Did a fairly large red oak today 39dbh. Everything had to be lowered and we used the porty. Everything when well but My question is what do you guys use to attach the porty to a tree this big. None of my slings were long enough to tie the cow hitch which we normally use.
port-a wrap
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kennertree
Addicted to ArboristSite
I use the longest sling i have on large trees and just tie a timber hitch.
treevet
Addicted to ArboristSite
3x40"= 120 inches= ten feet. Get a 14 footer and like Kenner apply the tried and true timber hitch w a safety at the end. All the fusspots will pooh pooh the timber hitch but in 38th year have never had one come out as they will claim.
rbtree
Addicted to ArboristSite
Ne meither..but I've only been at it for 32 years.
31 years ago, I was holding the rope for a climber and watched as his non backed up clove hitch rolled off and the couple hundred pound piece held just long enough to swing clear of the house and drop with no damage or injury.
Jim1NZ
ArboristSite Guru
On trees with a really large diameter i will use a timber hitch as opposed to a cow hitch as it requires less rope. Even with 5 raps evenly spread around the trunk, the timber hitch definitely uses less rope for the complete knot.
If there are other suitable solid anchor points not too far from the tree being worked on, use them.
If there are other suitable solid anchor points not too far from the tree being worked on, use them.
timber hitch
have never used the timber hitch due only to the fact that I've heard every one saying no to used it. But I guess with 32 and 38 years respectively I sure you guys have used it countless times. I'll give it a try on the next big one. Thanks for the input
have never used the timber hitch due only to the fact that I've heard every one saying no to used it. But I guess with 32 and 38 years respectively I sure you guys have used it countless times. I'll give it a try on the next big one. Thanks for the input
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
I've got 15+ years of comercial experiance and never had a timber hitch fail, either.
If I have a tree longer then my sling I use an old rigging line we use for a tag.
Once and a while we get willows where C=~18ft above the flair.
One thing with a timber hitch is to load it into the bight, so that it is self tightening.
If I have a tree longer then my sling I use an old rigging line we use for a tag.
Once and a while we get willows where C=~18ft above the flair.
One thing with a timber hitch is to load it into the bight, so that it is self tightening.
Climb020
ArboristSite Operative
Another nice thing about the timber hitch is that is retains a high % of its tensile compared to the cowhitch or even the bowline.
kennertree
Addicted to ArboristSite
I havent been using it as many years as some of these other guys, being im still a young fellow. I'm not saying you guys are old or anything either, but if tied correctly it wont fail. I've never had one to fail. The only time i use it though is to attatch a porty to a large tree when the whoopie is too short.
I love reading how you experienced guys do it. But do you have something against a Loopie?
I made one from 5/8 in tenex that will handle up to 45 in DBH. Used it with a Porty the other day, but usually use it to anchor my SRT rope. Easy to adjust, easy to set up, never have to tie a knot, and the wear point changes with every change in tree diameter.
I made one from 5/8 in tenex that will handle up to 45 in DBH. Used it with a Porty the other day, but usually use it to anchor my SRT rope. Easy to adjust, easy to set up, never have to tie a knot, and the wear point changes with every change in tree diameter.
Ax-man
Addicted to ArboristSite
Timber hitch and Clock Hitch fan here to, so much simplier and easier. Nothing against a Whoopie I have one but don't care for it that much, it is also made of Tennex, picks to easy and streches too much for my taste.
Larry
Larry
Blinky
ArboristSite Operative
Better lucky than good, eh? That's what I always say.
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
I'd rather be good, then when you need the luck...
The strech, or modulus of elasticity, is part of the SWL. I like it for being cheap and easie to work with. I can bake a big loopie in ~ 20 min with a coat-hanger, scissors and plyers. Maybe an apolstry needle to tack the back-splices using yarns cut out of the taper.
Those are about all I'll splice, since I do it so seldom.
AlpineJesus
ArboristSite Lurker
Timber hitches have been known to fail, I like to use a bowline or a loopie sling.....Thats just me though
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Just like a Clock hitch we use a Clove Hitch backed up by 3 half hitches. This allows me to rotate the POW around the base of the tree!!!
treevet
Addicted to ArboristSite
RAH, rotten and hollow tree limbs? Been meaning to ask. Backed up w 3 safties?
