Why In Spanish?

[ropensaddle]

our forefathers entered this county by way of travel. Travelling to America in hopes of a better life is no different than what foreigners are doing now. If you go back far enough in your family tree you would see your roots are foreign as well. Only exception is the American Indians. Every other race traveled to America at one time. Why should we deny those that wish to LEGALLY enter, the chance that was once provided for our ancestors?

LXT, I am all for getting those who enter illegally out, but if they go by the rules and pay taxes just like everyone else why should they be denied a better life just because they are "mexican"? That my friends is prejudice.

Big difference, we conquered this nation we did not have it handed to
us go home remember the Alamo. Ok I reread your post
legals no problem except we should limit the amount and
they need to speak English but we had to fight and conquer
this land it was not provided as you call it.

 

[John464]

Ok I reread your post
legals no problem except we should limit the amount and
they need to speak English but we had to fight and conquer
this land it was not provided as you call it.

Ok, we agree.

 

[coydog]

Many immigrants that built this country never learned English as fluently as their their native language and many never learned it at all, but they died as American as anyone. It's the second and third generations that grow up with English as their first language that have no trouble speaking and reading it. Lots of Spanish speaking workers here legally would not be able to absorb the training materials let alone pass the arborist exam if it was not available in Spanish, not to mention the invaluable resource to have training material available in both Spanish and English to create a better opportunity to read and write in English. The fact is that America was ,is,and will be shaped by immigrants. Immigants are not un-american. To say that we conquered this nation and did not have it handed to us only displays xenophobic ignorance. America is the land of opportunity. Who do you refer to? Custer? The Trail of Tears? My grandfather signed the Texas Declaration of Independence and fought along side Cherokee indians as well as those that died at the Alamo. I'm proud of that heritage and your post sickens me, you don't deserve to invoke the name of the Alamo, because the philosophy you preach is more akin to that of the mentally challenged national socialist biker gang "The Black Widows " forever chasing Clint Eastwoods character Philo Beddo than anything represented in the US Constitution, "right turn Clyde!"

 

[DonnyO]

Oh yeah I almost forgot...........this thread will be OUT OF CONTROL by the end of page two. opcorn:

can I borrow your crystal ball?

 

[ropensaddle]

Many immigrants that built this country never learned English as fluently as their their native language and many never learned it at all, but they died as American as anyone. It's the second and third generations that grow up with English as their first language that have no trouble speaking and reading it. Lots of Spanish speaking workers here legally would not be able to absorb the training materials let alone pass the arborist exam if it was not available in Spanish, not to mention the invaluable resource to have training material available in both Spanish and English to create a better opportunity to read and write in English. The fact is that America was ,is,and will be shaped by immigrants. Immigants are not un-american. To say that we conquered this nation and did not have it handed to us only displays xenophobic ignorance. America is the land of opportunity. Who do you refer to? Custer? The Trail of Tears? My grandfather signed the Texas Declaration of Independence and fought along side Cherokee indians as well as those that died at the Alamo. I'm proud of that heritage and your post sickens me, you don't deserve to invoke the name of the Alamo, because the philosophy you preach is more akin to that of the mentally challenged national socialist biker gang "The Black Widows " forever chasing Clint Eastwoods character Philo Beddo than anything represented in the US Constitution, "right turn Clyde!"

First off wtf you do not know me or anything about my
heritage. My philosophy is invoked on fact current fact
and fact is they are hurting my legal business so I don't
give one cent if you feel I don't deserve to speak of a
subject I learned in Texas history class! I am more of
the old there pard are ya gonna pull them pistol's boy
or whistle dixie!

 

[juststumps]

i didn't want to get involved with this,,, but really,,, who are you going to hire?????

i don't know about where the rest of you live,,, but here in this area of NJ,,, kids don't want to work,,, they don't want to learn a trade,,they are to busy playing sports and getting ready to go to college... and i forgot the wii,,,, x-box, sega, and texting on the cell phone.....

in the home of the average $500,000 home price,,, i don't see a lot of people banging down the door at my employer ,,to do tree work !!!!!!

