City Trees and Customer Complaints

[treeseer]

you have been lucky ya might get served

clmbhigh, you asked questions and you got answers. Even though they may not have been the answers you wanted to hear, please do not stop asking them. We've all been told things we did not want to hear, but that's a good thing.
How else can we learn?
Why else are we here?


Canyon, when Teddy came to Madison a few years ago, some of us dressed in scuba gear to welcome him. The reaction of the crowd was surreal.:hmm3grin2orange:

Managing public trees is a public job. OTG, is your job made easier when the public reports genuine problems with trees?

 

[Canyon Angler]

Canyon, when Teddy came to Madison a few years ago, some of us dressed in scuba gear to welcome him. The reaction of the crowd was surreal.:hmm3grin2orange:

LOL, no doubt! I woulda liked to have seen that!

 

[OTG BOSTON]

To answer some of the legit questions generated by this thread.

When I discovered the first two trees I made phone calls to the co. and got no reply to my messages. I am extermely busy. For me to pursue stuff like this is way off the charts of the daily tasks I have to achieve. I was hoping a friendly "heads up" would correct the situation. I guess I learned the hard way that no good deed goes un punished.

About half of the Tree Work we do is through contracted services. Everything from pruning and removals to fertilizing, injections, you name it we do it. There are five guys who work for me. Union yes, though not the type of houligans described on this thread. We are tree guys.

If a private company wants to do work on a city tree at the request of a homeowner all they have to do is CALL. I will fax the correct permits to them the SAME DAY. All the legit companies in the area know this and do it.

One thing that I must point out is that we are responsible for street and park trees and it would be great if thats where the job ended but it isn't. About 80% of our emergencies are private trees that fall into the public way, or calls where the homeowner lied about the location of the tree in an attempt to get us to take care of it for free. It gets a little annoying when you get out of bed at 3am only to find out someone was trying to save a buck.

Hey Canyon please come to Boston and bring your piece, with that attitude you'll need it.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

To answer some of the legit questions generated by this thread.

When I discovered the first two trees I made phone calls to the co. and got no reply to my messages. I am extermely busy. For me to pursue stuff like this is way off the charts of the daily tasks I have to achieve. I was hoping a friendly "heads up" would correct the situation. I guess I learned the hard way that no good deed goes un punished.

About half of the Tree Work we do is through contracted services. Everything from pruning and removals to fertilizing, injections, you name it we do it. There are five guys who work for me. Union yes, though not the type of houligans described on this thread. We are tree guys.

If a private company wants to do work on a city tree at the request of a homeowner all they have to do is CALL. I will fax the correct permits to them the SAME DAY. All the legit companies in the area know this and do it.

One thing that I must point out is that we are responsible for street and park trees and it would be great if thats where the job ended but it isn't. About 80% of our emergencies are private trees that fall into the public way, or calls where the homeowner lied about the location of the tree in an attempt to get us to take care of it for free. It gets a little annoying when you get out of bed at 3am only to find out someone was trying to save a buck.

Hey Canyon please come to Boston and bring your piece, with that attitude you'll need it.

You ever felt like venturing away from the City and starting in commercial tree care?

 

[OTG BOSTON]

HA HA HA !!!! Thats where I came from! Climbed, Sprayed, Operated a Bucket, and sold work. Then I went back to College while doing my own jobs with my climbing gear and a pickup truck.

Sometimes I feel like going back when the BS gets too deep here, the stress can be overwhelming at times. When this happens I just leave the office and go climb a tree!

As far as leaving this City, not a chance. After all it is THE HUB OF THE UNIVERSE!

 

[Nickrosis]

After all it is THE HUB OF THE UNIVERSE!

I thought it was New York that has a nut in every car!

Enforcement would help in Milwaukee too.

 

[OTG BOSTON]

where did the author of this thread go? why no response to his own thread?

How about it??

 

[CLMB HIGH]

I thought this thread would stimulate some discussion..

So when I posted this thread there were some customer's I had to turn away because of the work load we are under and issues from the past. I look back through this thread and see alot of good points.

I really do understand the pressure involved in maintaining thousands of trees in neighborhoods, trying to balance the politics on each side of the cut it down or leave it debate, and the issues of funding from the government. I didnt mean this as an attack towards those involved in the government end of the tree care business. Which really we are all on the same side, we are trying to scratch out a living and provide a valuable service to those in our communities.

I am looking at this from the angle of how can we all work together to help our customer's, government and private business get the issues resolved in a timely manner. This is why I asked the questions? To get perspectives from all involved in this matter.

