346XP:ing the 2149 Turbo?! Project outline. Carb question.

[L.R.]

After many long nights searching this forum, I have come up with a cunning plan. Most people seem to agree that the Husky 346XP is a great saw, and the Jonsered 2149 T is at least a decent 50cc saw (well, 49...), the real difference being that the power band is more forgiving on the latter. Of course, most of us lust for bigger and burlier saws, but I've been thinking maybe I should move in the other direction - less cubes, more power.

Looking at the IPLs for these saws (both from 2001 and the 2149 matching my saw), 90% of parts are the same, noticeable exceptions being the plastic, naturally. Non cosmetic parts that differ are, as far as I'm able to tell; piston+cylinder, carburetor and muffler. Intake, crankshaft, gaskets, everything else is the same.

The plan, obviously, is ordering the above 346XP parts from my husky dealer, dropping them in the 2149 and all of a sudden I'll have a completely different saw. Two-in-one, actually, since I'll still have the old parts. A new 346XP would run me in the vicinity of $1000, I can't imagine the parts will add up to that, even here in Sweden. Muffler would be non-cat, carbs non-epa. All in all, provided everything is available, a simple bolt-on job I figure.

This project would mostly be for my own enjoyment. I like the feel of the straight Jonsered handle better than the angled Husky and the saw will be my "learning saw", but why not learn some chainsaw mechanics while I'm at it? The saw looks brand new, hasn't been used much, and so is worth spending some cash on. Worst case, I'm sure I could sell off the parts fairly easily. Compared to working on cars and bikes like I have in the past, the premises look to be much better with saws. I have a competent dealer very close by, Parts are cheaper, I have a workshop manual (Husqvarna 340-345-346xp-350-351-353) and IPLs, lots and lots and lots of tools, years of wrenching experience, a basic understanding of small engines, and three months of vacation coming up. Sure, there is some mild insanity to the whole thing, but I have accepted my diagnosis. It could be worse.

So, am I missing something? Is this a really bad idea for any other than the obvious reason - that I really don't NEED to do any of this. The saw, as I said is practically new. On the other hand, after years of dirty, rusty parts, broken or bent bolts and the like, working with new parts on a new motor would be nice.

As I understand it from this forum the powerband is the main difference - that should mean that the ports are different on the 346 cylinder. As the muffler and carb have different PN:s, I'm thinking I'll switch those too, even if the old parts will bolt right on. What I haven’t been able to figure out is the difference between the carbs. The 2149 uses the Walbro HDA 154 C, and the 346XP uses the Walbro HDA 182 A, but all the internals are the same, gaskets are the same, etc. The EPA versions both use the Walbro HDA 159 A. The 340-345-350 also use the Walbro HDA 154 C. The 351- has the Walbro CDA 154 B, again with the same internals. Post 2004, the 346XP-353 uses a Zama C3-EL 17, but the cylinder etc. are the same PN, the difference being a decompression valve (and perhaps also a bit more cubes?).

Anyone familiar with these carbs? I’m thinking there has to be a reason the 346xp has what at least sounds like a different carb than the “lesser” saws, but haven’t found any specifications. I realize the old Walbro may not be available, but should I then go for a newer Zama to match the 346 cylinder or put my old Walbro 154 on there? As I have no specs, I can’t answer that question myself.

At this stage I’m only dreaming, but when my dealer calls about my new bar and chain, I’ll have him check prices and availability for me, probably on monday or tuesday. Until then, any and all input is welcome, and of course - should this project get underway, I promise you all pictures of the build bordering on the eye-rotic as I have found that this is customary on the board.

Until then, saw safe.

/LR

 

[mikefunaro]

Honestly, if the saw is next to new I cannot see abandoning that P&C already...

There is a difference for sure, and I like my 346 more than any other 50cc saw I've used...but come on man...you're going to shell out like $400+ to get it?

Honestly, it might end up being cheaper (more economical anyway) to just sell your saw locally and then ebay one from the US and get it shipped over...

I just don't see how this is wortwhile. What will the 2149 go for used?

 

[L.R.]

Honestly, if the saw is next to new I cannot see abandoning that P&C already...

There is a difference for sure, and I like my 346 more than any other 50cc saw I've used...but come on man...you're going to shell out like $400+ to get it?

Honestly, it might end up being cheaper (more economical anyway) to just sell your saw locally and then ebay one from the US and get it shipped over...

I just don't see how this is wortwhile. What will the 2149 go for used?

Well, I don't see it as abandoning the old P&C, but rather getting a spare set.

The saw would probably get me somewhere between two and five hundred bucks, hardly more. But as I said, I like the straight front handle on the Jred, so I'm not looking to switch. 400$ is still less than half of a new one. I know I could probably get parts cheaper on ebay, but I like to support small local businesses, my dealer has been very helpful. We'll see on monday how much cash is actually involved.

The point is really the build itself - learning how to change cylinders while at the same time getting a small performance upgrade. Sooner or later I might need a new cylinder anyway, why not have one laying around and also the know-how to change it when that happens?

Like I said, the biggest reason not to do this project is that there really is no point for me to do it, except for maybe a few more RPM and like half a pony. I just think it would be fun.

Thanks a lot for your input, though.

 

[mikefunaro]

If you want to practice doing some rebuilds, start buying screwed up saws in the area and nurse them back to life.

