carlton file-o-plate

[mtngun]

Yes, but I've heard these FOP's aren't for use on full skip chains. Any truth to this?

I believe you are correct. Full comp only. When you are filing rakers, the FOP indexes against the next cutter. That cutter would not be there on skip chain.

 

[Philbert]

I do not file all my cutter the same. I cannot see filing off all the good teeth because a couple of them hit a rock. As long as the raker is gauged to the tooth, it does not seem to matter that the teeth are all the same size as far as I can tell.

Below is an image from the Carlton website. Note that as you file the cutter back, the height of the cutter is lowered.

If your cutters are all different lengths, you chain will bounce more and you will feel more vibration. This may or may not be important to you, but you will get a smoother cut if your chains are ground/filed so that all of the cutters are the same angle, height, depth gauge height, etc.

I get the idea behind the File-O-Plate, but found it hard to hold, especially with gloves, and didn't want to have different File-O-Plates for different chains. Now I have a few file sizes, with a file holder for each, and a single depth gauge that fit a wide variety of chains.

If a chain that is ground back a ways does not cut well due to the standard depth gauge setting, I can always remove the gauge and take an extra stroke or 2 on each with the file to lower them a hair more.

I also had trouble with the Husqvarna/Jonsered version not fitting low kickback chain: don't know how this works with the File-O-Plate, or if you need a special model.

But if it works for you, that is what is important.


BTW - Carlton is now selling (NEW!) the same basic depth gauge tool as STIHL and Oregon. Do you think this is because they have the same parent company (Blount) as Oregon? http://www.sawchain.com/products/newproducts.asp

Philbert

 

[tdi-rick]

<snip>

BTW - Carlton is now selling (NEW!) the same basic depth gauge tool as STIHL and Oregon. Do you think this is because they have the same parent company (Blount) as Oregon? http://www.sawchain.com/products/newproducts.asp


Philbert

Yep, noticed that a little while back and thought the same thing.

 

[SawTroll]

I've used the File-O-Plates with excellent results on Oregon (LGX 3/8" and .404" plus 3/8"LP), Stihl (inc. 3/8" RSC), Windsor (semi chisel 3/8"and .404"), and of course Carlton chain. There isn't a big difference in cutter profiles between brands. There also isn't much difference if using the semi chisel File-O-Plate on full chisel either.
They really are a valuable little addition.

I think you are close to the truth regarding 3/8" chisel chain - but .325 is a totally different story - much more variance between chain designs there.......

 

[MCW]

Yes, but I've heard these FOP's aren't for use on full skip chains. Any truth to this?

I believe you are correct. Full comp only. When you are filing rakers, the FOP indexes against the next cutter. That cutter would not be there on skip chain.

That's correct to some extent but they can be used for skip chain and I have/do use them on skip quite a bit. You just index them off the depth guage and they'll line up roughly on the tie strap where a cutter would normally be on a standard chain. I also only use the FOP for depth guages, not sharpening.
Don't mind the broken File-O-Plate in the photo, they're brittle if you're not nice to them Still works though. This is Carlton 3/8" semi chisel skip (A3EP - 100R SKIP)

 

[SawTroll]

I've used the File-O-Plates with excellent results on Oregon (LGX 3/8" and .404" plus 3/8"LP), Stihl (inc. 3/8" RSC), Windsor (semi chisel 3/8"and .404"), and of course Carlton chain. There isn't a big difference in cutter profiles between brands. There also isn't much difference if using the semi chisel File-O-Plate on full chisel either.
They really are a valuable little addition.

Sure, but there are some variation - you really need to modify the blue-bodied Oregon LP etc roller guide, to really fit the Stihl RS/RM/RSC cutters (lots of posts on that here) - the raker guide of it works great as is though.

The Stihl cutters start out lower, and end up a tad higher, in 3/8" - so at least you need to deepen the front slots a bit, to make the guide fit. The guide also is based on a 25% top-plate angle - I just use "kentucky windage" to file close to 30%.

Anyway, I have more or less quit using guides when filing cutters, as it is more important to see exactly what you are doing - the exception is after hitting a hard object with a few teeth. If I rock out a complete chain, I just scrap it (has happened only once, that I can remember)....

According to the "agenda" I was accused of having a few days ago, the culprit sure was the Dolmar 5100S, not that I failed to notice the rock under the grass!!! :biggrinbounce2:

 

[MCW]

I think you are close to the truth regarding 3/8" chisel chain - but .325 is a totally different story - much more variance between chain designs there.......

Yeah you're probably right there Sawtroll. There is a bit around this area though on the small to mid sized Stihls/Huskys and I've been using the .325" File-O-Plate on Stihl and Windsor .325" (only semi chisel) with no issues.
3/8" standard and 3/8"LP the most popular sizes around here.

