i was amazed to see how powerful they are these days. .500 air guns! and go hunting elk and bear with them, too.....
Scrounging Firewood (and other stuff)
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freeasaburt
ArboristSite Operative
Yeah development has been crazy, even though these high cal airguns were made for quite some time already (custom work, and the Koreans, who use them for hunting, were early on the market with those things too).
I've seen quite some footage of these soft (pure lead) projectiles going straight through a hog or deer.
In a lot of European countries there's quite severe power regulations, so there's a strong focus on accuracy here (Field Target and Hunter Field Target competitions, sub 12 ft lbs, as well as 100m benchrest competitions long before 'Extreme Benchrest' and other competitions started in the States). Luckily, at least for the time being, laws in Belgiums and the Netherlands are quite lenient.
There's also semi and full auto variants now... and development of 'solids' (as opposed to diabolo shaped pellets) has been really succesfull.
They are usually quite expensive to buy, especially the quality ones, but cost per shot is almost nothing... Although pellet/solid prices have been increasing, just like all the rest.
I've seen quite some footage of these soft (pure lead) projectiles going straight through a hog or deer.
In a lot of European countries there's quite severe power regulations, so there's a strong focus on accuracy here (Field Target and Hunter Field Target competitions, sub 12 ft lbs, as well as 100m benchrest competitions long before 'Extreme Benchrest' and other competitions started in the States). Luckily, at least for the time being, laws in Belgiums and the Netherlands are quite lenient.
There's also semi and full auto variants now... and development of 'solids' (as opposed to diabolo shaped pellets) has been really succesfull.
They are usually quite expensive to buy, especially the quality ones, but cost per shot is almost nothing... Although pellet/solid prices have been increasing, just like all the rest.
(and stuff)
The Shooters Apprentice
Addicted to ArboristSite
Lewis and Clark carried a air rifle on their expedition.
WoodAbuser
aka WoodchuckAbuser
They were loaned to them from Thomas Jefferson and were full auto!
Sierra_rider
Piss revver
I think the first successful repeating rifles were air rifles...back in the 1700's.
https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2019/09/the-girardoni-repeating-air-rifle-of-1780/
https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2019/09/the-girardoni-repeating-air-rifle-of-1780/
Yes, there was ONE air rifle on the Lewis + Clark expedition, and it was a repeater (not a semi-auto).
It was reported that each time they encountered a new tribe of Indians they would provide a demonstration with this gun. The Indians, then thinking that each member of the expedition had one of these guns never confronted them.
I believe it was also used to help thwart a Grizzly bear attack when a few rounds from the muzzleloaders did not immediately stop it.
It was reported that each time they encountered a new tribe of Indians they would provide a demonstration with this gun. The Indians, then thinking that each member of the expedition had one of these guns never confronted them.
I believe it was also used to help thwart a Grizzly bear attack when a few rounds from the muzzleloaders did not immediately stop it.
WoodAbuser
aka WoodchuckAbuser
Pretty sure if you do more research you will find it would fire all 20 rounds with one trigger pull or individual rounds.
freeasaburt
ArboristSite Operative
As the linked article also mentions, they were also used in a military context, by the Austrians. Pretty relevant back in the day as black powder rifles gave away your shooting location...
With air rifles, it's quite hard to get ánd keep projectiles supersonic. Once the projectiles go below the speed of sound, they have a tendency to start swirling/spiraling, which obviously is no good. To reach sufficient power levels, the only thing one can do is increase the caliber. Thats why (or at least I think so) the Girandoni air rifle was .46 cal.
Pretty neat how they were able to build a tank for compressed air back in the day. Using it as a buttstock is still done today, by some brands; even though some people find it unnerving to put their cheek on a (nowadays) 200 bar/2900 psi tank, the design clearly had advantages. If you put the tank under the barrel, the air has to make a 180° turn, which causes turbulence, decreasing efficiency.
They used a manual air pump, which are also still sold today, although most people switch to a scuba tank. Pumping a reservoir to 200 bar is no joke, and being out of breath when you wanna take a shot doesn't work too well...
Figured I'd share my score with the group, 30 bucks for a 25 foot reel of stens sabre titanium chain w/tie straps and boxes delivered prime. This is the chain tractor supply sells as their titanium line, its not stihl but its still pretty good stuff. I went back for a second roll but its sold out, they have other sizes I do not use but I figured others in here might want to take advantage of these prices including 404 .063 for 55 bucks. I'll post links to the ads below.
1) Pretty sure if you check the article, you will see they say one shot every 3 seconds. Very impressive for its day (w/20 shots), but not a semi-auto.
2) I have a Beeman Marauder high pressure .22 cal pellet gun. I have several 10 shot snail clips for it, and I think it will shoot about 20 before re-pressurizing. It is a bolt action, but is more powerful than any of my nematic air guns. I pump it up with a very high-pressure pump that looks like a bicycle pump, but I understand that scuba pumps will do it much faster.
2) I have a Beeman Marauder high pressure .22 cal pellet gun. I have several 10 shot snail clips for it, and I think it will shoot about 20 before re-pressurizing. It is a bolt action, but is more powerful than any of my nematic air guns. I pump it up with a very high-pressure pump that looks like a bicycle pump, but I understand that scuba pumps will do it much faster.
