Swing Booms on regular skidders???

[Slamm]

I'm thinking about getting a swing boom and putting it on my 540B cable skidder. Esco quit making the swing boom 5 years ago, and the guy at Esco stated that the new cost was over $50,000, is that why you don't see them very much or do they not work or what?

I think they are a great idea, and therefore I'm getting a used one for $2,000 to put on my cable skidder as the coming jobs for the next forseeable year are not going to require the extensive use of a dedicated cable skidder and if I am going to put a grapple type attachement on the back I wanted a "cool one", LOL.

The are primiarly used on the west coast and was wondering what you guys thought of them out there and why they didn't every "catch on" farther east ...... actually they are used on the East Coast as well, LOL, just not as much. No one around here has even heard of one and after I describe it they think its the best idea, then I tell them, that they don't make them anymore and we can't figure out why, LOL.

What are your thoughts,

Sam

 

[SWE#Kipp]

They seem to be popular in Germany with that setup,,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPfad8mP1CQ&feature=related

 

[380LGR]

Your 540B is way to short of a machine to put one on . You wont pull crap for wood with it either. They were made for steep gound where you couldnt move the machine around a lot on a side hill.

 

[Slamm]

Your 540B is way to short of a machine to put one on . You wont pull crap for wood with it either. They were made for steep gound where you couldnt move the machine around a lot on a side hill.

Have you tried one? or how do you know? What model skidders did you use the swing boom on and what size were the trees?

I called Esco and they couldn't give any specs on the swing boom like how much it could lift or how much it weighed and such????

Thanks,

Sam

 

[056kid]

I was going to give you an answer, but I thought Id wait for someone else to then agree with them sou you might heed the advice

your boom grapple is best suited for steep ground behind a 5, that's what they ran back home.
I don't know about how much they will handle, but I know they can do everything a regular esco 100'' can do. They come in handy on nasty ground where you need reach way down. . .

the PNW loggers would know more about this subject, I don't know where they are though. . . . .

 

[joesawer]

I have run one on a D5 hi drive and a single arch on a nearly identical tractor and I would not have one on a rubber tire machine.
A dozier cant articulate to move the grapple so it has some use but mostly it is a pain in the butt. Even on the cat most of the time it was a waste once you learn to place the tractor and slip the grapple.
I have never seen one anywhere small enough for a 540 JD but I have seen one on a 525 it worked for on a skid trail punched into the side of a mountain but it greatly reduced what it could skid.

 

[Slamm]

Thanks guys for the responses and opinion, but I'm going to give it a try, I have several ideas/reasons why I think I can make it work so for no more than what its was worth, I'm going to give it a whirl.

Well I got the boom after about 30 hours of driving.

It is currently attached to a Franklin 170 rearend. The seller, stated that he would cut it off for me, but the price was the same with or without the rearend and the rearend frame is nothing but very nice 1/2"+ metal that I can use for fabrication or scrap it.

At first without having my 540B next to it for comparison I thought it was going to be too big, but I unloaded it next to the 540B and it appears that it is just the right size, certainly wouldn't want it to be bigger. This attachment shouldn't provide much more or different forces than what we currently experience when sidelining with the cable or rearing the front off the ground when pulling a biggin from the back, but we will see.

I mostly wanted to try this attachment because, I do need the capability of a cable skidder, but not as much, with what I see as the next year's lineup of work which appears to be a rather large amount of work that is more bottoms and flatter than the hills that I am accustom too. So I want to convert my cable machine to a grapple machine, and this swing boom allows me to do that without loses the ease of operation of the winch cable, because I hate using the winch on the grapple machine as you can't see anything that is going on back there. At least with this swing boom you can get the grapple out of the way and see down your line better, without the cable having to scrape against the grapple the whole way.

If it causes the front to rear up too much as to not be practical, that may be "calmed" down with the addition of some 150-200 hp engines and other modd's that are going to be installed in both the 540B Grapple and this 540B Swing Boom, and a 518 CAT with grapple may be coming this way shortly and I would swap the grapple for this swing boom and a different 11' grapple, but will have to see. The CAT use way too much fuel as compared to Deere's in my opinion, but I can get the 518 for very cheap and it is very low hours.

Nothing is going to happen quick as we have a 650,000+ bdft job that both 540B's have to be on the next Monday and I am just going to send them in the "state" that they currently are, as this next job is a race to get the wood out before April 1st or there are very large fines for not having the job completed.

We'll see, thanks,

Sam

 

[Oldtimer]

I personally wouldn't want one on any machine smaller than a 640. Even then, the mechanical leverage it will have when drawn up with a big tree is enough to flip even a 640 over if you are not very careful.
As others have mentioned, it would work best on the back of a D5 or D6 hi-track. They would be a lot harder to flip over on a corner with a big twitch.

I have seen 540s with swing booms, but knowing how "tippy" the 540 can be...I don't think it'll be any where close to as useful as a dual arch would be.

