Availability of long Mcculloch CP125 Bars

[Yossarian]

After hours of research I have decided to build a CS Mill using a Mac CP125, purchased tonight on ebay here in Australia, also bought a 795,PM1000 and 2 650's(all cheap from the same deceased estate, and I dont want to be stuck in the bush with a busted mill saw and no backup).

I am a complete novice at milling and also old big cc saws. Any help would be appreciated, I have found BobL's (among many others) mountains of information invaluable.

1st Question: Does anybody still make bars (the longer the better) to suit these old beasts? (CP125's) If not can I adapt another bar to suit and what would be the most suitable bar to machine/adapt.

2nd Question: Why does nobody seem to use linear bearings on 3 planes on these horizontal mills? eg. rails with a piece of angle welded on the outside, facing out, flush with the top, with a bearing underneath the angle, one on the oustide and one on top, on all four corners of the mill. It is a rubbish explaination, but I can see it in my minds eye, hopefully it makes sense.

I can only see it reducing: friction
physical effort holding the saw level and square
the possibility of tapering

3rd Question: Do the CP125 and 795 have the same bar mount pattern? I have looked on the acres site but this info is not listed for these saws. I will know the answer to this within a week when the saws are delivered but thought I should ask anyway as there seems to be a wealth of knowlegde among members of this site!!!

Thanks

Tim

 

[BobL]

Welcome aboard Yossarian.

After hours of research I have decided to build a CS Mill using a Mac CP125, purchased tonight on ebay here in Australia, also bought a 795,PM1000 and 2 650's(all cheap from the same deceased estate, and I dont want to be stuck in the bush with a busted mill saw and no backup).

Hey - nice saws but you better bolt up everything nice and tight as they will give your CSM (and you) a good shake up!

1st Question: Does anybody still make bars (the longer the better) to suit these old beasts? (CP125's) If not can I adapt another bar to suit and what would be the most suitable bar to machine/adapt.

If you can't get any info here try posting in the CS forum or the ********************************/ site.

2nd Question: Why does nobody seem to use linear bearings on 3 planes on these horizontal mills? eg. rails with a piece of angle welded on the outside, facing out, flush with the top, with a bearing underneath the angle, one on the oustide and one on top, on all four corners of the mill. It is a rubbish explaination, but I can see it in my minds eye, hopefully it makes sense.

Sort off - you want to be able to move the mill easily. Well, being older and quite unfit, this has preoccupied my time in the design elements of the mills I have made,

Some people like railomatic use rollers on their mills like this

I don't like rollers used this way because this fixes the length of the bar on that mill.

There was also a CSM made in the 1980s called Sperber that used rollers on top like railomatic's, and also rollers on the side. These days wheels that contact with the side of the log are used although I am surprise to see no commercial CMS offering any wheels as I reckon they make a big difference.

Railomatic used to post extensively on AS but most of his posts had links to pictures on his website which is now defunct so most of the image links are broken. There are a few remaining pictures of his CSMs in this thread http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=48517

I don't see the need for bearings in the 3rd direction.

I find that High density polyethylene (HDPE) strips on the base of the mill rails provide more than enough slipperiness, any more than this and it would be awkward. More important that the HDPE strips are wheels on the side of mill to reduce friction with the side of the log. I have posted about this in several places. Bearings would be just something more to gum up with the mix of oil, resin and sawdust that flies around near a CSM.

 

[texx]

i had that saw on my watch list just out of interest .
that guy had a heap of old mac's for sale quiet a collection realy

 

[Yossarian]

Welcome aboard Yossarian.


Hey - nice saws but you better bolt up everything nice and tight as they will give your CSM (and you) a good shake up!


If you can't get any info here try posting in the CS forum or the ********************************/ site.



Sort off - you want to be able to move the mill easily. Well, being older and quite unfit, this has preoccupied my time in the design elements of the mills I have made,

Some people like railomatic use rollers on their mills like this

I don't like rollers used this way because this fixes the length of the bar on that mill.

There was also a CSM made in the 1980s called Sperber that used rollers on top like railomatic's, and also rollers on the side. These days wheels that contact with the side of the log are used although I am surprise to see no commercial CMS offering any wheels as I reckon they make a big difference.

Railomatic used to post extensively on AS but most of his posts had links to pictures on his website which is now defunct so most of the image links are broken. There are a few remaining pictures of his CSMs in this thread http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=48517

I don't see the need for bearings in the 3rd direction.

I find that High density polyethylene (HDPE) strips on the base of the mill rails provide more than enough slipperiness, any more than this and it would be awkward. More important that the HDPE strips are wheels on the side of mill to reduce friction with the side of the log. I have posted about this in several places. Bearings would be just something more to gum up with the mix of oil, resin and sawdust that flies around near a CSM.

