Liquid Amber roots causing drainage problems

[Andrew Kirmse]

We have a good-size (30') liquid amber tree out near the street by our house:

Its roots are cracking and raising the shallow swale that drains the neighborhood's water away:

When it really rains, the water overtops the swale, comes down our driveway, and overwhelms our French drains, flooding our yard: Video link

The flooding has gotten worse over time as the roots have raised up the swale more. We could continue to pile up sandbags every winter (more than in the video obviously) but I'm looking for a permanent solution. I've gotten two bids:

1. Remove the offending roots, dig up and rebuild the swale, and build an asphalt berm to keep out the water $5k
2. Remove the tree completely $5k (plus the cost of additional required replacement trees)

Clearly #1 is necessary, but I am wondering if I also need to take out the tree. My concern would be that the roots might grow back over time, and crack the berm or invade the swale again. I don't love the species, but it's large tree and provides some shade and screening. The front of the house would look a little odd with it gone.

I had an arborist come out and he couldn't give me a definitive answer since he hasn't dealt with this kind of drainage issue before. The paving guys don't know trees particularly well.

There are some other minor complications. Our property is on the county/city line, so we can't touch the asphalt downslope of us in the neighbor's yard without doubling the already painful permit bureaucracy. There is a wall 5' from the tree that might conceivably eventually get damaged by the tree's roots, though there's no sign of that yet. My main question is whether it's worth the extra cost to remove the tree, and what's likely to happen over time if I don't.

Thanks,
---Andrew

 

[Del_]

Could a few inches of extra asphalt take the place of the sand bags and reshape the swale?

It would be mean driving over a wide 'hump' to get into your drive but would not be a problem except for the lowest of vehicles.

 

[Raintree]

5K to remove that sweetgum? Me thinks you need more estimates.
I don't see the tree being the runoff issue at the current time, poorly engineered roadway is the problem.
Press the DOT, road water should not be allowed to flood your property.

 

[Andrew Kirmse]

@Del_ Yes, as I mentioned, we will be building an asphalt berm there. We don't actually drive on this part of the driveway so that's not an issue.

@Raintree Things are expensive here in California. Includes grinding the stump. I've contacted the DOT multiple times over the years about the problem and they will not act. Tree roots definitely do appear to be the problem, as I have seen the swale rising over time.

So should we cut down the tree?

 

[Raintree]

Two things I would recommend.
Contact a real estate attorney and see where you stand on this matter.
Then if it looks like a battle not worth fighting, remove the tree.
It's the wrong tree for that location. I would never plant a sweetgum anywhere near hardscapes. These trees are widely known for aggressive roots.

 

[Oletrapper]

We have a good-size (30') liquid amber tree out near the street by our house: View attachment 1124064

Its roots are cracking and raising the shallow swale that drains the neighborhood's water away:View attachment 1124065

When it really rains, the water overtops the swale, comes down our driveway, and overwhelms our French drains, flooding our yard: Video link

The flooding has gotten worse over time as the roots have raised up the swale more. We could continue to pile up sandbags every winter (more than in the video obviously) but I'm looking for a permanent solution. I've gotten two bids:

1. Remove the offending roots, dig up and rebuild the swale, and build an asphalt berm to keep out the water $5k
2. Remove the tree completely $5k (plus the cost of additional required replacement trees)

Clearly #1 is necessary, but I am wondering if I also need to take out the tree. My concern would be that the roots might grow back over time, and crack the berm or invade the swale again. I don't love the species, but it's large tree and provides some shade and screening. The front of the house would look a little odd with it gone.

I had an arborist come out and he couldn't give me a definitive answer since he hasn't dealt with this kind of drainage issue before. The paving guys don't know trees particularly well.

There are some other minor complications. Our property is on the county/city line, so we can't touch the asphalt downslope of us in the neighbor's yard without doubling the already painful permit bureaucracy. There is a wall 5' from the tree that might conceivably eventually get damaged by the tree's roots, though there's no sign of that yet. My main question is whether it's worth the extra cost to remove the tree, and what's likely to happen over time if I don't.

Thanks,
---Andrew

In my humble opinion, It has been my experience that sweet gums will cause upheaval from the roots but it is usually within 6 to 8 feet from the trunk. An example would be the raise in the curbing around the tree.
The cracks shown in your video appear to be far beyond that and far beyond the drip line of the tree. That being said, I feel there may be something else going on which are causing the cracks. Possibly heavy truck traffic next to the drainage, etc.
I also think your drains might be clogged somewhere. The video shows the runoff and I would think your drainage would be able to handle what is shown with no problem. Does your neighbors yard pond water also? Where do your drains go? Are they attached to the local storm water runoff drainage? Personally, I would address those questions first before I would cut down the tree. If all else fails, cut it down and raise your drive entrance. If you cut it down, be sure to treat the stump as the roots will attempt to reestablish the same as a maple. Be sure to let us know of the outcome. jmho OT