new outdoor boilers are getting better !!!!
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rx7145
ArboristSite Guru
They are not cheap. Central Boiler's is $10,000!!:jawdrop:
windthrown
361 Junkie
Well, they are having to do something 'cause OWBs are getting banned in some places. Though I do not see the issue with smoke from our CB 4436 that drifts onto our 100 acres. Most people here heat with wood, so no one complains. But its a political game in many northeast states, and Washington state. In the bay area of CA you cannot build a new house with any wood burning appliance. Been that way for over 10 years now.
Butch(OH)
Addicted to ArboristSite
Some are of the mind set that in spending the extra 4K they are doing the world a favor. Some buy wood, then the extra spent up front MIGHT pay out in 10 years or so. Some hate to cut wood and cutting less is better. I fit none of those molds so I bought one of the sun blocking wood hogging type units. Probably has more to due with not liking to be told what to do than anything else but I did ask my neighbors who all said "hey your heating the house and its just wood smoke isn't it?" Guess they aint such bad folks after all
None the less I feel sorry for those who have to ask the blessings of some holy board of supervisors for permission to heat their own home with wood.
None the less I feel sorry for those who have to ask the blessings of some holy board of supervisors for permission to heat their own home with wood.
jags
ArboristSite Guru
Butch - I don't think its the issue of heating with wood. I think its the issue of the rolling smog that comes from an improperly burned wood heating device (note: indoor stoves are subject to this also). I love wood heat, but IF I had a neighbor (which I don't) and IF that neighbor caused belching smoke from any appliance or tire fire or smudge pot that was constantly in my face, I would have problems with it. I think this comes from a small number of people that have no clue how to run their appliance that gives many (wood heat folks) a bad name.
Butch(OH)
Addicted to ArboristSite
Like I said, the main issue with me is being told what to do. Add in a little "lets blame the machine for being operated by a lame brain"
attitude that is so prevalent today and my blood pressure goes up.I think you hit the nail squarely in talking about "proper" operation.
In my short experience with OWBs I think that the problems are about four fold with the design of the chamber being number 4 down the list.
1. They do smoke when coming off a long off cycle. This is complicated by summer operation with long off cycles and people with windows open.
2. They smoke more when fed big pieces of wet wood
3. The chimneys are short
4. They are not the most fuel efficient way to burn wood.
I had some white pine given to me and we have been burning a bit of it this fall since we fired up last week. It does make the thing smoke more but nothing like the famous, or infamous as it may be, OWB smoking pics we see on all the anti OWB web sites. If mine smoked like those pics id be embarressed to light it.
The smog master on full burn fuel is seasoned wild cherry
<IMG SRC=http://i14.tinypic.com/2uhpie8.jpg>
jags
ArboristSite Guru
"Like I said, the main issue with me is being told what to do. Add in a little "lets blame the machine for being operated by a lame brain" attitude that is so prevalent today and my blood pressure goes up."
Sorry to hear of your blood pressure problem. The picture that you posted is NOT the problems people have concerns with. I would hazard a guess that MOST people with wood burning appliances are in the same category as you and I, meaning that they don't want to be a burden on anyone else. You stated that if your OWB smoked like some of the pictures you have seen, you would not even light it up. But there are a small percent that don't give a rats a$$ and see it as there right to blow smoke any where they please, in the name of heating their house. That will get regulated. Like it or not. I don't like regulations. For every new law they should have to take one off the books. But it will happen unless things change (ie. OWB's get better, users get better, etc.) I sure as heck don't want to see OWB regulated. I would rather see there use and construction get better. Cuz after OWB they will come after the next wood burning appliance, then the next, etc.
Sorry to hear of your blood pressure problem. The picture that you posted is NOT the problems people have concerns with. I would hazard a guess that MOST people with wood burning appliances are in the same category as you and I, meaning that they don't want to be a burden on anyone else. You stated that if your OWB smoked like some of the pictures you have seen, you would not even light it up. But there are a small percent that don't give a rats a$$ and see it as there right to blow smoke any where they please, in the name of heating their house. That will get regulated. Like it or not. I don't like regulations. For every new law they should have to take one off the books. But it will happen unless things change (ie. OWB's get better, users get better, etc.) I sure as heck don't want to see OWB regulated. I would rather see there use and construction get better. Cuz after OWB they will come after the next wood burning appliance, then the next, etc.
ktm250rider
ArboristSite Operative
I havnt been able to see one yet. I like new technology. I got some information about a wood doctor Convertor and a SEQUOYAH E 3400. The response I got from the dealers is that they have none to look at since they are selling as fast as they can make them. I would love to look at one. Im not spending 10 grand on pictures from the internet.
Wasnt even aware Central boiler had a new model.
Wasnt even aware Central boiler had a new model.
I will not be changing boilers any time soon as mine has to pay for itself first.
