Ron660
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A few months ago they said before Christmas.
661 Oil Test 32:1 vs 40:1 vs 50:1 ?
- Thread starter redbull660
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windthrown
361 Junkie
Don't nock what I haven't tried? I actually have run TC-W3 and 'dual purpose' oils long ago in some saws and a blower that I no longer own. Same with running dyno and semi-synthetic oils that I have also tried. They gunked them up. I only use 100% synthetic JASO or ISO rated FC/FD oils now, and I get far better performance out of them in my 2-stroke saws, blowers and trimmers. My experience is that 100% stnthetic JASO/ISO FC/FD oils work far better than both the TC-W3 and dyno (and dyno-synthetic) blends. From a theoretical engineering perspective, there is no waiting for a verdict here and it is really quite simple.
TC-W3 is a low temperature application 2-stroke oil and is designed for using in lower revving and cooler running marine engines. The oil has to burn with the fuel mix at a lower operating temperature (below 300 deg. F.) and the oil residue has to be removed after combustion. For this reason ashless hydrazine based detergents are used in TC-W3 oils and they protect and leave no residue in low temperature marine engines. But problems develop when using ashless oils in higher temperature 2-stroke engines, and TC-W3 oils do not protect higher revving engines at higher running temperatures (upward of 400 deg. F.). For this reason low ash detergents were developed in JASO and ISO type oils to avoid the damage that resulted from using ashless TC-W3 type oils. Most low ash detergents are based on calcium and or magnesium that withstand the heat and turn to ash that is swept out after combustion. The net result is that they protect your air cooled chainsaw better than TC-W3 oils will. If you use ashless TC-W3 oil it will not meet the requirements to protect a chainsaw engine engine requiring JASO/ISO low ash type oil, and over time you will likely damage the saw engine running TC-W3 oil. For that reason no chainsaw manufacturer that I am aware of recommends any saw be run with TC-W3 oil. Actually most warn against using it.
But hey, there are guys here on AS that insist on using regular low octane ethanol E-10 gas, or high octane LL100 Avgas with lead in it in their saws. Also there are guys that insist on running only used motor and hydraulic oil for bar oil. If you want to go those or the TC-W3 routes, be my guest. But not in my saws, thankyouveddymuch. BTDT.
TC-W3 is a low temperature application 2-stroke oil and is designed for using in lower revving and cooler running marine engines. The oil has to burn with the fuel mix at a lower operating temperature (below 300 deg. F.) and the oil residue has to be removed after combustion. For this reason ashless hydrazine based detergents are used in TC-W3 oils and they protect and leave no residue in low temperature marine engines. But problems develop when using ashless oils in higher temperature 2-stroke engines, and TC-W3 oils do not protect higher revving engines at higher running temperatures (upward of 400 deg. F.). For this reason low ash detergents were developed in JASO and ISO type oils to avoid the damage that resulted from using ashless TC-W3 type oils. Most low ash detergents are based on calcium and or magnesium that withstand the heat and turn to ash that is swept out after combustion. The net result is that they protect your air cooled chainsaw better than TC-W3 oils will. If you use ashless TC-W3 oil it will not meet the requirements to protect a chainsaw engine engine requiring JASO/ISO low ash type oil, and over time you will likely damage the saw engine running TC-W3 oil. For that reason no chainsaw manufacturer that I am aware of recommends any saw be run with TC-W3 oil. Actually most warn against using it.
But hey, there are guys here on AS that insist on using regular low octane ethanol E-10 gas, or high octane LL100 Avgas with lead in it in their saws. Also there are guys that insist on running only used motor and hydraulic oil for bar oil. If you want to go those or the TC-W3 routes, be my guest. But not in my saws, thankyouveddymuch. BTDT.
While I agree with you 95% of the time, I don't think this has been "proven" here, only followed as a belief. There are many loggers who get many years of service from a chainsaw engine being run exclusively on tcw3 oil. I'm not saying it's recommended, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work well. I'd be willing to bet no one here, with enough experience to know for certain, has ever burned up a chainsaw engine because of running a tcw3 oil. Real world experience says quite the opposite. Evidence is not there to call them fools.