There's no reason to make your good saw your test rat.

 

[spike60]

GO FOR IT!!!!!

This is a fun, yet simple project. So, it's ideal for a first timer.

To answer your carb question, the primary difference between what you have and what's on the 346NE/2153 is that the newer saws have the primer, and therefore the extra nipple on the carb to accept the primer line. Otherwise the difference between the ealrly models with the Walbro and the newer models with the Zama is not important, and won't affect performance.

I have put the new cylinder on several models in that family: 346OE, 350, 2145. The plasting bodied saws require a few different alterations, but your 2149 is a direct bolt on.

All of those saws had toasted cylinders, and I normally agree with Mike's position that there is no point in tearing out a perfectly good cylinder for an upgrade. But this jug really wakes up a saw, especially in acceleration. Plus, you are accepting that you are doing this for enjoyment and that you will have a spare P&C should you need it or wish to sell it. Maybe you'll come across someone elses toasted saw.

Also, there is no reason to switch the muffler. The non-cat mufflers are virtually identical throughout this saw family. There was an improvement at some point to strengthen the area where the bolts go through, and the new mufflers are coated with hi-temp paint vs the old ones that had some kind of oil based finish.

Looking at the numbers and seeing what a new 346 costs over there, this is not a bad way to go.

Keep us posted!

 

[Taxmantoo]

The crank will be a lot of the cost. Is it necessary, or even highly desirable?

 

[L.R.]

To answer your carb question, the primary difference between what you have and what's on the 346NE/2153 is that the newer saws have the primer, and therefore the extra nipple on the carb to accept the primer line. Otherwise the difference between the ealrly models with the Walbro and the newer models with the Zama is not important, and won't affect performance.

...


All of those saws had toasted cylinders, and I normally agree with Mike's position that there is no point in tearing out a perfectly good cylinder for an upgrade. But this jug really wakes up a saw, especially in acceleration. Plus, you are accepting that you are doing this for enjoyment and that you will have a spare P&C should you need it or wish to sell it. Maybe you'll come across someone elses toasted saw.

Also, there is no reason to switch the muffler. The non-cat mufflers are virtually identical throughout this saw family. There was an improvement at some point to strengthen the area where the bolts go through, and the new mufflers are coated with hi-temp paint vs the old ones that had some kind of oil based finish.

Well, I agree with Mike too, and I am looking for old saws, there's just not much forest where I live, so prospects are few. Also, I'm not good at selling stuff off, so a project saw would have to be one I might consider keeping. I'm currently looking at a couple of bigger sisters for the black and red, but one of my thoughts was to work with what I already have, and since the little one has plastic casing...

I also thought instead of porting and modding mufflers, I could look for something bolt-on, and the 346 cylinder seemed to make sense, at least on paper. Stock stuff is more than enough for me to handle at this point.

I think what I have is a 503 86 28-2, the empty type with a spark arrestor on top. It's the older style with the oily finish, and thus has rusted a little and looks scruffy. I was thinking I'd get the 503 86 27-2, or 503 86 27-3 tube type, as MAG58 seems to think the tube type wakes the saw up a bit, but this is not a priority.

I didn't think there'd be any point in switching to a Zama carb, especially since that involves some other parts as well, but you are saying there is no real difference between the Walbro 154 C, PN 503 28 18-03 and the Walbro 182 A, PN 503 28 18-6? I realize both will fit, I'm just curious about the #182 as it only seems to be found on the 346XP, and no other saw in this family, just like the cylinder. What's so special about it that it has it's own part number?

@ Taxmantoo: No, the crank assembly is identical (PN 503 85 76-71), that won't need to be switched, just the piston and cylinder.

Thank you all for your thoughts.

PS. Does anyone know how to read Jonsered or Husqvarna IPLs? When it says "* Compl 503..." or ** Compl", does that mean this PN includes all the parts in the picture marked "*" or "**"?

 

[L.R.]

Was at the dealers today, price for new P&C was about what i expected. New carb was a bit cheaper, but he said the Walbro 182 A carb had switched PN; unfortunately I left the new part number at my dads. I want to check what exact carb the new PN is - this means my carb question may be moot. After that, I'll put in an order for a P&C. Can't wait to get started!

 

[L.R.]

The part number for the old Walbro 182 A carb; 503 28 18-06 for the 346xp is apparently replaced by PN 503 28 32-08, which is the Zama C3 EL 18, an EPA carb and thus not interesting for me. Still think it's strange though, the old 346 had a different EPA carb, so why is the non-EPA carb being replaced by an EPA carb?

Either way, I'll just stick with the existing Walbro 154 C.

 

[spike60]

Don't get tied down with the EPA designation. Usually just means it has limiter caps.

 

[L.R.]

Don't get tied down with the EPA designation. Usually just means it has limiter caps.

Good point, but as it's also a Zama, meaning I'll also have to change the intake and some other parts, I'll just leave it alone, just like you said. New piston and cylinder, and perhaps a new tube type exhaust, plus the new style carb clamp is what I'll order. Build will likely start next week, or perhaps the week after. Stay tuned for pics.

As always, thanks for the input.

 

[Armstrong]

Just checking in to see if this project ever happened since I am looking to do the same. Did the original carb work out?