My saw (ms 390) came with a saftey chain. It doesn't cut at the bar end or with the saw on parallel. It' been sharpened at the dealer and I've been keeping it sharp. It cuts ok otherwise, Is this poor performance due to the anti kickback chain? Should I change it out? thanks
anti kickback chain
- Thread starter dennish
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mikefunaro
Addicted to ArboristSite
safety chain
Most people on here will tell you that safety chain sucks. It does.
Plunge cutting--what I think you're describing with cutting on the tip of the bar--does not work very well with safety chain.
Likewise, ripping--what I think you mean but "cutting parallel"--doesn't work very well either. This actually doesn't work all that well with most chains--if you're going to do this a lot, you need ripping chain. Standard chain is just really designed to cut against wood fibers, not with them.
Chains aren't too expensive, especially if you order them online. I've had a stihl dealer try to sell me a 18" loop of chain for $25, while you can get the same online from oregon, carlton, etc, for about $12. Buy a few and have them sharp so you just have to change them out. (be sure to soak them overnight in penetrating oil, before you use them).
I like to run both chisel and semi chisel. Semi chisel dulls nowhere as fast when cutting dirty or dead wood.
If you do use non-safety chain, you definitely have to be more careful. Unless you're plunge cutting, you really shouldn't be cutting too much with the tip of your bar.
Safe cutting,
MGF
Most people on here will tell you that safety chain sucks. It does.
Plunge cutting--what I think you're describing with cutting on the tip of the bar--does not work very well with safety chain.
Likewise, ripping--what I think you mean but "cutting parallel"--doesn't work very well either. This actually doesn't work all that well with most chains--if you're going to do this a lot, you need ripping chain. Standard chain is just really designed to cut against wood fibers, not with them.
Chains aren't too expensive, especially if you order them online. I've had a stihl dealer try to sell me a 18" loop of chain for $25, while you can get the same online from oregon, carlton, etc, for about $12. Buy a few and have them sharp so you just have to change them out. (be sure to soak them overnight in penetrating oil, before you use them).
I like to run both chisel and semi chisel. Semi chisel dulls nowhere as fast when cutting dirty or dead wood.
If you do use non-safety chain, you definitely have to be more careful. Unless you're plunge cutting, you really shouldn't be cutting too much with the tip of your bar.
Safe cutting,
MGF
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I guess it depends on how you choose to measure how "safe" something is.
Edge & Engine
ArboristSite.com Sponsor
Low/anti-kickback chain does not eliminate kickback, but it decreases the likelihood and/or intensity of the kickback. It's good for Jane and Joe Homeowner who only use chainsaws once a year and don't know zilch about saws.
The most important thing is to watch what you're doing with that tip, and you'll be fine.
mikefunaro
Addicted to ArboristSite
dennish,
I thought about this while in the dentist's chair this morning...
Just buy a non safety chain or two and check them out. Decide if the increase in performance is worth it for you. Keep the safety chain, if you decided that you're going to risk it, buy non safety in the future.
MGF
I thought about this while in the dentist's chair this morning...
Just buy a non safety chain or two and check them out. Decide if the increase in performance is worth it for you. Keep the safety chain, if you decided that you're going to risk it, buy non safety in the future.
MGF
I'm new to saws. I live in the woods and my own forest. I pulled out my oil stove and put in a wood stove due to the cost of oil. I opted for the ms 390 because my stihl dealer assured me that I could use a 28" bar on this saw. There are some big logs and also I wanted to limit bending over. But now I find that I still have to to bend over because I can't take advantge of the bar lenght since it doesn't cut near the end. This is a problem also when limbing. I reasoned that the cutting problem is due to the safety chain. Since I'm a novice I'm concerned about safety. Problem is that a poor cutting saw is also dangerous. Saw seems to buck ok but doesn't cut in horisontal position. That makes it frustrating and dangerous.
Wet1
Addicted to ArboristSite
I've found the only way to make safety chain truly functional is to "fix" it with a die-grinder. Takes me about two minutes to make it usable. 
Dennish,
I have cut a lot of wood with 'reduced kickback' chain.