IME, non synthetic oils seem to preserve soft rubber replaceable parts and protect carb internals better than synthetics. Case in point: my 92 husky 51. Never had the cylinder cover off. Never a carb kit. Never a fuel or impulse hose replaced. It's had minimal use the last 10 years (20 hours a year), but to me, that's testament to my belief.
My 1995 stihl ts400 concrete saw had the same experience, although I did replace the fuel hose this past winter.
I've been trying some fd rated oils lately. They do seem to run cleaner (examining the exhaust port). And I'll continue to use them unless I'm replacing rubber parts next year. I use my saws daily or weekly and there's no way in hell I'm dumping out my mix after daily use. If I add up the hourly cost of me or employees dumping out fuel every time, replacing rubber parts because they're prematurely worn out, and all the apparent hassles of the AS crowd (that I've never experienced until coming here), them I'm going back to my cheap, and apparently highly effective, tcw3 oil.
Don't knock what you obviously haven't tried.
The ashless oils that have been discussed lately are of a new generation, specifically designed for air cooled engines, maybe they should be scrutinised in depth some more to see how they perform.
Thansk
Thansk
Gypo Logger
Timber Baron
What's wrong with used motor oil?
Yep. Thanks to Jon1212.
I may put the 28" Techlite on my newly acquired 288xp, and the 24" Sugi on my 7900...
redbull660
Addicted to ArboristSite
KG441c
Keith
Great lookin flow pattern. I loved the 661 I ran. If I found someone to trade a 661 for my MM461 Id probably trade
Moparmyway
Its just a saw
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Quad ports rule !!!!!!!!
Trx250r180
Saw polisher
Did you notice any difference in exhaust smell between the 3 brands ?
And you know this how? There has been nearly zero R&D into two cycle oils as they by and large are a dieing breed. There is no new wonder ashless additive that makes ashless oils work worth a damn in a air cooled saw. OEM's have went down the ashless route before and ending up going back to low ash oils...
Appears to be running a little fat, but not bad overall.
The same way you know stuff! Just with me its 30 years more recent! LOL . Mr stihl & mr ryobi are not in agreement with you on that one about ashless oils these days, I would tend to believe them rather than some one who hasn't even touched the stuff, or would know what R & D those companies have done to produce an new generation of ashless oil, ahh nostalgia! It isn't what it used to be!
Typical response from a moron..not that I didn't expect it.
And ashless chemistry isn't anything new... it's 30 year old tech. Low ash chemistry is state of the art as it pertains to aircooled two-cycle oils..
Remember 30 years ago, before the internet, when no one cared what oil you ran?
They still don't.
sunfish
Fish Head
Best post so far!
Trx250r180
Saw polisher
The Internet existed in the late 70's and probably earlier. 20 years ago the use net newsgroups were in full swing and oil was a point of contention back then.
Your projecting again, how about proving your hot air claims instead of coming across like a F wit, explain to us how & why the latest synthetic ashless oils produced by stihl & ryobi for air cooled 2t engines are defective & are going to be detrimental for the performance, operation & life of equipment it is used in. Especially against the independent reports coming back in of how good they are.
2 out of hundreds and your clinging to that? Like I said, you are a moron...
As for the reports. Look up redbulls pics of engines ran on ultra in this thread..
As for the reports. Look up redbulls pics of engines ran on ultra in this thread..
keep going you abusing & bulling people that don't agree with you or present a logical counter argument, it just reinforces who & what you really aren't much of, needing to resort to that kind of behaviour, it doesn't really bother me what someone wants to call me to get their jollies or because they have no social skills, just don't ever call me late for dinner.
So redbull has been using stihl ultra ashless that you never knew existed until a week or so ago, now where can this retrospective BS story go from here i wonder? just think of it, now he could think about engaging a ambulance chaser to pursue the manufacturer for fraudulent claims about a product that doesn't perform as claimed. Or you could attempt a class action if you had any buddies, which isn't very likely . LOL
