Greenhorn question

[Lugnutz]

Lugnutz are you talking about just plugging in your furnace blower fan to the generator ? OR are you talking about plugging your generator into the house electric outlet and backfeeding the whole house with the generator??

I refuse to comment on the electric wiring aspect of your posts, because i'm not a pro/certified electrician myself.

Good Luck with everything, hope you get it all figured out.

Just plugging the fan into the gen.

 

[RacerX]

Been looking at double wall pipe, it can't hurt.

Question on the electrical, how is my plug in set up any different than running an extension cord out to the heater on my truck or all the guys that plug their deisel trucks in? Just curious.

Since you asked, the cord is not permitted to be used for this installation at all. As you have it now the plug serves as a means of disconnect for the appliance. If you hard wire the unit you will need a means of disconnect within sight (50' or less).

The generator aspect is not an issue with your current setup. There are people who like to back feed the 30 amp, 240 volt dryer receptacle from the genny who unintentionally energize the conductors out on the pole. Highly illegal and not a very good idea.

 

[Lugnutz]

Since you asked, the cord is not permitted to be used for this installation at all. As you have it now the plug serves as a means of disconnect for the appliance. If you hard wire the unit you will need a means of disconnect within sight (50' or less).

The generator aspect is not an issue with your current setup. There are people who like to back feed the 30 amp, 240 volt dryer receptacle from the genny who unintentionally energize the conductors out on the pole. Highly illegal and not a very good idea.

Well..which cord is? This thing runs off of a 1/16th hp motor..about like a 100 watt light bulb.

 

[12vdzl]

Just plugging the fan into the gen.

I think most were thinking you were wanting to backfeed the house with electricity from the generator.

Myself i don't see a huge problem with your setup, as long as you only use the generator for your suggested use. If anything you can use flexible conduit into a double outside box. 1 side put a light switch run your house hot into this, run out of this into a 110v recepticle.

Glad your family is staying warm.

 

[palmrose2]

I think that settles it - you have a draft problem. I agree on the flue cap - lose that thing! Get something like this:

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimney/Chimney-Caps-for-Metal-Chimneys



He says that he has problems in high winds. I did too even though my new 30 foot tall masonry with double wall insulated SS liner chimney passed all rules of thumb as per height. Tried three different caps and this fixed my problems. http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/chimpilot/mSR.jpeg


Yesterday I removed the screen because it was plugging up.

 

[mizzou]

send me a pm. i'm close and also a jw electrician and laid off. we can get the electrical figured out. i can find lawson.

 

[heatsink]

The stove is an outdoor unit. The uninsulated ducting you see is for the cold air return.

The stove is insulated very well, as a matter of fact it has snow sitting on it right now.

Here is a pic of the heat duct ( also insulated ).

You may want to insulate your cold air return. Think about it, the warmer the air coming in, the less energy (heat) is needed to reheat it. It's the same principle as taking a shower. The more cold water you add to the already hot water produces warm water.
I'm actualy in the process of preheating my cold air. My furnace sits in my garage and is ducted under my house. Temps stay around 50 degrees. What I am doing is installing tree 4" aluminum drier pipes through the cold air fan box. These pipes will be connected to a simple manifold that is supplied with the heat coming from my 'magic heat' . It will blow heat through the pipes, which will go through the fan box and back out into the garage. The aluminum pipes will transfer the heat (not the air) into the fan box, and the cold air supplied will be drawn accross these pipes and preheat the air before it enters the furnace. Remember, I'm forcing supplied air down back under the house, so my fan is always running. I burn mostly ash, and my supplied air temp is between 100 and 115 degrees ( outside temps are in the 20"s). The more produced heat I can recover and supply to the house the better. I will be happy with a 10 degree increase in supplied air temp. This will result in less wood consumed through out the season. I hope.

 

[Fronty Owner]

Been looking at double wall pipe, it can't hurt.

Question on the electrical, how is my plug in set up any different than running an extension cord out to the heater on my truck or all the guys that plug their deisel trucks in? Just curious.

type of cord and application.
at the bare minimum, you should be using SOW cord (Sun, Oil, Water resistant). Over time, your orange extension cord insulation will break down and harden and crack from UV exposure. Your best choice would be a short piece of EMT to run from you "T" to the wall junction box. the NEC doesn't apply ot automotive applications.