99 % of them never cut the lawn,,,know what to do with a screwdriver,,, etc!!!!!!

at the tavern, i heard one of the young servers,, #####ing about some of the other girls having new cars,,, saying how she was oppressed because her parents only gave her a 1991 MERCEDES to drive......this is a 17yr old !!!

when i was 17,, i alredy cut the grass,, knew not to hit myself in the hand with a hammer,,, etc !!! worked since i was 14,,real job,, did chore for as long as i can remember!!! saved for my own car,,, and couldn't drive it till i bought my own insurance....

that was over 30 years ago,,,,

company i work for is 100% legal,, but we lose a few guys every year....we replace 1 for every 2 we lose...

the labor pool is severly depleted as for who is availible to work...willing to work !!! to do manual labor...and legal !!!!!

maybe it is not that bad where you are at.... but it is here....

like i said,,,, who are you going to hire ??? it's going to get to the point where you are going to fill postions,, or go out of biz !!

 

[(WLL)]

Many immigrants that built this country never learned English as fluently as their their native language and many never learned it at all, but they died as American as anyone. It's the second and third generations that grow up with English as their first language that have no trouble speaking and reading it. Lots of Spanish speaking workers here legally would not be able to absorb the training materials let alone pass the arborist exam if it was not available in Spanish, not to mention the invaluable resource to have training material available in both Spanish and English to create a better opportunity to read and write in English. The fact is that America was ,is,and will be shaped by immigrants. Immigants are not un-american. To say that we conquered this nation and did not have it handed to us only displays xenophobic ignorance. America is the land of opportunity. Who do you refer to? Custer? The Trail of Tears? My grandfather signed the Texas Declaration of Independence and fought along side Cherokee indians as well as those that died at the Alamo. I'm proud of that heritage and your post sickens me, you don't deserve to invoke the name of the Alamo, because the philosophy you preach is more akin to that of the mentally challenged national socialist biker gang "The Black Widows " forever chasing Clint Eastwoods character Philo Beddo than anything represented in the US Constitution, "right turn Clyde!"

if thay cant build there own country up how they gonna help build ours?

 

[ropensaddle]

i didn't want to get involved with this,,, but really,,, who are you going to hire?????

i don't know about where the rest of you live,,, but here in this area of NJ,,, kids don't want to work,,, they don't want to learn a trade,,they are to busy playing sports and getting ready to go to college... and i forgot the wii,,,, x-box, sega, and texting on the cell phone.....

in the home of the average $500,000 home price,,, i don't see a lot of people banging down the door at my employer ,,to do tree work !!!!!!

99 % of them never cut the lawn,,,know what to do with a screwdriver,,, etc!!!!!!

at the tavern, i heard one of the young servers,, #####ing about some of the other girls having new cars,,, saying how she was oppressed because her parents only gave her a 1991 MERCEDES to drive......this is a 17yr old !!!

when i was 17,, i alredy cut the grass,, knew not to hit myself in the hand with a hammer,,, etc !!! worked since i was 14,,real job,, did chore for as long as i can remember!!! saved for my own car,,, and couldn't drive it till i bought my own insurance....

that was over 30 years ago,,,,

company i work for is 100% legal,, but we lose a few guys every year....we replace 1 for every 2 we lose...

the labor pool is severly depleted as for who is availible to work...willing to work !!! to do manual labor...and legal !!!!!

maybe it is not that bad where you are at.... but it is here....

like i said,,,, who are you going to hire ??? it's going to get to the point where you are going to fill postions,, or go out of biz !!

Yeah have heard that argument too and though it may
have merit if the labor price was not turned to **** by
illegal underbidding maybe the kids would see a future
in working with hands! That is more a parenting issue
as by the time I was 16 I had hauled hay detassled corn
moved grass and scooped ****.

 

[juststumps]

Yeah have heard that argument too and though it may
have merit if the labor price was not turned to **** by
illegal underbidding maybe the kids would see a future
in working with hands! That is more a parenting issue
as by the time I was 16 I had hauled hay detassled corn
moved grass and scooped ****.

it's not that,,, around here,,,mommie and daddie are pulling in excess of $150,000 per year,,, and thats on the low end.. kids don't have to work any more....

its the " I'M GOING TO GIVE THE KIDS, THE THINGS I NEVER HAD" thing !!!

the kids that are willing to work,, or have to work,, are like "i can drag brush for $10/ hr... or i can work at McDonalds for the same money,, my friends can cruise by,, and i can keep my feet dry, in a heated building,,, before i go to college...

look at any 7-11 type store,, or gas station... you don't see teenagers working at most of them !! or home depot, or lowes ...