I did get a $497 credit on my gas bill as a result of burning 8 cords .
that number is a bonus as I bought the boiler to heat a greenhouse and just added it to my home to see if i could save some cash.
So I am happy .
But in 5 years I may upgrade to a newer unit and that unit will be alot better than anything out right now as outdoor boilers are just getting to be mainstream .
I know they have been around for years and mainly used for people that have a limited availability to gas oil propane ect and acres of trees in there backyard.
I never cared about the gas bill untill the gas bill hit $2500 a year ...
now the gas bill is about $2000 a year and will be less as i can start adding things to the boiler.
this year we renovated our kitchen and installed floor heat along with alot of vapor barrier and insulation.
so again I am happy .
but back to the post .
here is a link to a local boiler companys new unit.
http://www.portageandmainboilers.com/
I am sure older designs will be cheap and on sale to make room for newer stuff.
I did get a $497 credit on my gas bill as a result of burning 8 cords .
that number is a bonus as I bought the boiler to heat a greenhouse and just added it to my home to see if i could save some cash.
So I am happy .
But in 5 years I may upgrade to a newer unit and that unit will be alot better than anything out right now as outdoor boilers are just getting to be mainstream .
I know they have been around for years and mainly used for people that have a limited availability to gas oil propane ect and acres of trees in there backyard.
I never cared about the gas bill untill the gas bill hit $2500 a year ...
now the gas bill is about $2000 a year and will be less as i can start adding things to the boiler.
this year we renovated our kitchen and installed floor heat along with alot of vapor barrier and insulation.
so again I am happy .
but back to the post .
here is a link to a local boiler companys new unit.
http://www.portageandmainboilers.com/
I am sure older designs will be cheap and on sale to make room for newer stuff.
ktm rider
ArboristSite Guru
$10,000 !!! WOW...
If a person lived in Wv, Md, Pa. or any other coal region, I don't understand why they would even want a wood boiler. I have an indoor ( in my garage) multifuel boiler that I burn about 10% wood and 90% coal in. The coal does not smoke at all once it starts to burn well, it burns hotter and even burns longer than wood. There also is no creosote to foul up your flue or become a fire hazard.
I heated my whole house which is 3,500 sq ft. last year that is sittng on top of a 3,000 ft mountain and windy as all get out. My total heating bill from october to around the end of april was only $250.
And the best part is that the Boiler I use is ASME stamped and cost $4,500. and I don't freeze my butt off standing outside in the elements to tend the fire..
But to each his own I guess.
If a person lived in Wv, Md, Pa. or any other coal region, I don't understand why they would even want a wood boiler. I have an indoor ( in my garage) multifuel boiler that I burn about 10% wood and 90% coal in. The coal does not smoke at all once it starts to burn well, it burns hotter and even burns longer than wood. There also is no creosote to foul up your flue or become a fire hazard.
I heated my whole house which is 3,500 sq ft. last year that is sittng on top of a 3,000 ft mountain and windy as all get out. My total heating bill from october to around the end of april was only $250.
And the best part is that the Boiler I use is ASME stamped and cost $4,500. and I don't freeze my butt off standing outside in the elements to tend the fire..
But to each his own I guess.
shawn.m
ArboristSite Operative
Sacramento county is about to ban wood stoves in the county across the board. Even if you have one installed already. The only caveat was a late challenge to the ruling from some homeowners who protested they had the new clean burning fireplaces. What should they get banned.
http://www.sacbee.com/302/story/403632.html
That said I had a neighbor in Sacramento who would burn any wood he could find on the street. The Foulest smell would emit from chimney as he brunt old redwood fences, posts, old doors, anything :angry2:
http://www.sacbee.com/302/story/403632.html
That said I had a neighbor in Sacramento who would burn any wood he could find on the street. The Foulest smell would emit from chimney as he brunt old redwood fences, posts, old doors, anything :angry2:
I feel sorrier for the folks that live next to some dirtbag that runs a smelly/smoky owb and have no holy board of supervisors to appeal it to.
I don't think government is what's giving owb's bad rap, I think it's uneducated and inconsiderate dirtbags that could care less about how their owb affects others.
rx7145
ArboristSite Guru
I'm glad I live out in BFE. My OWB can get smokey at times.....
my wood supplier put it like this .
I spent about 6 grand on my boiler and if i upgrade to a better unit and it uses 2/3rds the wood like they claim that is about 2 to 3 cords less at $75 a cord.
so $225 a year less wood.
so in 10 years i will burn about $2500 of xtra wood .
I will keep my boiler .
If i do any upgrade it will be moving to florida.
I spent about 6 grand on my boiler and if i upgrade to a better unit and it uses 2/3rds the wood like they claim that is about 2 to 3 cords less at $75 a cord.
so $225 a year less wood.
so in 10 years i will burn about $2500 of xtra wood .
I will keep my boiler .
If i do any upgrade it will be moving to florida.
with ya thereSimilar threads