For the money, time, and labor you'll have involved...I think you might be better off with another machine entirely, maybe a 648 D/A.

Just my opinion.

 

[Slamm]

I personally wouldn't want one on any machine smaller than a 640. Even then, the mechanical leverage it will have when drawn up with a big tree is enough to flip even a 640 over if you are not very careful.
As others have mentioned, it would work best on the back of a D5 or D6 hi-track. They would be a lot harder to flip over on a corner with a big twitch.

I have seen 540s with swing booms, but knowing how "tippy" the 540 can be...I don't think it'll be any where close to as useful as a dual arch would be.

For the money, time, and labor you'll have involved...I think you might be better off with another machine entirely, maybe a 648 D/A.

Just my opinion.

Yeah, might be right, but I'm going to try it. The straight away function between the dual arch and the swing boom will be about the same from the machines point of view. I understand that I won't be able to pick up the largest log from the farthest reach, but that is not what I'm looking for. For every 36" oak we cut, we cut 20 normal sized trees and I'm sure it won't have any problem with those. On the super large trees, I'll just have to get just as close to them as a single function grapple to lift it and then I'm not out anything.

So in summary on a majority of the normal/mid sized trees, I should be able to grab them from the extents of the boom's reach without much excitment, and on the larger stuff, its not going to be any different than a single action grapple, which means I can haul a 48" oak without too much trouble provided I get within reasonable reach of it, or the same as the single action grapple.

From my perspective, for $2k I got a grapple system that is very flexiable. It can do what a single action grapple can do, and it should still be of the same capacity at the closer ranges of the single/shorter single grapple. So I lose little/nothing and gain greater flexibility on the majority of timber that we skid, which is 200-400 bdft.

Thats what I'm shooting for anyways, LOL.

I love the 540B platform with 23x26 tires.

Sam

 

[380LGR]

Grapple skidders are all over the south for cheap!! You are going to have a fabrication nightmare...

 

[056kid]

Correct me if Im wrong, but your boom doesn't look like it is going to be doing much swinging..?

 

[380LGR]

I have a dual function 380C and i can winch with no problems. the sorting head thats on that is probably only about a 70 to maybe 85 inch head. You wount get much behind you. I have a 110 inch esco bunching grapple and thats not big enough!!

 

[Slamm]

Correct me if Im wrong, but your boom doesn't look like it is going to be doing much swinging..?

How do you want me to correct you?

Sam

 

[380LGR]

If you look at the bottom of the tube you will see the old rack style turning.

 

[Slamm]

I have a dual function 380C and i can winch with no problems. the sorting head thats on that is probably only about a 70 to maybe 85 inch head. You wount get much behind you. I have a 110 inch esco bunching grapple and thats not big enough!!

I didn't say I couldn't winch with the single function grapple, I said I don't like too. The grapple hangs down in the way slightly.

I have a 84" grapple on my 540B single function grapple and for our timber it works just fine.

The esco sorting head on the swing boom is suppose to be something like a 72" or something, which is perfect for one big tree or two medium trees.

I can also get one of those Esco 110" heads for free for this thing if I need it.

Thanks,

Sam

 

[380LGR]

Dont get me wrong im a sucker for a headache myself.. Why are you using a swing boom just to get away from the cable skidder?

 

[380LGR]

The reason for the small heads on the swing booms is so you cant over load them in a turn. It cant hold the hitch behind you.

 

[056kid]

How do you want me to correct you?

Sam

A start would be explaining weather the boom swings or not..

It looks like it is fixed & can only go north & south. .

 

[380LGR]

It pivots in the center almost like a backhoe. Follow that top cylinder down and everything turns sort of off of that.

 

[Slamm]

Dont get me wrong im a sucker for a headache myself.. Why are you using a swing boom just to get away from the cable skidder?

I like to use the cable skidder for staging logs in the woods for the grapple skidder/s.

This has worked very well on long skids or steep hills, but I can see that in the next 1.5 million bdft, I'm not going to be in steep hills enough to justify a dedicated cable machine, so I wanted something that would allow me to work the cable/synthetic rope without dragging it against the grapple hanging down, and also something that would allow this one machine to be more flexible if/when I do get into steeper stuff or more technical work. Obviously the swing boom has many advantages over the single or dual arch grapples.

I am partners in a machine/hydraulic/welding shop with everything from CNC mills and lathes to wire EDM so I can fab or do just about anything I want .......... and I want a smaller machine that is very flexible and powerful. The ingredients are here to do it, just have to put it together just right, will it pick up what a 648 can? No, but a 648 can't sneak through the woods as fast as I can either, and I can't put two 648's on one semi trailer and haul them for the same price. Also, the little 540B's are cheap and tough, after I get the 150+ engines in them the only weak point will be the rear axles and I have a fix for that too, but I will wait until I break a couple before I whip out that modd, LOL.

Sam