 

[juststumps]

#####

 

[OTG BOSTON]

I think illegal immigrants should be gone!

I work with many immigrants from Guatemala. They are GREAT workers and AWEOME people! They came here, paid thier dues, work hard, pay taxes, and speak and CONTINUE to LEARN the ENGLISH language. Great in my book!

As for unions......hahahahahahaha!! I was in a Union for 3 years. I was on the E Board, I was the safety supervisor for 3000+ employees.
I came from a PRODUCTION contractor, and made my way into the utility union. Utility unoins are not for me, or any other balls to the wall workers. Its just not my cup of tea. Sure there were times we worked hard, and definately knew we earned a check, but they were few and far between.

Are unions good for america? Sure I think they have to be patrolled/governed better, just like our borders.

Well Jim, you were right about this thread getting out of control. Lets see if we can't get it back on track
Your statement above doesn't answer the question originally posed by lxt. reading between the lines, I would say that you would appreciate arboriculture texts in spanish to help train your amigos. Si'?

I was going to let the "balls to the wall workers" comment go, but its not in my nature. You know my guys and I work hard, train hard, play hard. Just imagine TREE GUYS with real standards and rules. I'm not saying it would be perfect, just better than the way it seems to be going right now...........

 

[diltree]

I think there should be a Union for Line Clearance, and municipal tree trimmers, those guys only get paid $16.88 per hr. and work around the wires all day...they need a union to get the prevailing wage up!

 

[ropensaddle]

I think there should be a Union for Line Clearance, and municipal tree trimmers, those guys only get paid $16.88 per hr. and work around the wires all day...they need a union to get the prevailing wage up!

Is that what it is there I had twenty years and quit at 15.10
as a danger tree and new row expert! Unions are only as good
as their rep and he needs to be a bad azz.

 

[lxt]

if thay cant build there own country up how they gonna help build ours?

EXACTLY!! some on here want to defend them because they hire them!!! Legal fine but speak english!! Sorry, spanish is not needed if they are here legally.....for education & training purposes please!!! how do you come here legally if you cant read, write or speak english? maybe we should have them legals watch "are you smarter than a 5th grader" then they will atleast know whats going on!!

John Im not prejudice against anyone, I just dont feel that a sect of people who come here anyway they want legal/illegal/work visa, etc... should dictate that americas 2nd language needs to be spanish just so WE can communicate with them!!

who ya gonna hire? good question kids today are lazier than ever, parents fault, but......today also demands a larger wage, I use to mow what seemed to be a 1/2 acre for $10 now you couldnt mow that lot for $100.00 If your starting the 18-20yr old out at $10hr you are gonna loose them especially in this trade, I start my men off groundwork only $12hr & had to raise that.

Kids today can go to Best Buy, target, American Eagle, Subway, etc... & start off at $9.00 why would they want to sweat their Azzes off draggin sticks for $10 an hr, this is the problem, its not like when we were their age work hard & succeed, they have seen how the corporate/business world today works, some of there parents loosing 401k`s, no health care, etc... they are not gonna be loyal to any company unless you pay em!! & I dont blame them, the days were you work the same job 30+yrs & retire with the ability to do ok are gone & these kids know it!!! So some of you think the answer is our spanish speaking counterparts......WRONG!!

LXT...........

 

[BostonBull]

Well Jim, you were right about this thread getting out of control. Lets see if we can't get it back on track
Your statement above doesn't answer the question originally posed by lxt. reading between the lines, I would say that you would appreciate arboriculture texts in spanish to help train your amigos. Si'?

I was going to let the "balls to the wall workers" comment go, but its not in my nature. You know my guys and I work hard, train hard, play hard. Just imagine TREE GUYS with real standards and rules. I'm not saying it would be perfect, just better than the way it seems to be going right now...........

This is where the true conservative in me comes out......Screw em!
learn english and then come back to get a job. I think we should have text in Spanish for the co.s that refuse to hire ENGLISH speaking employees. But as for my true feelings, NO, english only for training manuals. All of our "amigos" speak english well enough to understand what we need of them, how to SAFELY do it, and communicate back with any questions. They are no Jay Severin, one of the most well spoken people I have ever heard, but they are fluent. They also pride themselves on learning. They all have spent HUGE money on rosetta Stone books/courses for English, and they also read all safteymanuals we give them and enjoy/participate in the TCIA tailgate meetings we have.