 

[SawTroll]

Yeah you're probably right there Sawtroll. There is a bit around this area though on the small to mid sized Stihls/Huskys and I've been using the .325" File-O-Plate on Stihl and Windsor .325" (only semi chisel) with no issues.
3/8" standard and 3/8"LP the most popular sizes around here.

I have 2 Windsor semi-chisel .325 .050, that I got from a dealer for free, to test.

I have used only one - and it started out having a cutter that wasn't ground at all - filing it to shape was really fast though - and the rest of the story just confirmed what that made me suspect - pure POS, soft as butter - cutters getting deformed from cutting planks and twigs with the 339xp.

They both are scrap metal candidates by now, one is never used :censored:

Back to the 95VP/H30! :greenchainsaw:

 

[MCW]

I have 2 Windsor semi-chisel .325 .050, that I got from a dealer for free, to test.
I have used only one - and it started out having a cutter that wasn't ground at all - filing it to shape was really fast though - and the rest of the story just confirmed what that made me suspect - pure POS, soft as butter - cutters getting deformed from cutting planks and twigs with the 339xp.

Funnily enough another dealer I know sold a 100' roll of Windsor .325" semi chisel to a firewood cutting guy (why he'd be using .325" as a dead hardwood firewood cutter I'll never know?) and this guy reckons it shat all over the Stihl chain he'd been using. Horror stories are available for all brands of chain and all brands of saws.
For example all the Stihl chain I've used has been absolute garbage in the conditions I've cut in, and its about 60% dearer than anything else.
I've used a lot of Windsor 3/8" semi chisel and .404" semi chisel side by side with Carlton and there's nothing in it. Its good chain and as good as anything on the market (in semi chisel at least) and cheaper in Australia too. In 3/8" semi chisel I've used and abused nearly all brands of 3/8" except Oregon. Stihl is at the bottom of the list for durability. I've used LGX against RSC and in my book the Oregon chain completely demolished the Stihl even though others on this forum think its the best chain going.
Horses for courses I suppose...

 

[SawTroll]

Funnily enough another dealer I know sold a 100' roll of Windsor .325" semi chisel to a firewood cutting guy (why he'd be using .325" as a dead hardwood firewood cutter I'll never know?) and this guy reckons it shat all over the Stihl chain he'd been using. Horror stories are available for all brands of chain and all brands of saws.
For example all the Stihl chain I've used has been absolute garbage in the conditions I've cut in, and its about 60% dearer than anything else.
I've used a lot of Windsor 3/8" semi chisel and .404" semi chisel side by side with Carlton and there's nothing in it. Its good chain and as good as anything on the market (in semi chisel at least) and cheaper in Australia too. In 3/8" semi chisel I've used and abused nearly all brands of 3/8" except Oregon. Stihl is at the bottom of the list for durability. I've used LGX against RSC and in my book the Oregon chain completely demolished the Stihl even though others on this forum think its the best chain going.
Horses for courses I suppose...

Your experience sure is "backwords" to most other ones on here!

For Starters, does your Stihl chain say "made in Switzerland" on the box or drum - if not, it is not the same Stihl chain that we usually discuss here......

 

[MCW]

Your experience sure is "backwords" to most other ones on here!
For Starters, does your Stihl chain say "made in Switzerland" on the box or drum - if not, it is not the same Stihl chain that we usually discuss here......

I agree that my experience does buck the US/European trend but certainly not the Australian trend. Only one person I know that spends a lot of time on saws cutting Aussie hardwood, in particular dead, dirty hardwood uses Stihl chain. He didn't want Carlton anymore because it was "too hard to file".
A lot of guys that bought their Stihl saws with Stihl chain assume that its the best chain on the planet because 1) It's branded Stihl who have a really good name and are well known, 2) They've read all the rave reviews about RSC (for example) on this site, and 3) They've never actually given a variety of chain brands a serious workout in a direct comparison (but maybe they have in their conditions?).
As I've mentioned before, the fact that the vast majority of guys on this site use solely full chisel suggests that they're not really cutting in conditions that I would consider are tough/abrasive on a chain. A lot of guys also sound like they touch up their chains before they're actually blunt (a good habit) so therefore never get a true representation of chain wear.
And yeah its Swiss made Stihl chain. If I was cutting green, clean wood everyday in high rainfall forests with grass around my feet maybe I'd like Stihl too? Unfortunately I'm too busy choking on dust, cleaning/swapping air filters, swapping chains, and fighting off blowflies
A while back I made a half/half loop of Carlton 3/8" semi chisel and Stihl 3/8" semi chisel (72DL, .063"). I've posted this before but in the exact same conditions the Stihl bluntened considerably faster and was visibly more damaged than the Carlton. You don't get much more of a direct comparison than two chains on the same loop at the same time. I'm not trying to bag Stihl, I generally like their gear, but in mine and other Aussie's experience it just doesn't hold up as well as the others in tough conditions.
It's not that Aussie's don't have access to Stihl chain, around every corner there is a dealer, but a lot of guys that do a lot of cutting won't use it - the fact that many Stihl dealers are a rip off doesn't help either though
Not trying to start an argument but I do tend to get a warm fuzzy feeling when someone on this site even acknowledges that there are other chains out there at least as good as, or better, than Stihl.

