Anyone switch from old CB 5648 to gasification stove?

[Kevin in Ohio]

I have a stainless 5648 Central Boiler I put in 13 years ago. It is still working great but I know there will come a day when I'll have to switch. Yes, it does smoke and probably uses more than it should. I average 13 cord a year and heat a 36' x 50' 2 story farm house with full basement with a 36' x 50' attached garage with radiant floor heat, plus my domestic hot water.

My question is to anyone who has made this switch and what are the pros and cons? Meaning, maintenance, did the loading/burn times change. I do get quite a bit of black tar/cresote build up because of the choked burn currently. Wood is dry as it is stored on concrete, under roof for at least 5 years most times. I'm just looking for some real world experience and not the sales pitch from a dealer. I have the heatrac that I can monitor from inside the house. Is that still on them?

A visited someone who had just got one (hadn't run it yet) and the ash box was REAL small. Is it a daily thing?

Any experiences/info appreciated.

Mandatory pics!

 

[mysteryman896]

I have a CB E Classic 2300. Lots of ****** talk about the 2300 but it is all I know and I am still saving money over oil so I am happy. I have had it since 2008/2009 ( I forget at the moment) I am heating about 4500 sq ft 200 yr old farm house, and about 1800sq ft block detached garage with blown in insulation in the ceiling and insulated doors. DHW also.

I get the same creosote as you describe, similar wood usage ( probably a hair more) here in central PA. I actually have been thinking about the upgrade question lately too, not because mine is on the verge of being shot but you never know. I don't see me spending thousands to keep this one going once it starts to have issues. The 2300 has a bad enough rep that I probably will just upgrade. Have yo done any research on specific brands and models or just curious about gassers in general?

Every weekend I will clean out ash from the lower burn chamber and scoop most of the ash and stuff out of the firebox. I also run a brush through my heat exchange portions and bang off the turbulators. I also run a brush up my chimney quick about once a month.

I would love to hear from some people with the newer large models from CB and others on how theirs runs.

 

[Guswhit]

I talked with 2 guys in New York that had switched over to a PM optimizer. All they could say was they wished they had done it from the start. They both indicated that there was a learning curve as well. I have some contact info I could pm if you want.

 

[Kevin in Ohio]

I have a CB E Classic 2300. Lots of ****** talk about the 2300 but it is all I know and I am still saving money over oil so I am happy. I have had it since 2008/2009 ( I forget at the moment) I am heating about 4500 sq ft 200 yr old farm house, and about 1800sq ft block detached garage with blown in insulation in the ceiling and insulated doors. DHW also.

I get the same creosote as you describe, similar wood usage ( probably a hair more) here in central PA. I actually have been thinking about the upgrade question lately too, not because mine is on the verge of being shot but you never know. I don't see me spending thousands to keep this one going once it starts to have issues. The 2300 has a bad enough rep that I probably will just upgrade. Have yo done any research on specific brands and models or just curious about gassers in general?

Every weekend I will clean out ash from the lower burn chamber and scoop most of the ash and stuff out of the firebox. I also run a brush through my heat exchange portions and bang off the turbulators. I also run a brush up my chimney quick about once a month.

I would love to hear from some people with the newer large models from CB and others on how theirs runs.

I haven't looked into any of the other newer models. I'm happy enough with what I have but was wondering others experiences. I completely clean mine every year by getting in and getting all the tar off the floor and such. I stir it to a point during the season but it does build up as you know. Your stove may be the same one that Is saw. Has a little door on the side bottom with a few firebricks in it? On the back there is an access to diagonal tubes that run downward? I wasn't too keen on it from the looks of it and never got back with them on how it panned out.

i added water once in 13 years and adjusted the PH once and it's still okay at this years fire up. One warped damper door was replaced as a defect and wires on the controller needed to be tightened as the heattrac numbers were bouncing. Basically flawless for the most part and been very happy. I was very careful to only use copper, brass, stainless and poly on the plumbing. Only mild steel is the pumps. I tend not to pull ashes out as often as I should but at least every couple weeks. My CB dealer was great to work with but I was just planning if you will for what is out there now. Thanks for the input you guys and hope others will chime in.

 

[benp]

Kevin,

We got a CB Edge Classic 750 a couple weeks ago. Very pleased so far.

http://centralboiler.com/products/classic-edge/

Here are some of my experiences from another thread.

Have to buy new OWB. Hawken in bankruptcy

Have to buy new OWB. Hawken in bankruptcy

As you mentioned before about the small ash box.....it's a non issue.

