No, that's a fact!! LOL
if you looked in my shop you see my 660 wearing a 20" right now
Don't have money for a 32"+ bar.
Why run a short bar on a work saw?
- Thread starter bitzer
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No, that's a fact!! LOL
if you looked in my shop you see my 660 wearing a 20" right now
Don't have money for a 32"+ bar.
bitzer
******** Timber Expert
I am East of the Missisip and I'm cuttin hardwood. The replys here have got me thinkin to run some tests on cutting times between hard and softwood. I have felled some softwoods lately and I could get together a fair sample of both. I'd have to have video tho and a witness to make it legit and I just don't have the time. I know that softwood cutting is going to be faster, but really by how much? The hardwoods I am cutting are Elm, Ash, Oak, Hickory, Maple, Basswood, Boxelder. The few softwoods I dropped recently, Engelman and Sitka spruce, Red and White pine. It would be interesting to know. I mean if your cutting hickory and then white pine sure its going to be a lot, but if your cutting basswood and spruce I dont know. I don't know that the needs are so different and I think reach is more important in hardwoods with further spread crowns. Altough I'm sure short bars on 70+cc saws are fun to run in the right situations!
bitzer
******** Timber Expert
I still need to scrape me some cash together to get me one!
bitzer
******** Timber Expert
That is what I was lookin for. Something to do with old timers or the way it used to be. I don't remeber on what thread, but a guy in production hardwood falling in the east said he switched to longer bars and most guys look at him sideways, but he said in the end they are safer and actually produce more.
My 385XP runs a 24" for most jobs. When I'm bucking, I like a 20" because of weight/balance. In my mind, there is little power "feel" difference between the 20" or the 24" bars.
JQ
JQ
clearance
Addicted to ArboristSite
Long bars are better suited to big timber and grunty saws. 288's, 066's 395's - all fine with 24" 28"+ bars.
Long bars on the smaller saws make for a nose-heavy balance, use more gas, are clumsier, flexier and heavier which means less agility and less control/maneuverability. They're forever hittin' the dirt, and you're forever heaving on the saw. Working in the scrub and on the hills, over length bars are a damn nuisance
My 70+cc saws have 28" bars, my 394 has a 30", my 395 a 32" Very rarely do they hit the dirt. Ya'll must have scrawny arms if you can't keep it out of the dirt. Like others have said (PNW guys, of course), long bars have thier place, and you can't walk a log and limb with a tiny bar, unles you're a midget.
Hitting the dirt, hehe, try dropping a few hundred 18" trees on the side of a hill with a 28" bar for the day - then come see me...
Well, the fallers out here don't use a 28" bar for the 18 inchers, they generally have a 32" bar. Once again, the reasoning is STEEP ground, SNAGS on steep ground that are old growth sized and must come down, LIMBING while walking the tree, and being able to STAND BACK when bucking a tension loaded log.
Our ground can be so steep, that in the old days, one never checked the cutting in the middle, you walked the edge and checked. The logs would start to roll on their own and that created a chain reaction. High stumps didn't always hold it. This is an old photo showing the flatter part of the unit.
The ground below the yarder was steeper, and had shifting, rolling logs on it.
But we're out here. I've worked in the Midwest, and your steep ground is what we consider flat. It is a different world "out West" and to each it's own.
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Tzed250
Addicted to ArboristSite
I'll run the shortest bar I can get away with. Unfortunately, that's usually a 36". 
What Slowp said about OG sized snags and staying back from your work was spot on. If a few ounces of bar weight are that big a deal you might want to start a strength building program of some kind.
What Slowp said about OG sized snags and staying back from your work was spot on. If a few ounces of bar weight are that big a deal you might want to start a strength building program of some kind.
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RandyMac
Stiff Member
Yep, Bob, the shortest you can get away with. I spent a lot of time running 48" or better, but more time with 28" or 36" bars.
These are my general purpose saws.
Modified Mac 250, 18" bar, 3/8" chain, set-up for 20-24 inch Alders and Spruce.
Super 250, 28", 404, I can cut anything with this.
These are my general purpose saws.
Modified Mac 250, 18" bar, 3/8" chain, set-up for 20-24 inch Alders and Spruce.
Super 250, 28", 404, I can cut anything with this.
bitzer
******** Timber Expert
My 70+cc saws have 28" bars, my 394 has a 30", my 395 a 32" Very rarely do they hit the dirt. Ya'll must have scrawny arms if you can't keep it out of the dirt. Like others have said (PNW guys, of course), long bars have thier place, and you can't walk a log and limb with a tiny bar, unles you're a midget.
I'll agree with that and I'm not a PNW guy and never have been. Born and raised in Wisconsin! Once you've run longer bars you figure out how to keep em out of the dirt and how to work em.
bitzer
******** Timber Expert
I agree with different conditions different tools, I just prefer a longer bar 25"-28" for most of my hardwood work. In the German video are you talking about the bore cutting of the tree or the limbing afterward? The boring could be done easily and faster with a longer bar and from one side. I've never seen anyone rub their saw all over a tree when limbing like that and I still think a longer bar would be faster once you've done that a lot. I notice he is grabbing branches and throwing them out of the way to clear his path. With a longer bar you don't need to do that as much.
Tzed250
Addicted to ArboristSite
The video is actually Swedish. That is the Scandinavian method of softwood harvest. That guy is ok, but I have seen much quicker, and the short bar with a 14,000rpm saw is the key. Some of the stems there have hundreds of limbs on them, so "rubbing" the saw is the best method. The long bar is ok to bore with as long as you don't have a back leaner, then it becomes a liability.
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bitzer
******** Timber Expert
I had the sound down and the kids are running around so I didn't pay attention too much to any written words. I get what your saying. I've dropped lots of back leaners and havent had a problem I just leave enough strap. I'd rather cut the back strap with a longer bar too because I'm that much farther away. Maybe I'm missing your meaning on the liability.
Tzed250
Addicted to ArboristSite
It is easier to be more accurate with the tip of the bar in that small wood. If you are cutting 12-14" softwoods there is not much need in a 24" bar, You will be limbing on the ground, so the reach needed when walking the log is not needed. The trees are much smaller in Scandinavia, and the loggers are used to being up close and personal with them. They have been doing it that way for over 20 years.
smokechase II
Addicted to ArboristSite
Compensation
Long bars are more expensive, weigh more and also provide more chain to sharpen.
I wouldn't use anything else but a 32+ incher
They provide safety.
Further from finishing the buck.
Can make all your cuts from just one side of the tree. Possibly avoiding the danger side or allowing a tree to be cut on slope without springboards.
Less back stress.
They are faster on bigger timber. Provided you have a saw to handle whatever wood.
Having to match cuts takes time and concentration. Taking away from vertical situational awareness.
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If you're cutting small second growth softwoods in a higher latitude, think small. Good choice.
Don't even suspect for a minute that works everywhere.
Long bars are more expensive, weigh more and also provide more chain to sharpen.
I wouldn't use anything else but a 32+ incher
They provide safety.
Further from finishing the buck.
Can make all your cuts from just one side of the tree. Possibly avoiding the danger side or allowing a tree to be cut on slope without springboards.
Less back stress.
They are faster on bigger timber. Provided you have a saw to handle whatever wood.
Having to match cuts takes time and concentration. Taking away from vertical situational awareness.
=========
If you're cutting small second growth softwoods in a higher latitude, think small. Good choice.
Don't even suspect for a minute that works everywhere.