 

[sbhooper]

My experience is that Stihl chain is good, but not good enough to warrant the high price. I have used the Woodland and Carlton from Bailey's and they are as good in my opinion when you also figure the original price.

I have used the Fil-O-Plate on Stihl .325 and .375 and my chains cut just fine. Maybe I am not as picky or something.

 

[MCW]

My experience is that Stihl chain is good, but not good enough to warrant the high price. I have used the Woodland and Carlton from Bailey's and they are as good in my opinion when you also figure the original price.
I have used the Fil-O-Plate on Stihl .325 and .375 and my chains cut just fine. Maybe I am not as picky or something.

There's that warm fuzzy feeling. Rep heading your way. I've never had any problems using File-O-Plates across other brands of chain.

 

[Gizzard]

Lots of good input on the Carlton file-o-plate. I think I'll try one out.

MCW,
This year I got a few coworkers to try out WoodlandPro chain on their Stihl saws. After this, the only chain they've purchased is WoodlandPro.

SawTroll,
Good to see you post favorably in this thread and others sometimes for the 95VP,H30 chains. I prefer this chain on some saws I have and situations. After reading so many posts on here as to the only chain to have is chisel, I switched a few of my nk bar and chain combos to standard bar and chisel chain. This was a big disappointment, but I guess if nothing else I can add this to experience.

 

[MCW]

MCW,
This year I got a few coworkers to try out WoodlandPro chain on their Stihl saws. After this, the only chain they've purchased is WoodlandPro.

Good to hear mate. Thanks - we can't get Woodland Pro in Australia but by all accounts it's good stuff.

 

[tramp bushler]

Yes a file o plate works on full skip chain .......
Why do you guys use semi Chisel chain ?????
99% of the chain I use is chisel bit ..

 

[MCW]

Yes a file o plate works on full skip chain .......
Why do you guys use semi Chisel chain ?????
99% of the chain I use is chisel bit ..

Hi mate.
Guys that cut in pretty abrasive conditions tend to use semi chisel or even chipper chain. I've used full chisel and even square ground chain and it's cutting speed is impressive but the second you blunten that cutting point it effectively stops cutting. In dirty old Aussie hardwood full chisel is an absolute waste of time. Chipper chain is also highly underrated in my opinion. If you cut in shocking conditions or don't like sharpening chains Chipper is the way to go. If I even sense that a customer is going to abuse a chain or avoid filing at all costs I sell them chipper.
Full chisel can also give your saw a good workout if stretching bar lengths a bit, but if you swap back to semi chisel or even chipper you'll find the saw will cut a lot easier and won't bog as much - will also generally cut at a similar pace, even faster.
In clean conditions cutting green wood full chisel is generally the way to go however semi chisel's cutting speed isn't as far off the pace as some people may think. I have used a lot of semi chisel in green wood and also full chisel and to be honest I'd stick with semi chisel as it covers the odd tree where you may have mud/dust in the bark.
Hope that helps.
Matt.
P.S. If you want to feel really manly throwing big chips then stick with full chisel

 

[tramp bushler]

For the landing , I can see it , but for falling timber on the coast of Alaska , chisel filed or chisel ground chisel chain is pretty much mandatory ........ The trick is , don,t be sticking the bar in the dirt .................Tho you can get a tree to fall with round filed chisel chain . With the right chisel grind or file , and VERY FEW MEN CAN HAND FILE CHISEL CHAIN RIGHT ......... It makes all the difference in the world ........
. Tho I,ve snapped some chains running 2100s 2101 and 394 Huskies , and blown up some sprockets because I had the depth guages down 40 K or lower and had a little beak on the chain to help it feed in Red Cedar ,then putting the face in a hard Hemlock it would hang .......I had a 2101 that had so much snort , if it hung 3 times in the face of a tree the chain would rip in half ... That thing was a brute ............. 3120 is bad for ripping up chains .. but OH can they cut fast ...

 

[SawTroll]

......
Not trying to start an argument but I do tend to get a warm fuzzy feeling when someone on this site even acknowledges that there are other chains out there at least as good as, or better, than Stihl.

Well, I prefere Oregon 21LP to Stihl 25RSC in .325, after a direct comparison........:greenchainsaw:

 

[SawTroll]

Good to hear mate. Thanks - we can't get Woodland Pro in Australia but by all accounts it's good stuff.

It is Carlton, as far as I know. What I don't know is whether the chain models are specially designed, or if they just are renamed Carlton models.