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-098-72...14-99dc-1c3312d2bf2d&pd_rd_i=B09H7K6D6G&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-092-82...14-99dc-1c3312d2bf2d&pd_rd_i=B09H7L4CXX&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-090-52...1246&sprefix=stens+chain+reel,aps,183&sr=8-10
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-089-52...mzn1.fos.006c50ae-5d4c-4777-9bc0-4513d670b6bc
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-092-82...14-99dc-1c3312d2bf2d&pd_rd_i=B09H7L4CXX&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-090-52...1246&sprefix=stens+chain+reel,aps,183&sr=8-10
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-089-52...mzn1.fos.006c50ae-5d4c-4777-9bc0-4513d670b6bc
You can also simply type in "stens chain reel" in their search tab and look at each ad, the adds list the size/pitch and here is the stens web site to verify the part# to pitch/cutter/link type. for 30-50 bucks for 25 feet I can live with bumper links LOL
https://www.stens.com/search?keywords=titanium reel
https://www.stens.com/search?keywords=titanium reel
Well, I put on my knee brace and a grimace and put up a few loads. Pine that mostly has been halved or quartered will work well this week for the moderate temps. Actually wasn't that bad, but my knee is talking to me a little now. Most wheelbarrow loads I've done in 5 months. 
Well done H!
Yep UK classes an air rifle with more than 12 ft lbs power as a firearm requiring a certificate to own, that then comes with a great deal of restrictions, gun safes, separate ammunition storage, regular checks on this, etc. Even sub 12 ft lbs I can't get my squirrel enemy as it's an offence to let a pellet go beyond my property and the squirrels sit on my fence eating the paracord that I tied my tarps on to my wood pile with. Currently half my stack is uncovered and getting rained on while the tarp is in a heap beside it. I'm going to try wire instead of paracord but they can eat through that too if they want to. Really rather want an air powered squirrel despatcher but it's not worth the huge hassle it would likely bring.
freeasaburt
ArboristSite Operative
Here in Belgium, there's no power restrictions (except for 'short air guns', not gonna get into that now); (H)FT is below 12 because it comes from the UK, originally.
Any kind of 'pest control' is illegal though, unless you have a hunting permit. You also can't be visible from a public road having an airgun in your hands, and your projectiles can't leave the property you are shooting at.
With the ever more stringent regulations on rat poison, there's probably gonna be a need for more pest control. This is actually already happening in the Netherlands, with air rifles, they have dedicated permits for that there.
We went a bit off topic here... Maybe better to discuss it elsewhere?
Any kind of 'pest control' is illegal though, unless you have a hunting permit. You also can't be visible from a public road having an airgun in your hands, and your projectiles can't leave the property you are shooting at.
With the ever more stringent regulations on rat poison, there's probably gonna be a need for more pest control. This is actually already happening in the Netherlands, with air rifles, they have dedicated permits for that there.
We went a bit off topic here... Maybe better to discuss it elsewhere?
Well we saw a deer anyhow. Doe walked out at 11:15, looking behind her. Nothing else came out though.
Guns and hunting are regular topics here.
Your laws are very similar to ours.... Can't use withing 50ft of the centre of a public road in a way likely to cause injury or distraction.... Can't use on any property without permission, can't let the pellet go off the property, can't have one in public without for reason (basically taking one to or from a gun club), can dispatch certain vermin but not others. Rules on vermin are odd. Iirc I couldn't legally kill a fox. I could trap it, but if I did I can't release it. What on earth are you supposed to do with it? Befriend it?!
IFA 'short air gun' is a pistol, the law restricts these to 6 lb ft.
Your laws are very similar to ours.... Can't use withing 50ft of the centre of a public road in a way likely to cause injury or distraction.... Can't use on any property without permission, can't let the pellet go off the property, can't have one in public without for reason (basically taking one to or from a gun club), can dispatch certain vermin but not others. Rules on vermin are odd. Iirc I couldn't legally kill a fox. I could trap it, but if I did I can't release it. What on earth are you supposed to do with it? Befriend it?!
IFA 'short air gun' is a pistol, the law restricts these to 6 lb ft.
Sawyer Rob
Addicted to ArboristSite
Now you know why we kicked the "redcoats" azz's into Canada, and now THEY have stupid gun laws too!!
SR
freeasaburt
ArboristSite Operative
Problem here is that most gun laws concern firearms (so called 'non-firearms' like airguns and crossbows are basically free to obtain if you're above 18). There's vague areas. I had a long conversation via email with the 'Federal Gun Service' (Federale Wapendienst) about these, and it's a bit of a mess. There's also a lot of interpretation, some of which is simply false.
Take silencers, for example. Completely forbidden for any kind of firearm. Silencers for (powerful) airguns are very useful, and not strictly forbidden. There is, however, no legal distinction between the two, nor criteria, so in case one would be seized from you, it would be up to you/your counsel to prove it can't be used on a firearm. Which is not only legally, but also purely technically a hard/complicated thing to do...
Regulations for short airguns, the criteria that is, are also a mess but it's basically about the possibility of concealement... Power limit is 7,5 joules, which is about the same as your limit.
Afaik, the governments of The Netherlands and Belgium want to update their airgun laws, but wait for a new European directive, I suppose there is a desire to make the regulation the same throughout Europe. Which most probably means it's all gonna get worse...