It may not cut as aggressively as other types of chain, but if it is sharp it will cut fast. I'm talking about storm damaged trees of all types in all kinds of positions, usually with a 16 to 24 inch bar. Lot of limbs, lots of trunks, even some occasional plunge cutting, although it is noticeably slower there.
If you are having the kinds of problems you describe, there might be other issues going on. Was this a used saw or chain? Were the depth gauges taken down after sharpening? Take the saw to your dealer and discuss your concerns. Running a saw when your are frustrated is dangerous.
Philbert
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That saw was never intended to wear a bar that long. It doesn't have the power to pull if affectively, nor does it have an oiler designed to lube a bar that long. You need at least a 70cc saw, preferably 80cc or better. The MS390 is best with a 20" bar. Even a 25" will be pushing its limits.
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followup. Thanks for all the response. I went to the saw store and purchased an skip chisel chain and bucked a log with it. WOW! It cuts at least 2X better than the brand new safety chain. I emailed Sthil regarding my running the 28" bar on my ms390. Sthil stated that they sell the ms3890 with 28" bar in the part of the country (No Cal) and that I shouldn't have any problems with this bar. They responded immediately. Pretty cool. Anyway, I feel much more in control and safer with the non safety chain. Maybe, safety chains aren't meant to be used on longer bars. Anyone know about this?
ms310
ArboristSite Operative
+1 Totally agree!
GASoline71
Mr. Nice Guy
You silly hardwood boys tellin a west coaster that a 390 will not pull a 28" bar and chain is BS...
It will do just fine out here in the softwoods.
Dennish... the 28" bar will work much better for you with non-safety full skip chain. The cutters are further apart for chip clearance on longer bars. Try a loop if it. Take your time and use your noggin'... you will be suprised in the difference of the performance on that longer bar.
Gary
It will do just fine out here in the softwoods.
Dennish... the 28" bar will work much better for you with non-safety full skip chain. The cutters are further apart for chip clearance on longer bars. Try a loop if it. Take your time and use your noggin'... you will be suprised in the difference of the performance on that longer bar.
Gary
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ms310
ArboristSite Operative
Hey Gary will the oiler be able to keep up? I know on my 310 20" bar it didnt ever seem to put out enough oil. Basically isnt the 310, and 390 the same saw just a little more cc.. Help me out i dont know!
GASoline71
Mr. Nice Guy
It should... I would see no probs with runnin' a 28" on a 390. However... I would not run it on there full time.
My 044 has a 28" bar on it but sees a 32" bar a lot. Even had a 36" on it once or twice... no probs at all...
But that's me...
Gary
My 044 has a 28" bar on it but sees a 32" bar a lot. Even had a 36" on it once or twice... no probs at all...
But that's me...
Gary
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safety chain on ms 390
When I emailed Sthil regarding the use of the 28" bar on the ms390, I also asked specifically about any possible oiling/ bar/chain problems. Again, Sthil said I should have no problem. And yes, in this area it's mostly fir and pine with some oak and madrone. Again, I can't believe the dramatic improvement of the skip chisel non safety over a new anti kickback chain on this saw/28" bar combo.
When I emailed Sthil regarding the use of the 28" bar on the ms390, I also asked specifically about any possible oiling/ bar/chain problems. Again, Sthil said I should have no problem. And yes, in this area it's mostly fir and pine with some oak and madrone. Again, I can't believe the dramatic improvement of the skip chisel non safety over a new anti kickback chain on this saw/28" bar combo.
If you file down the safety hump 3 or 4 licks with a good file it will cut much better at the tip but you loose the anti kickback properties. That safety hump does little until it goes around the nose where it sticks up higher then the depth raker keeping the cutter from digging in as far reducing kickback.
Pruning trees for a living, the saws are howling mere inches from my face AND you're only cutting with the tip, the safety stuff is trouble, no room for BS, off with the chainbrake, on this job a brake'll jam when you seriously don't want it to, the safety chain is bad news also, the last thing you want is chains jamming half way thru a cut, they CAUSE accidents. Safety chain? Ha! All you need do is hold your saw and don't get kickbacks, nothing difficult there