AlpineJesus
ArboristSite Lurker
just take the wraps around the tree...old school
i ordered custom whoopies that were long enough whe i first got my porty, when they werent use a bull rope with a running bowline around the tree i dont really use the eye splices that much for just that reason
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
I still do from time to time, or lace the rope through some branches. Friction in and on the tree can be better then setting up a brake. Especially with people who are unfamilliar with the devices.
When working with light loads, or large quantites, then block, brake and slings save time.
For using any of the Timber, Clove, Bowline, choke, Cow; i think it is best to come over the top of the Standing Part holding the Porty with the 1st wrap. Because this would most immediately lock against the projected direction of pull (up) for security.
This most secure, immediate grip also allows a more pointed, rather than flat teepee, giving less bend to the Standing Part for a stronger lacing.
If the spliced or bowlined etc. eye that holds the Porty is short; does not reach past the wrap(s) around Standing Part to Porty, then the full brunt of the forces and impacts can then be placed on the weakness of the splice/ knot as it comes from 2 legs of the eye supporting Porty to a single leg. If the eye is long, and the splice/ knot is beyond the wrap(s) around Standing Part/ eye; and the knot/eye comes around the mount/ host some; then the forces and impacts are borne on the 2 legs of the eye; and the weakness of the splice/ knot does not get the full loading.
Another point would be not to bend the stiffened part of the eye/ knot thru the wrap(s).
If we call the point that Porty pulls from 12 o'clock, the most secure place to make sure tail of Timber etc. is tucked is a convex position around 6 o'clock. For this pulls tightest into the trunk/ host/ mount as 12 o'clock pulls the most away from the trunk/mount. The actual position is 5 or 7 o'clock depending on hitch used i think; to get about the most pull into tree (maxxed at 6); and tail having to pull 'uphill' into greater tension of 6, and not downhill from 6 to fail/ release. As shown in Baby Holding a Bus - Part2.
The taper of the mount shouldn't be excessively in the direction of pull. If it is and is a removal, i'll cut mini humboldts to bed the line/ sling into; to lock into on loading, and not ride up taper. Lower mounts can make it easier/ faster take purchase with a 5:1 compression jig for pre-tightening the line(by getting more compression distance per pull before resetting grab on load line) for more immediate ballast to the load by line tension or even lifting.
i prefer Cow if enough line; with single overhand mule-ing and rest of tail 'twirled' under the line(s) around tree; for kinda of a Timber finish/ secondary lock. i think of a Timber as a loose eye splice of sorts, that forms a choke around the Standing Part to Porty/ other pull.
This most secure, immediate grip also allows a more pointed, rather than flat teepee, giving less bend to the Standing Part for a stronger lacing.
If the spliced or bowlined etc. eye that holds the Porty is short; does not reach past the wrap(s) around Standing Part to Porty, then the full brunt of the forces and impacts can then be placed on the weakness of the splice/ knot as it comes from 2 legs of the eye supporting Porty to a single leg. If the eye is long, and the splice/ knot is beyond the wrap(s) around Standing Part/ eye; and the knot/eye comes around the mount/ host some; then the forces and impacts are borne on the 2 legs of the eye; and the weakness of the splice/ knot does not get the full loading.
Another point would be not to bend the stiffened part of the eye/ knot thru the wrap(s).
If we call the point that Porty pulls from 12 o'clock, the most secure place to make sure tail of Timber etc. is tucked is a convex position around 6 o'clock. For this pulls tightest into the trunk/ host/ mount as 12 o'clock pulls the most away from the trunk/mount. The actual position is 5 or 7 o'clock depending on hitch used i think; to get about the most pull into tree (maxxed at 6); and tail having to pull 'uphill' into greater tension of 6, and not downhill from 6 to fail/ release. As shown in Baby Holding a Bus - Part2.
The taper of the mount shouldn't be excessively in the direction of pull. If it is and is a removal, i'll cut mini humboldts to bed the line/ sling into; to lock into on loading, and not ride up taper. Lower mounts can make it easier/ faster take purchase with a 5:1 compression jig for pre-tightening the line(by getting more compression distance per pull before resetting grab on load line) for more immediate ballast to the load by line tension or even lifting.
i prefer Cow if enough line; with single overhand mule-ing and rest of tail 'twirled' under the line(s) around tree; for kinda of a Timber finish/ secondary lock. i think of a Timber as a loose eye splice of sorts, that forms a choke around the Standing Part to Porty/ other pull.
