White Oak - Is this slime flux?

[defstar]

they look more like the first picture...

except a darker brown with a little more of a smoother exo-skeleton...which that could be because the photo was zoomed in...and i'm looking at my specimen with the naked eye...

i went to Texas A&M's University Entomology site as you advised...i didn't find an exact match with any of the beetle pictures...but did find a couple of ones that were pretty close...i also found that they recommend treating the area with a pesticide spray...which i have done...

they said the spraying maybe needed more than once if attacks reoccur...

so i guess i will keep an eye on it and keep treating the area...thanks everyone for your input...

i will post if anything drastic happens good or bad...

 

[JeffE]

Those are borer beetles of what exact type I do not know.
Go to a University Entomology site in your area and do a search on borer beetles..they have pics you can I.D.yours with.does it look like this magnified?
or the secod one?
Id' be willing to make a little wager here boys if you wanna put your money where your mouths are that the 1st pic is what he's got in his tree as well as the larve..
.we could work out something does not have to be money..respect would be a good payment also.

The first one is a weevil (looks like <i>Cryptorhynchus lapathi</i>, the poplar and willow borer), the second are <i>Ips</i> and <i>Dendroctonus</i> bark beetles (top looks like <i>D. frontalis</i> (edit: or maybe <i>D. ponderosae</i>), bottom looks like <i>I. calligraphus.</i> Both are pine bark beetles). None are potential culprits here.

I'll take that as a gentleman's bet. This is what I do for a living; I'm one of the people that folks take these samples to for ID.

 

[treeseer]

She, you'd best tread lightly around Jeff; he schooled me on a pine tree bug a while back...thanks again, Jeff!

def, yes, put your tax$ to work and gets those tamu dudes off their aspirations for the fat life of tenure!

 

[Sheshovel]

This is what I saw,I blew it up for him so it DOES Look like a borer compared to his pics.
Is that not true?
And what makes you so sure those are secondary pests and larva?
I mean besides the fact that you are a biologist and do this for a living?
and if you look at the pic of the two on their sides ,I think I see a boring "beak""mouth" on the top beetle.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

What kind of white oak is that?

For some reason, the images don't look like the bark of white oaks I've seen of the same approximate size - at least not in Oregon and Washington. I know there are several kinds, but do you know which one it is?

 

[Sheshovel]

That's what I was saying before,sure does not look like a White Oak to me either.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

I just found an Ohio based web site that showed a photo similar to yours for bark. It merely said "white oak". It almost has a flaky appearance.

 

[defstar]

m.d. vaden...i'm not sure what kind of white oak it is...but i do know it's a white oak...if you want to research it further...i live in texas near the houston area...you could check to see which types are common around here...

i have about 10 large/mature white oaks like this one on my property...this is the only one i have found with borers...

there are two other oaks...(i think they are red oaks...not sure though)...that have a borer hole near the base of the tree...but both are half the size of the one in discusion...and both have dry yellowing bark around them without the major water drainage...to me they look like older holes that have been there awhile...

i'm kind of at a loss with the borring i have found...is this typical stuff you find...or do i have a potential problem on my hands...

 

[JeffE]

This is what I saw,I blew it up for him so it DOES Look like a borer compared to his pics.
Is that not true?

No, from what I can make out it doesn't look like any boring beetle.

And what makes you so sure those are secondary pests and larva?
I mean besides the fact that you are a biologist and do this for a living?

The larvae were probably primary. The adult insects were not primary, for a few reasons:

First, they don't look like a boring beetle species, just based on the general outline, which appears flattish and round. I don't have a sense of the size, which would help.

Second, almost all trunk-boring beetles (including the ones you've posted) do most of their within-tree feeding as larvae, where (except for the ambrosia beetles, which are definitely not at work here) they first feed in the phloem. Then some species also go into the xylem, and then they pupate in separate chambers and emerge through the bark. Xylem-boring beetles (including buprestids, cerambycids, and some curculios) would not be hanging out together as adults in the same tunnel, and rush out when you spray something into the hole. That just doesn't fit with their life cycle.

Third, none of the species you posted pics of have oak as a potential host. The weevil hits willow and poplar (and sometime birch or alder), and the other two are pine bark beetles. This damage is typical of a carpenterworm or a similar lepidopteran borer.

and if you look at the pic of the two on their sides ,I think I see a boring "beak""mouth" on the top beetle.

I don't see it, but anyway there are many non-wood-boring weevil species. It's a big family (Curculionidae).

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Those look like secondary insects, most likely sap beetles, some speices of Nitidulid, to me. They can't chew into the tree, but are attracked to open wounds with sap flow.

http://www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo/pubs/howtos/ht_nitidulid/nitidulid.htm

 

[defstar]

for what it's worth...

the specimen i caught/took pictures of was about 3/16" long...

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Does it look like the beetle in my link? Does it have antenna with balls at the end?

 

[defstar]

he did have antennas...as for having balls on the ends i really can't say for sure...he was really small and it's been 2 days now since the pictures...so my memory is starting to get fuzzy...he did finally stop moving a couple hours after being sprayed...and the little b was disposed of shortly after...

he looks close to the Colopterus truncatus Randall or the Carpophilus sayi Parsons...but again i'm not putting my finger directly on either one...

i'll go back out again today for a check up...

 

[moss]

I just found an Ohio based web site that showed a photo similar to yours for bark. It merely said "white oak". It almost has a flaky appearance.

Visiting in Georgia recently I was fooled by white oak with very long flaky bark. It had a distinctly "shagbark" look to it. The white oaks in my area (Massachusetts) have smoother bark with a finer texture. It looks like a different variety than the southern white oaks, maybe it's regional variation.
-moss

 

[JeffE]

Those look like secondary insects, most likely sap beetles, some speices of Nitidulid, to me. They can't chew into the tree, but are attracked to open wounds with sap flow.

http://www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo/pubs/howtos/ht_nitidulid/nitidulid.htm

Seems like a very good possibility, Mike. I noticed the possibly clubbed antennae too (which would rule out roaches), but I wasn't sure enough that I was seeing it right. On one pic, it looked like there were no wing covers (elytra) and possibly reduced wings. (Edit: but looking at <i>Colopterus truncatus</i> might explain that).

 

[defstar]

hey guys...i stopped by the tree for a check up and all looks GREAT...

no more chewed bark buildup...the tree wasen't bleeding (no water drainage) anymore...the entire area inside the hole looked dry and clean...

i seen only two dead larvae and one more of those bugs that i had caught previously...and he was dead too...i brought him back to study...

i'm not posting a pic...(unless someone requests one)...my past pictures weren't that great...so i'm just describing him...he looks just like the bug from before except more of a black color...he does have two antenna's with ball like ends...as mike maas asked about above...

if the hole remains clean with no other attacks by saturday...i will be taking sheshovel's advice and filling the hole with foam...this is soly to protect against future attacks and i'm also hoping the tree will eventually grow around and cover the foam...providing a complete recovery and the best possible defense...

i will post updates on how the foaming goes...

i will also keep the specimen here for a little...if you guys have any specific questions concerning it...

 

[Sheshovel]

Does it have a long appendage for a mouth?

 

[Sheshovel]

JeffE,I certainly concede to you and your point is well taken

 

[defstar]

well the hole is now foamed and sealed...hopefully this will help block any future attacks...

thanks again to everyone who responded...

you guys helped me to protect my tree and learn a little at the same time...

unless something radical developes...guess we can consider this thread complete...

 

[Themadd1]

So what is the end result of this issue? Has anyone taken the time to finally identify this bug or the dealt with the issue at hand? I wonder if a mauget injection would be worth trying on this tree.