In regards to the story about the pesticides. Most companies in the tree care business do not have the time or man power to insert and remove caps from trees in the same week. I understand the importance of the laws regarding the pesticides in these caps. I am also very aware of the possible danger of using these caps in public areas. I am very vocal to my customer's how important it is to keep a close eye on the trees on their own property we inject and very rarely did I inject trees on the public right of ways.

The ethical dilema comes up when we in the industry know we have a sick tree, or a tree that is a potential hazard to personal property. I, in no way, feel that fly by night companies should have the authority to come through and cut down a city tree. The problem is as responsible stewards of urban environments customer will go elsewhere to get tree work done if they have to go through the red tape of getting our permission forms signed or getting put on the list to have the city do the work. By no means am I suggesting that the city is being lazy about their tree care. I am only suggesting that it is difficult for customer's to get responsible, quality tree work done on their city trees.

I gather all of this information as hearsay from customers and maybe they are the annoying complaining type that are constantly bothering the city to have work done on their trees in the first place. Trust me I understand how irritating certain customers can be while they are in the waiting list for tree work.

I guess my final thought is how can we as a private business work with the city to get tree care done for customer. Is there a middle ground we can start from to gather the neccesary information, share it, and then move forward with work on city trees if there are people willing to pay the premium for work and the city is willing to accept the help in acheiving the mutual end goal. Quality tree care in our communities.

 

[CLMB HIGH]

I do enjoy the sight of deadwood on trees in the parks, like Franklin Park. I do find it irritating, I also believe this comes under the realm of state contracts, to see so much deadwood on the parkways where cars and pedestrians are in constant danger of large falling limbs. If you ever drive down the VFW parkway, look up, and you will see the numerous large 20ft long limbs that are on the verge of collapse. Like the big dig, I would hate to see a motorist get injured because the limb fell on their car and caused damage to the occupants or the vehicles.

 

[moss]

If you ever drive down the VFW parkway, look up, and you will see the numerous large 20ft long limbs that are on the verge of collapse.

I won't drive down the Jamaicaway during a heavy snow or when the wind is cranking for the same reason. I think there is different tree care jurisdiction on these parkways. The confusing part is what agency is responsible for which trees in the city.

I'm happy to detect a concillatory tone in the thread, there's potential for reasonable discussion on city trees. Funny thing about message boards, people type words they would never say face-to-face. It's easy throw gasoline on a thread, takes more effort to be constructive.

 

[treeseer]

In regards to the story about the pesticides. Most companies in the tree care business do not have the time or man power to insert and remove caps from trees in the same week. I am very vocal to my customer's how important it is to keep a close eye on the trees on their own property we inject and very rarely did I inject trees on the public right of ways.

I don't inject, so I don't understand. on the mauget site it says in bold that Applicators SHALL NOT leave capsules unattended, but you do--because of time?--and tell your customers to stand guard over the trees so no one gets hurt. is that right?

responsible stewards of urban environments customer will go elsewhere to get tree work done if they have to go through the red tape of getting our permission forms signed... it is difficult for customer's to get responsible, quality tree work done on their city trees.

I gather all of this information as hearsay from customers and maybe they are the annoying complaining type

If it's hearsay, why state it as fact? One more case where the customer is NOT always right. :monkey:

OTG, how about this?

 

[alanarbor]

In regards to the story about the pesticides. Most companies in the tree care business do not have the time or man power to insert and remove caps from trees in the same week. I understand the importance of the laws regarding the pesticides in these caps. I am also very aware of the possible danger of using these caps in public areas. I am very vocal to my customer's how important it is to keep a close eye on the trees on their own property we inject and very rarely did I inject trees on the public right of ways.

That's a load if I ever heard one. I've been doing Mauget injections for a long time, and if done properly, the uptake should happen in no more than an hour. I have left capsules on private property over night, and pulled them next day. I sure would not do that in a public right of way! If companies can't dedicate the time and manpower to doing a pesticide application properly and safely, they should not be doing them.

 

[Ekka]

Over here the city is responsible for city trees and you just inform them what you want and they come out have a look a prescribe what has to be done.

And it's not always what the customer wants to hear either, like the tree stays and we aint topping it!

Leaving injections in for a week, not knowing the protocols, failing to return calls ... HACK ALERT!

Hey mummy, I found this lollypop stuck in a tree on the way home, tastes a little bitter though.

 

[OTG BOSTON]

I'm not even going to touch the mauget arguement anymore:bang: You know what they say about excuses.

All of our work is driven by constituent complaints (we don't call them customers). When they call they are told that it could take six months for the tree to be looked at and an additional six for the work to take place. Obviously if there is an immediate hazard situation, the work gets done as an emergency, right away. So basically if a maintenance call comes into this office it will be addressed within a year. I know this isn't exactly light speed but, it has become much faster over the past four years. As a disclaimer I will add that there are some that fall through the cracks because our tracking system isn't perfect but we do the best we can.

