Newly planted red sunset maple problem

[treeseer]

It's still planted too deep.

As this from the orignial post would indicate: "I planted them each in a 6ft diameter hole about 3 feet in depth..."

Settling may be an issue here. Is Quad still with us?:monkey:

 

[Themadd1]

YOu have received alot of info so far but I have to stick my nose in and give a little advice.

Did you back fill with the same soil you took out for the initial hole? Or did you add new soil?

I would pull back all of the earth to uncover the first horizontal root coming from the trunk. On a tree this size the first horizontal root which would constitute the root flare will be at least one inch in diameter. Although with a tree this size it has probrably been burlapped for some time meaning that the roots are already girlding.

If this is the case call the nursery and ask that they come and examine the roots. If they say no, tell them to take the trees back and give you healthy trees that have not been balled until early fall. This way you know you will be getting trees without girdled roots.

Also, check out isa-arbor.com there is alot of useful information about how to maintain trees when they are planted. These trees are all planted too deep and right off the bat they will suffer from lack of nutrients and water.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

What does the time of digging have to do with whether or not nursery practices have covered the flare?
What needs to done at the time of planting, before digging the hole, is to open up the burlap and carefully remove the soil back to the root flare. I would do this before buying the tree. You will often find the flare half way down the ball. These trees should be rejected.

 

[Themadd1]

What does the time of digging have to do with whether or not nursery practices have covered the flare?

I am not sure if you were replying to my statement. What I said had to do with the trees being burlapped too long at nursery causing root bound/girlded tree roots. Nothing to do with covering the flare. :notrolls2:

 

[Quad]

tree stuff

I don't think settling is an issue. When I planted it I made sure the balls were about 8" above the soil line. I did mix in 8 cubic feet of "top soil" (from home depot) into the existing soil that was backfilled in. They are still about 8" above the soil line.

I followed everyone's advice and removed soil down to the flare. I removed about an inch of soil. I didn't see any 1 inch roots, but there were numerous roots about 1/16 of an inch.

I also did core drillings on the outskirsts of the holes to test for water. It was probably overwatering that has affected these trees. I am allowing them to dry out between waterings now. I've seen alot of healthy new roots growing into my test holes about 3 feet from the tree.

It still seems like some of the branches' leaves are continuing to turn red...seems to be localized towards the top of the tree. I'm hoping that it doesn't result in death of the branches.

 

[jrparbor04]

if the problem starts up top,,,most of the time means root problems,,,not getting the right nutrients from the roots to the top,,,,last place for the xylem to get there

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

I followed everyone's advice and removed soil down to the flare. I removed about an inch of soil. I didn't see any 1 inch roots, but there were numerous roots about 1/16 of an inch.

You are probably seeing adventitious roots that have sprouted off the trunk because soil was up against the bark.

My bet is it looks something like this:

What you do now is a tough call. I suggest you get the watering under control and wait for the tree to recover from that. Then, perhaps next year, do some more digging until you find the flare, not just some adventitious roots. Depending on the depth, and my guess is it will be deep, you may either dish out the soil to get the grade down to the proper level, or just dig up and replant the tree.

 

[Themadd1]

Quad, I do not want to negate what you are saying but I will say this. 1/16th in roots could be some newer roots growing out of the trunk because of the initial planting depth, not neccesarily from your planting but the planting at the nursery.

I have notice many people dig down until they see some fine roots but they are actually not finding the original root flare. You can see this in the following picture. There are new roots that grow onto the portion of the stem planted under the soil. The other photo shows how the leaves can brown/redden when planted too deep.

 

[Thillmaine]

Red Maple

Another thing to put into perspective is that red maple has a large LAI= leaf area index and can became sysnescent in hot locations. Lack of new roots therefore leading to lack of ablility to take up water leads to the reddening in the top (synescence). Red maples and even more so sugar maples are not well suited for spots with limits on their root system and in dry areas due to this tendency. (One reason that red maples make a poor street tree)
My guess is that many of the posts above are correct, about hte planting depth, typical nursery production...
Today I planted an arborvitae thats root flare was 6" below the top of the ball. And it was from hopewell (supposedly a premier nursery in NJ).
Finally my guesstimation is that your tree will regain its lost roots during the fall\winter and leaf out fine next year...Depending of course you did in fact find the rootflare.

