cant import it cause youd break the law. Seems stupid but thats my guess.

 

[belgian]

I wonder if they have a zero tolerance rule about moving saws from one market to another. Example is our wonderful EPA regulations. CErtain models are stil being sold in Brazil and not here because of emissions.So Stihl says you cant import it cause youd break the law. Seems stupid but thats my guess.

Stihl doesn't make the laws...

 

[tree_beard]

the issue is that any machinery sold in europe need a CE mark... a symbol that signifies the equipment meets all the relevant european health and safety requirements.

a saw sold on the us market is very unlikely to be ce marked, so shouldnt really be sold in europe (even if the saw was originally manufactured in germany)

there is nothing stopping a private user buying and using a us saw in europe. but it should not then be re-sold, there may be issues getting dealer service for the machine (they shouldnt be working on non-ce marked machinery), and if you were using said saw in a work environment and there was an accident... health and safety/insurance investigators could put you in a world of hurt for not having a certified machine.

thats the only real issue (and no real problem if you ask me, but i wouldnt outfit a logging company with 'cheap' us saws because of the liability issues)

 

[Rookie1]

Stihl doesn't make the laws...

No but they have to follow them. Thats why I said zero tolerance. Meaning no moving saws from any country to any other country.

 

[Nethercutt]

Tree_beard is right in mentioning the CE mark, which is a conglomeration of electromagnetic radiation compliance (similar to FCC Part 15 compliance in the US that you always see labeled on products), and safety compliance (which would be similar to the UL or ETL marks in the US).

But I think that Rookie1 is onto the more likely reason that bans certain saws from selling to the European market: emmissions regulations. The only things that would keep a larger saw from getting the CE mark would be EMC or safety concerns. Considering the fact that the ignition modules aren't terribly different between the saws today, EMC probably isn't the concern. And considering the fact that a chainsaw is inherantly one of the most dangerous objects on the planet, there isn't any more danger running a 440 than a 361 that I can see.

I'm not well versed in European emmissions regulations though, so I don't know if the laws apply to the first sale from the manufacturer, or if they would apply to importing used equipment. Regardless, I'm sure there aren't resources (or desire) to actively enforce emmissions regulations. There aren't any kind of emmissions checks on power equipment like there are on automobiles in certain states in the US (like California).

But tree_beard brings up another interresting point: the liability of using a non CE-approved device in the event of an accident. So, I'd probably advise against lending the saw out to someone in Europe, and probably wouldn't brag about having a non CE-approved saw to your insurance adjuster....

 

[Haywire Haywood]

Is it OK to run the 16" all the time

If you plan on running a 16" bar all the time, then save your money and get a 361. A 441 with a 16" bar is even overkill for power hungry people like me. There's also a parts issue. If your dealer doesn't carry them, then they probably don't carry parts for them either. Are you going to order air filters from the US too?

Ian

 

[Uldis]

Well, saying 16" all the time was incorrect - then MS441 is way too fancy. But it is what it would start - got a small job to cut some old, dry oak trees - just wanted that power reserve.
As long as spare parts go - it's ok - they are much cheaper on eBay or US dealers. Only the time to deliver them, but as I know from experience - You might have to wait a long time for spares even if the model is available at shop...
Time is ok..the saw would not be the primary one..

 

[Freehand]

1)No, it's not ok. If you use an American saw in Europe, it will revolt and start a revolution. Not sure what you're wanting on this one.

2)Europe uses a different octane rating on fuel than does the US, so the numbers are not directly comparable. Stihl recommends 89 or above.

3) No, of course it's not all right to use the bar Stihl recommends on its saws. The Stihl engineers do not know half of what a bunch of internet geeks do, so you're smart to ask this forum.

Ah,posting rubbish at 12:51 am there Spacey?Are you one of the "internet geeks"?:spam:

 

[andrethegiant70]

Thank you for being green. Many folks in the US have an antiquated philosophy regarding taking care of things that can't take care of themselves. There are some terrific folks on here who understand this, but you may get a little guff for your "green" statement."

I hope you disregard them and I apologize in advance.

I hear the 441 is a great saw.. I don't know about the whole "CE" thing, but I suspect the only problems with running a US saw would be jurisdictional. They are not hard to work on, so if you do end up at a dealer that has a problem with it, we can always help you sort out the issue here.

Alternately, you could go peel the "CE" sticker off your coffee maker and slap it on the saw. You might get a chuckle from the dealer, but I'll bet he needs the work.

Welcome to the site!!

 

[Grande Dog]

Howdy,
This all falls under world governments helping manufacturers protect markets and thereby securing maximum tax revenue keeping both parties happy. Do people really think the UL version of the 441 has worse emissions, and is way less safe than the CE version causing the price to be hundreds of dollars less. And this is after it's shipped half way around the world and has had import duties added. I don't think so.
Regards
Gregg

 

[Hddnis]

Howdy,
This all falls under world governments helping manufacturers protect markets and thereby securing maximum tax revenue keeping both parties happy. Do people really think the UL version of the 441 has worse emissions, and is way less safe than the CE version causing the price to be hundreds of dollars less. And this is after it's shipped half way around the world and has had import duties added. I don't think so.
Regards
Gregg

This.

Tie it in with what space said. You just can't have a saw that has tasted the relative freedom in the US going back overseas and starting a revolution.:biggrinbounce2:


Mr. HE

 

[Hddnis]

Thank you for being green. Many folks in the US have an antiquated philosophy regarding taking care of things that can't take care of themselves. There are some terrific folks on here who understand this, but you may get a little guff for your "green" statement."

I hope you disregard them and I apologize in advance.

I hear the 441 is a great saw.. I don't know about the whole "CE" thing, but I suspect the only problems with running a US saw would be jurisdictional. They are not hard to work on, so if you do end up at a dealer that has a problem with it, we can always help you sort out the issue here.

Alternately, you could go peel the "CE" sticker off your coffee maker and slap it on the saw. You might get a chuckle from the dealer, but I'll bet he needs the work.

Welcome to the site!!

I'm not sure what he meant by the green in his title. I assumed, maybe wrongly, that it had something to do with nationality or ethnic origins.

Either way, or even some third way, his questions didn't seem to have anything to do with the green religion. Try to stay on topic please.


Mr. HE

 

[WoodViking]

Go ahead

Just go ahead and import a saw - that was what I did with my husqvarna 346xp. As the saw is made in sweden it is exactly the same as the saw I could have bought from a local dealer. Just be aware of national taxes on stuff imported from overseas.

Just to complete it I recently bought a new husqvarna 372xp from the UK. The difference being that it was without any import taxes because I bought it from a EU country.

That way I got both saws for a little less than I would have to pay for just the 372 here:hmm3grin2orange:


And just to keep things straight the EPA is not just for Americans. We have exactly the same regulations over here its just called EU. So when EPAII starts very soon we will have EUII restrictions.

And about the green thing we use the same saying. Green means "fresh" or new.

 

[willt1981]

i sold a 575XP in '07 to an aussie. he bought it on ebay and paid over $100 in shipping. i was always kind of baffled by that but didnt ask any questions. im beginning to see why he might of bought it with all this b.s. going on from country to country. id get the 441 - especially if parts aren't an issue. on your fuel, id stay away from the fuel with ethanol. i run premium thats ethanol free in all my 2-strokes. thats 93 octane here.