As for unions yes their are hard workers in every union. I speak from my experience only. The utility unions in Boston, NSTAR, are full of lazy cry babies! Contractor unions, different ball game.

ROW, Line Clearnace guys should be MANDATORY Union. Not for the wages, thats just greedy, but for the training aspect. I have worked for both sides of utilities, and the training the unions push for and get in their contracts is second to none!


I hope this answers the questions................

 

[Thillmaine]

Ditto

I feel the same way as BostoinBull. This isnt a spanish speaking country. We didnt go to mexico and expect signs to be in english. It is what it is. Enough witht he hating on the younger generation. I am 22, pay all my own bills, paid for my college, work hard, am not dishonest, and enjoy working for what I have. Dont get me wrong, I have friends in Jersey that are the same way as juststumps is speaking of. Keep in mind there are still useful workers among our younger generation, although the numbers are dwindling.

 

[DonnyO]

. The utility unions in Boston, NSTAR, are full of lazy cry babies! Contractor unions, different ball game.
................

National Grid now controls the utilities in Boston....haven't you driven by the gas tanks lately?

 

[BostonBull]

National Grid now controls the utilities in Boston....haven't you driven by the gas tanks lately?

They control the Natty Gas, that Keyspan used to have. not the electric or the old Boston gas.....NStar still controls these two. they are the biggest utility in MA, customers and revenue wise! And they only cover from Boston to the cape!

 

[John464]

They also pride themselves on learning. They all have spent HUGE money on rosetta Stone books/courses for English

yup. my guys all have DVD's, books, and tapes to better themselves in the English language, even if they know and understand every question their superiors ask them except a few who have spanish speaking superiors. I watch these guys learn our language. They want to learn the Ameican language and continue to educate themselves in achieving fluency. The TCIA, ISA, Bandit Industries, Vermeer, etc do not expect us to learn spanish, but it helps if we do and is safer that way. That is the bottomline and the answer to your questions LXT.

You do not have to learn spanish, nobody is forcing you to. However, when the time comes that you need a good helper and the only guys visting your office willing and ready to work you may be a diservice to yourself if you do not know atleast some spanish. You can never have too much knowledge.

If If run out of Mexican help and Asians start wanting to work Ill be learning Chinese. haha j/k

 

[oldirty]

wow this is a goooood thread.

any of you guys ever been to lawrence mass? from the way it was (of course i wasnt around then but the stories i've heard about it) and the way it is now is pretty gross.


back then when you floated in on your boat you made an effort to better you and your family from the get go. you took pride in your neighborhood and looked out for one another. sure where you lived might not be the ritz but people made the most of what they had and didnt really ask for anything but a chance.

now when "they" show up they think they are entitled to something for nothing. as much as i hate to reference the poem but WLL's poetry is almost right on.

again i say look to lawrence. they just built a multimillion dollar school (supposedly the best school built in recent memory) that i can garauntee will be a dump in a fews years if not a couple.

now heres the Q. am i racist? no. but i do love a good sterotype and how do we end up with a sterotype? by people continuing to meet those standards. time and time again.


someone else said something about pay. how you gonna get a white kid outta bed for 10$anhr? the same kid who can sit and play PS3 allday and eat all he wants for nothing at home knowing damn well he can ask his mom for beer and weed money and get it. i know that little prick isnt worth 5 bucks an hour but what you gonna do?
thats the question.

and from what i am hearing from the higher up at work some of the homeowners are actually asking who is going to be showing up to do the work. they want to know if a pickup full of can's are going to show up to do the work or a will a couple of "americans" be there. i guess that might be the new way to push your company. "when you contract me to work for you , i will be bringing the white guys!" lol

for real though, how are we going to remedy this situation?

i have no problem with instant deportation because i am thinking that it would be cheaper to fly em back to wherever they came from than putting them on the system's back like so many many idiots want to.

and this may seem harsh but the guns every few yards pointing into mexico and Canada might be a safe bet and a whole lot more cost effective. from what i understand bullets are pretty cheap.

well compared to the 101 work days a year that i have to give to uncle sam.

you believe that? 101 days a year you dont get to call your own? ouch. that sucks.


oldirty