I am going on 2 weeks since last cleaning and I may have 1/2" of ash in the reaction chamber. I have taken a total of 5 gallons out from the firebox since it's been installed. That was 4 full flat shovels.

It was by no means necessary I just did it to drop the coal bed level a bit.

You will drop your wood consumption from what you are currently experiencing. There is no way that you cannot based upon how a gasification system operates and you are burning seasoned wood. ( That part will be a non issue for you)

12 hour burns are no issue and I feel it will remain the same once it gets colder.

The firebox is a little taller but not as wide or deep as a friends 6048. When I have fed his stove while he was on vacation I could game 25hrs in subzero temps out of his. But he's only heating maybe 6000 square feet at most. And that ash/coal buildup...gah.

I did a full cleaning on it two weeks ago. Pretty simple to clean the heat exchangers and reaction chamber.

We have the wifi model. It is a FANTASTIC add on. You really learn alot about how the stove operates.

Ill add some screen shots later this morning of the dashboard and stove history later this morning.

I hope this helped.

 

[mysteryman896]

I haven't looked into any of the other newer models. I'm happy enough with what I have but was wondering others experiences. I completely clean mine every year by getting in and getting all the tar off the floor and such. I stir it to a point during the season but it does build up as you know. Your stove may be the same one that Is saw. Has a little door on the side bottom with a few firebricks in it? On the back there is an access to diagonal tubes that run downward? I wasn't too keen on it from the looks of it and never got back with them on how it panned out.

i added water once in 13 years and adjusted the PH once and it's still okay at this years fire up. One warped damper door was replaced as a defect and wires on the controller needed to be tightened as the heattrac numbers were bouncing. Basically flawless for the most part and been very happy. I was very careful to only use copper, brass, stainless and poly on the plumbing. Only mild steel is the pumps. I tend not to pull ashes out as often as I should but at least every couple weeks. My CB dealer was great to work with but I was just planning if you will for what is out there now. Thanks for the input you guys and hope others will chime in.

Yea, that is how mine is setup. It seems to work well if you keep after the ashes, and removing the ashed once a week is plenty. 15 minutes Saturday morning and I can have a decent clean out performed, so it is not real time consuming.

 

[benp]

Here are some shots of the central boiler app/monitoring program.

Here is the main dashboard. Your basic information.

Now this is the cool stuff. The stove history page. You can really learn a lot about your stoves operational characteristics here.

This was the Friday after the install. The big drop in the water temp we figure was attributed to an air pocket working itself loose.

If you have signal or wifi you can look at this anywhere.

There's a little more information when I look at it on the laptop. You can actually mouse over every spot and it tells you what it was doing at that moment.

I feel it's an awesome awesome tool.

 

[c5rulz]

Looks great Kevin,

Next time get a full load on the pickup.

 

[Kevin in Ohio]

Looks great Kevin,

Next time get a full load on the pickup.

Hopefully I'll be able to next year. Good thing I had everything in place for this years season all ready. I'm on line heat wise now and NICE!!!

 

[aokpops]

Switch last year , never done the OWB . Only used indoor wood furnace , almost cut the wood consumption in half .

 

[Mike Van]

Some sideboards on the pickup would stop all the wasted space on the edges of the load.....................just a thought

 

[panolo]

I just switched from pellets and corn to a CB 550. My first week burning and I really like it. Once you figure some of the little things out the stove is pretty easy. I'm basically burning ends and sticks right now and I maybe have a coffee can of ash after a week. If it would get colder I do believe my ash would be less because the reaction chamber temp would be able to stay in the 1200+ degree for longer than a few minutes and it would pulverize some of the smaller bits in the ash area. Really impressed with the efficiency so far. Burning junk and i'm going through very little wood.

 

[sam-tip]

The wifi monitor is a very useful tool for the learning curve. Understanding gasification is the hardest part to getting a better burn. Gasification has been around for a long time but still challenging and seems new. The first start or restart is smokey but once hot enough to start the process of making burnable gases it burns very clean. Then watching the wifi to know when to add more wood so the gasification process doesn't end and you have to start over with a new fire.

Also the type of wood you burn also make difference. Walnut does create more ash than silver maple.
You will still have your yearly deap cleaning. But not near as much scraping of creosote. The exhaust burns hot enough to burn up the gases that create the creosote.