 

[Lugnutz]

I think that settles it - you have a draft problem. I agree on the flue cap - lose that thing! Get something like this:

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimney/Chimney-Caps-for-Metal-Chimneys



He says that he has problems in high winds. I did too even though my new 30 foot tall masonry with double wall insulated SS liner chimney passed all rules of thumb as per height. Tried three different caps and this fixed my problems. http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/chimpilot/mSR.jpeg


Yesterday I removed the screen because it was plugging up.

I've seen one of those before seems like a good idea. Where did you get yours?

Mizzou I'll give you a holler in a bit.

 

[Lugnutz]

type of cord and application.
at the bare minimum, you should be using SOW cord (Sun, Oil, Water resistant). Over time, your orange extension cord insulation will break down and harden and crack from UV exposure. Your best choice would be a short piece of EMT to run from you "T" to the wall junction box. the NEC doesn't apply ot automotive applications.

Ok I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't know much. But anything that plugs into my house should have to follow NEC? Just cause its a truck or car that's pluggin into my house shouldn't change the rules? Besides once its plugged into my house it isnt an automtive application, its a huge friggin home appliance? cause my head is startin to hurt

 

[Lugnutz]

made some changes

Ok for the most part everyone agrees I have a draft problem ( its a kansas city thing I guess ) anyhow you all suggested:
A: Dump the cap
B: Raise the pipe
C: Go double wall

C: Can't afford at this time +too cold to shut stove down
B: Got pipe but too cold to shut stove down
A: doable kinda

Ok to get the cap off I need to take down pipe which is a problem..refer to B
So being the redneck that I am I improvised a unique plan that almost worked the way I wanted it to, but as a compromise worked well enuff to survive till I can take stove pipe down.

12ga loaded with #6 shot!! Figured it would blow the cap right off, but it didnt, however it did knock a bunch of crap out of it and opened an nice 2 inch auxillary hole in the cap! Tomorrow when it gets light I shall try again. plus I'll add pics!!

I got a rifle a shotgun and a 4 wheel drive and a county boy can survive!!!!!:greenchainsaw: wonder why he didnt mention a chiansaw?

 

[rmotoman]

I like the redneck solution for the cap!!!

I was looking at double wall pipe at Atwoods. Wow, it's expensive $100 for 4ft. and $130 for 5ft sections. I bought our stove used and the pipe came with it.

 

[Lugnutz]

I like the redneck solution for the cap!!!

I was looking at double wall pipe at Atwoods. Wow, it's expensive $100 for 4ft. and $130 for 5ft sections. I bought our stove used and the pipe came with it.

Do a google, I think I found the right stuff for 42 bucks per 3ft stick

 

[RacerX]

Ok I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't know much. But anything that plugs into my house should have to follow NEC? Just cause its a truck or car that's pluggin into my house shouldn't change the rules? Besides once its plugged into my house it isnt an automtive application, its a huge friggin home appliance? cause my head is startin to hurt

The NEC would define that outdoor unit as utilization equipment, (definition in Article 100). In order for it to be cord and plug connected it would need to comply with Article 400 specifically 400.7(A). It would also be required by it's listing to be permitted to be cord and plug connected by the equipment manufacturer. Substituting an orange extension cord for fixed wiring would not be permitted under the NEC. Even if the cord were permitted by 400.7(A) it would be prohibited by 400.8(7) which says that a cord shall not be used "where subject to physical damage".

 

[Lugnutz]

The NEC would define that outdoor unit as utilization equipment, (definition in Article 100). In order for it to be cord and plug connected it would need to comply with Article 400 specifically 400.7(A). It would also be required by it's listing to be permitted to be cord and plug connected by the equipment manufacturer. Substituting an orange extension cord for fixed wiring would not be permitted under the NEC. Even if the cord were permitted by 400.7(A) it would be prohibited by 400.8(7) which says that a cord shall not be used "where subject to physical damage".

Thank you!!

I like 400.8 (7) "where subject to physical damage" For me its the Catch 22, I can't think of any place around my home ( inside or out ) where a cord would not be subject to damage, unless that only applies to utilization equipment?? Anyhow thanks for this info.