Thanks Bob, I will bolt everything up tight!!! I have read your posts about flying bolts and this does not appeal to me at all:greenchainsaw:I am a fitter/machinist by trade and have a habit of over engineering everything... Probably why I enjoy reading your posts so much!!!

I didn't mean to say 3 planes, sounded ok late at night after a few beers I meant 3 faces: top, outside and underside (underside of attached angle as obviously underside of rails will be on the log). I was thinking sealed 2205 bearings or similar mounted in clevis style blocks and used as rollers. Basically so the mill can't lift or twist and can only move along the log.

I will look into the HPPE, I have used this for wear strips on machinery in the past and may still have some hiding in the workshop somewhere.

Thanks for your help and I will keep you posted, will probably be a long time in the making as I am off to South America for a month next week. Still just bouncing ideas around at the moment.

Cheers

Tim

 

[Yossarian]

i had that saw on my watch list just out of interest .
that guy had a heap of old mac's for sale quiet a collection realy

Hi Texx,

Certainly did!!!

The guy was a woman as it turns out. The saws had been left to her. I still have to get them frieghted up here from Tasmania and have my fingers crossed that they will be ok. She said that they pulled over and knew nothing else. But for US$500 for the CP125,795,PM1000 and 2 650's I figure I can't go too far wrong, even if they do need a few hours tinkering on the bench and a few more bucks spent. I will be pulling them down anyway to look for any major problems.

Cheers

Tim

 

[elliott]

Does anybody still make bars (the longer the better) to suit these old beasts?

Have you contacted GB? They're headquartered on the same island that you're on. :jester:

 

[BobL]

Thanks Bob, I will bolt everything up tight!!! I have read your posts about flying bolts and this does not appeal to me at all:greenchainsaw:I am a fitter/machinist by trade and have a habit of over engineering everything... Probably why I enjoy reading your posts so much!!!

Could be

I didn't mean to say 3 planes, sounded ok late at night after a few beers I meant 3 faces: top, outside and underside (underside of attached angle as obviously underside of rails will be on the log). I was thinking sealed 2205 bearings or similar mounted in clevis style blocks and used as rollers. Basically so the mill can't lift or twist and can only move along the log.

It sounds like you want to restrict the movement of the mill to the log rails so it can only move in one direction? If so I would not do this for an Alaskan mill. It will require locking the log rails very firmly on the log or onto a solid stand of some kind. If you want to lock a saw onto a rail then that is really a rail mill (like this) and they are quite different beasts. Rail mills have a number of advantages but I prefer using an alaskan - there's a bit more lifting but I feel a lot more in control using the free alaskan than I do with the rail mill - maybe I just haven't used my rail mill enough. BIL mill weighs 72 lbs with the 60" bar and chain but that's nothing compared to the 200+ lb slabs that I sometimes move around!

Unless the chain/bar is out of whack an Alaskan mill should not lift. The only time I have heard of lift is when the bar plane has not been parallel with the mill rail plane.

I actually prefer it being able to move the mill side to side and rotate the mill on the log rails, especially to start and finish - I could go into fine detail here but Ill only do that in you want to. Most trunks are not straight and being able to steer around branch unions and objects near logs makes side to side movement very useful.

 

[Yossarian]

Could be



It sounds like you want to restrict the movement of the mill to the log rails so it can only move in one direction? If so I would not do this for an Alaskan mill. It will require locking the log rails very firmly on the log or onto a solid stand of some kind. If you want to lock a saw onto a rail then that is really a rail mill (like this) and they are quite different beasts. Rail mills have a number of advantages but I prefer using an alaskan - there's a bit more lifting but I feel a lot more in control using the free alaskan than I do with the rail mill - maybe I just haven't used my rail mill enough. BIL mill weighs 72 lbs with the 60" bar and chain but that's nothing compared to the 200+ lb slabs that I sometimes move around!

Unless the chain/bar is out of whack an Alaskan mill should not lift. The only time I have heard of lift is when the bar plane has not been parallel with the mill rail plane.

I actually prefer it being able to move the mill side to side and rotate the mill on the log rails, especially to start and finish - I could go into fine detail here but Ill only do that in you want to. Most trunks are not straight and being able to steer around branch unions and objects near logs makes side to side movement very useful.

Cheers Bob, that is exactly what I wanted to hear!!!

I was wondering (read worrying) about starting a log. I Thought lack of mobility (linear motion only) might be a good thing but had not thought of branches/curves.