 

[Kevin in Ohio]

The wifi monitor is a very useful tool for the learning curve. Understanding gasification is the hardest part to getting a better burn. Gasification has been around for a long time but still challenging and seems new. The first start or restart is smokey but once hot enough to start the process of making burnable gases it burns very clean. Then watching the wifi to know when to add more wood so the gasification process doesn't end and you have to start over with a new fire.

Also the type of wood you burn also make difference. Walnut does create more ash than silver maple.
You will still have your yearly deap cleaning. But not near as much scraping of creosote. The exhaust burns hot enough to burn up the gases that create the creosote.

Thanks form the insight. In the dead of winter how often do you have to reload with a 24 hour period? I know there is a lot of variables there but can it go for 9hrs say while I'm at work? Just wondering about being able to hit the sweet spots if you will.

 

[sam-tip]

If the temp is above 10 F twice a day. In the morning and in the evening. Above 40 during the day and 20's at night once per day. If bellow 0 to -20 I have had to fill at 7am 4 pm and 10 pm. But that is only on the coldest days. Only a few days per year filling three times. Normally twice. When on vacation I filled it and turned on the house propane furnace and still had fire 6 days later. Once the water temp goes below 150 the bypass valves kick in the prevents hot water from going to the buildings. Thus protecting the boiler from cooling down. They are just an auto thermostat. During the summer only a small fill every two to three days.

 

[Kevin in Ohio]

If the temp is above 10 F twice a day. In the morning and in the evening. Above 40 during the day and 20's at night once per day. If bellow 0 to -20 I have had to fill at 7am 4 pm and 10 pm. But that is only on the coldest days. Only a few days per year filling three times. Normally twice. When on vacation I filled it and turned on the house propane furnace and still had fire 6 days later. Once the water temp goes below 150 the bypass valves kick in the prevents hot water from going to the buildings. Thus protecting the boiler from cooling down. They are just an auto thermostat. During the summer only a small fill every two to three days.

Really appreciate the info. Makes me feel better about if I ever have to change. Mine smolders too much but it still amazes me how much water can get sucked up into the wood from the atmosphere. I burned some wood several years ago that was 10 years under roof on concrete with good sidewalls, it still sizzled some. When the snow starts melting in the spring it really increases the moisture level as the air is so wet. Thanks again for sharing.

 

[WoodTick007]

Your an intelligent man Kevin. What don't you just modify your current boiler? Do you truly believe your current boiler is at its lifes end? It's not like your burning old railroad ties or semi fulls of old tires. Just burn it. Its not like your gonna run out of dead ash in the next 20-30 years. . .lol

 

[Kevin in Ohio]

Your an intelligent man Kevin. What don't you just modify your current boiler? Do you truly believe your current boiler is at its lifes end? It's not like your burning old railroad ties or semi fulls of old tires. Just burn it. Its not like your gonna run out of dead ash in the next 20-30 years. . .lol

Just like to collect info and not be caught blindsided on what the "next" plan is. Lots of folks had their boilers rot from the inside out. others have had them develop never ending cracking issues. I guess I've been lucky but do take care of stuff.

Converting it? Don't know about that one. Stove looks fine at this point but I am getting down to under 100 cord under roof so I'm nervous.

 

[Johnny Yooper]

Kevin - when you upgrade, let me know the details, I have basically the same overall set up: 13 year old 5648 Classic (nonstainless though) in a 24x24 building, heats a 2000 sq. ft. house with in floor heat in basement, also heats 24x36 shop plus our domestic hot water; even the same damn color '89(?) GM K1500. Scary. Only repair on the 5648 so far has been a door solenoid. I'm hoping for ten more years, that's when the youngest of the slave laborers will most likely fly the coop, so by then maybe revert back to profane (God, did I really say that?) or not. Well, we still have the freestanding stove in the living room so it wouldn't be complete withdrawal.

 

[sam-tip]

I forgot about the possible fireballs when you open the door to load wood. The new boilers are air tight. A buildup of combustible gas can lead to a large combustion of gases when opening the door of a gasification boiler. Be sure to stand behind and away from the door when opening. They say this in their video of how to open the door but don't tell you how bad it is. The Mrs has a FR rated coat for loading the boiler. I have also had strong backdrafts causing the top of the stack pipe to blow off. Plus smoke blowing past the door seals. I was thinking the door was going to blow off. I allways check the wifi monitor so I don't open the door directly after a hot wood burn. The backdrafts are during the air cycle 30 to 60 min directly after a good burn.

The gasification boilers are not for use in a shed. If so it better be all metal and well vented.