I'm not sure why politics and red tape keep coming up, they have nothing to do with trees. I've stated it here before and I guess I'll have to do it again. If a private tree company wants to do work on a City owner tree all they have to do is: CALL MY OFFICE AND I WILL FAX THE APPROPRIATE PAPERWORK TO THEM!!!!!!!! As long as they are a certified arborist, and they call, there are no problems. The biggest point of this for me is that I can track the work being done. Keep in mind that private companies are charging for a service that we do for free.

As far as your company "turning away customers" goes: I have heard from a few constituents who tell me that your co. tells them you won't even touch a city tree because it is too much of a hassle (I KNOW this is hearsay). Guess what happens when I tell them about the proper procedure? If I had to guess I'd say they call someone else (I never make suggestions, I tell them to look in the phone book). I could list all of the companies who have called me for permission in the past, but it would look like the tree care section of the Boston yellow pages.

As far as Franklin Park goes, there is a State road that runs through it, and ownership can be tricky to determine in areas like this (actually the whole Emerald Necklace). We have contracted with a Forest Manager who is doing an inventory of the entire necklace so I can more effectively spend money on the trees in the park. Working in an area designed by F.L. Olmstesd which was intended to be like a forest in the city can be tricky and planning is the first stage in restoration.

Lastly, thinking of City trees in an Arboricultural sense is great, but it is really Urban Forestry we are talking about here. The care of trees goes far beyond the individual.

If I haven't fully answered your questions please call me at 635-PARK, or post them here.

Gregory A. Mosman, MCA
Boston Parks and Recreation

 

[CLMB HIGH]

Well I do see the issues and concerns over the mauget thing so I concede I have to restate this issue. After discussing this with my Arborist I was wrong on the way it is done. My mistake.

I was also under the impression that my customer had to send our paperwork to the city. You are saying it is the company who must send the paperwork to the city, correct? See good things do come from long threads of this nature.

There is some frustration in these threads but I feel that the overall point is being misinterpreted. Trying to clear up things through discussion as has been done on this thread is my only intention. If people take it personally it was not the intent.

Like the last statement I made about Franklin park, I think in that type of setting deadwood should be left in the trees as long as there is not an imminent threat over pathways or roads.

I also stated that I believe it is the authority of the state to maintain the parkways? Including the VFW parkway?

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

That's a load if I ever heard one. I've been doing Mauget injections for a long time, and if done properly, the uptake should happen in no more than an hour. I have left capsules on private property over night, and pulled them next day. I sure would not do that in a public right of way! If companies can't dedicate the time and manpower to doing a pesticide application properly and safely, they should not be doing them.

< snip> he admitted he was wrong, I delelted my rant


Rant off.

Nick,
there is a lot of enforcement in MKE, they just go after the bigger companies more. Also the bulk of their activites deal with violations of Registry Notifcation policy.

Now there is a topic for another thread

Guy,
The evaluation was probono so no invasive eval was done. I climbed up a ladder and dropped a stone into the void. it did not look good.

The tree was on the courner 19th and Hampton in a small city strip. There was root damamge from sidewalk work, mowing and traffic striking the trunk. The canopy was showing decline enough for the L.O.L. to see it was dieing.

CoMF policy seems to be to manage decline in most cased.

IMO removal would be nessesary in the near term and the citizen was allready afriad of the tree. Risk of failure was elevated, target value was high, risk tolerance of "client" was low.

The "new" tree in the spot looks OK.

 

[OTG BOSTON]

Well I do see the issues and concerns over the mauget thing so I concede I have to restate this issue. After discussing this with my Arborist I was wrong on the way it is done. My mistake.

I was also under the impression that my customer had to send our paperwork to the city. You are saying it is the company who must send the paperwork to the city, correct? See good things do come from long threads of this nature.

There is some frustration in these threads but I feel that the overall point is being misinterpreted. Trying to clear up things through discussion as has been done on this thread is my only intention. If people take it personally it was not the intent.

Like the last statement I made about Franklin park, I think in that type of setting deadwood should be left in the trees as long as there is not an imminent threat over pathways or roads.

I also stated that I believe it is the authority of the state to maintain the parkways? Including the VFW parkway?

Maybe its me.....................Who ever said anything about you sending paperwork? lame-o excuse

Its funny to me....................... that I answered all of your questions despite your diatribe of BS regarding city trucks just sitting around, and poor tree care. You could have asked your questions without all the BS, but that actually was your intent, admit it.

I answered your questions on this thread but you wouldn't answer the ones I posed regarding your former employees accusations that he was in an unsafe workplace on another thread. Nice