Thinking further on your earlier comments about my saw shaking the mill and myself, I imagine not having the mill fixed to the rails would soak up a bit of the vibration laterally rather than shaking the mill rails off the log...

As per usual I am putting the bull before the horns... have bought saws which I haven't seen yet let alone run (I most likely will not see them until I come back from holidays and may not see them running for some time after that).

Thanks for your input, you have already started to steer me away from a couple of dodgy design features.

I will have to buy you a beer sometime. My sister has just bought a house near Dog Swamp in Perth which I haven't seen yet. I imagine I will be over west soon to see her and get a bit of fishing in.

Cheers

Tim

 

[Yossarian]

Have you contacted GB? They're headquartered on the same island that you're on. :jester:

Hi Elliot,

I have sent them an email but have not heard anything back yet...

I also spoke to my local chainsaw supply shop and he could not find anything listed in the way of bars from any manufacturers for these saws.

Thanks

Tim

 

[BobL]

Cheers Bob, that is exactly what I wanted to hear!!!

I was wondering (read worrying) about starting a log. I Thought lack of mobility (linear motion only) might be a good thing but had not thought of branches/curves.

Thinking further on your earlier comments about my saw shaking the mill and myself, I imagine not having the mill fixed to the rails would soak up a bit of the vibration laterally rather than shaking the mill rails off the log...

As per usual I am putting the bull before the horns... have bought saws which I haven't seen yet let alone run (I most likely will not see them until I come back from holidays and may not see them running for some time after that).

Thanks for your input, you have already started to steer me away from a couple of dodgy design features.

I will have to buy you a beer sometime. My sister has just bought a house near Dog Swamp in Perth which I haven't seen yet. I imagine I will be over west soon to see her and get a bit of fishing in.

Cheers

Tim

No worries !

 

[Yossarian]

Have you contacted GB? They're headquartered on the same island that you're on. :jester:

It's one of the better islands to live on but parts and their availability and pricing sometimes leaves a bit to be desired.

It kills me sometimes seeing the price of chevy and mercruiser bits for my boat over there... Often it is cheaper to buy from The States and pay for extortionate freight than buy it here.

Cheers Tim

 

[BobL]

No worries !

RE: GB
They recently changed hands - it will take them some time to get their act together. There is also an Aussie guy called McBob that is worth discussing Mac parts with his website is http://macbobaust.com/saws.html

Also the SCS.se site - lotsa mac guys there. Oh yeah - don't forget the chainsaw forum here as well.

 

[Yossarian]

No worries !

RE: GB
They recently changed hands - it will take them some time to get their act together. There is also an Aussie guy called McBob that is worth discussing Mac parts with his website is http://macbobaust.com/saws.html

Also the SCS.se site - lotsa mac guys there. Oh yeah - don't forget the chainsaw forum here as well.

Thanks Bob,

I aready have McBob's site saved into my favourites. He is in Weston, pretty close to here, I actually lived in a little pub there for a while when I was doing my apprenticeship.

I am supposed to be going away for a month but Aerolineas Arg. cancelled my flight friday and stuck me on a waiting list for possibly this wednesday maybe the following tuesday (maybe not at all, not overly impressed actually but that is getting off topic). I don't really want to ring/email him and then have to tell him to wait for a month. Especially as I don't physically have the saws yet. I have emailed a few guys selling bars on ebay both here and in The States and they have all asked for the dimentions of slots etc and I have had to tell them that I don't know yet and could tell them in a month, wasting their time and making me feel like a goose for doing so/

My Grandma lives in Cessnock, 5 minutes from Weston so I might call in and see him when I get back... If i go at all

Thanks Again

Tim

 

[CM76]

Well done on picking up those old Mac saws - I ended up with the 550 from the same sale. You will enjoy them without a doubt!

Chris.

 

[Yossarian]

Well done on picking up those old Mac saws - I ended up with the 550 from the same sale. You will enjoy them without a doubt!

Chris.

Cheers Chris,
I am sure I will. You got that 550 nice and cheap!!!
Have you got yours yet? Old mate (her father I think) sure new a fair bit about saws when he rang me talking about his couple of SP125C's and other saws he won't sell...hope yours and mine are ok!!!

Tim

 

[CM76]

Hey Tim,

I am away from home for about the next 7 - 8 weeks with work so will not get to see my saw for a good while - It is on its way though according to the posts. The 550 looked to be in pretty good shape from the pics, so hopefully the internals will be the same. You never know with these kind of buys, but that is always part of the challenge. I love the old saws, and can't wait to see if there is still life in my new Mac.

Once again, well done on your two saws.

Regards,

Chris.