 

[treeseer]

Today I planted an arborvitae thats root flare was 6" below the top of the ball. And it was from hopewell (supposedly a premier nursery in NJ). .

Today I spent 8 hours with a crew of 4 doing nothing but correcting defective roots. Sold the customer copies of ANSI and the BMP's. She was mad when she saw the difference between the standards and what the "premier" nurseries sold her. 2 of them will be out within days to excavate surplus soil and see for themselves the twisted roots we uncovered.

She will get credits and extended waranties and satisfaction or she is talking lawsuit. Hell hath no fury like a tree-loving woman sold crap.

Me I'm buying more copies to sell to highend clients who want to go to war with highend nurseries. This epidemic must end.

Quad, some pics would tell us what those little roots are all about. I was pruning em left and right today if they were in the way and it was 95 degrees, no worries.

"Most SGR’s were once small circling roots, innocent in appearance to most observers. If these roots are not straightened or cut in the nursery when trees are “stepped up”--transplanted into larger containers—this can result in a “multiple corkscrew” effect. The European nursery standards specify root pruning at every step, 4”-8” further out each time, to avoid these defects. The ANSI Z60 American nursery standards do not address this problem. The best way to expose and treat this condition is to wash off the nursery soil and correct the roots as you plant trees in the bareroot style. This process, called root washing, is growing in popularity with planters who are concerned with long-term tree health and stability. But even when roots are growing away from the stem, the tree is not yet out of the woods.

Root “balls”, the volume of soil packed inside a young tree’s packaging, have been getting rounder and rounder every year. Whether trees are grown in containers or dug from the field B&B (balled and burlapped), soil is commonly heaped around the trunk, where it does not belong. The trunk flare, where the trunk naturally turns into roots and the tree joins the earth, is all too often buried early in the growing process, and buried deeper yet at planting time. Some specifications still ignore the requirement in ANSI A300 (Part 6)-2005, 63.6.2.3, “The bottom of the trunk flare SHALL be at or above finished grade”. Instead, they instruct the landscape contractors to plant the root BALL at ground level, so the landscapers obediently follow this instruction, with disastrous consequences.

Arborists should have the ANSI standard—available from TCIA—in hand when they talk to growers and landscape architects and landscapers about deep planting. When these professionals see with their own eyes that the American Nursery and Landscape Association and the American Society of Landscape Architects are represented in ANSI, they will realize that they don’t have a stem to stand on when they bury trees. The entire green industry agrees that we should always be able to find the trunk flare.

Technically, the rootball does not even include the soil above the trunk flare. It is “measured from the bottom of the trunk flare to the bottom of the ball.” (ANSI A300 (Part 6)-2005, 63.6.1.2) If the flare is found and set to grade, in a hole “a minimum of 1.5 times the diameter of the root ball” (63.6.1.4), with mulch “applied near, but not touching the trunk” (63.6.2.9), the tree roots will not need to grow up in search of oxygen. But even if these standards are followed at planting time, the tree may not grow well. For some reason, there is nothing in the standard about the making sure the roots, at least the major roots, are growing away from the stem. Why not? You’ll have to ask your organization’s representative to the ANSI committee, and get your comments in before the standard is revised again in 2010. The ANSI pruning standard does not currently cover root pruning—perhaps with the right kind of input, that standard can change to provide needed guidance on this simple act of arboriculture."

3 cents, from page 8 here: http://www.tcia.org/PDFs/TCI_Mag_July_07.pdf

 

[osb_mail]

I think that nursery s should mark the planting depth in the nursery with paint this would solve most of this confusion .